Obersoldaten and stuff

Your right. The problem is that other like infantry don't get the same benefit of a free awesome weapon. Grens have to pay 60 for lmg. Infantry company has to pay 70. Airborne has to pay 120. Recon gets them free based on rng. Gaurds have to pay (I forgot the cost). Obers LMG is better than all these paid for LMG's. Airborne are 20mp away from the cost of obers and can die upon deployment. Recon has to pay 900 for 2 (1 is not an option). Gaurds aren't exactly cheap either, 80mp less? Obers come with a lot of perks.

I Just had a conscript squad pick up an Ober LMG34; i then proceeded to smash every squad in the game

I can read the stats, the guns are the best. If you want to show me a better standard rifle, please link. I'm a pretty reasonable guy. I don't have to play as OKW to read the numbers.

no your not and your bias is rotting the forum. no one is allowed to post of another faction unless they actually played it and thus know its strengths and weaknesses.

You can simply look at an units stats proclaim it to be op. You also need to take into account the unit selection ,economy and arrival of said units. All okw need to be superior because of the fuel and ammo penalties. second their unit selection for AI is pretty poor. having only the luchs light tank as another AI and the doctrinal ostwind this faction would lack the AI punch it needs. third the obers arrive at a time where you should be well on your way to build a sherman/t-34. and fourth while vg's are excellent meatshields when vetted (and before that they are the worst starting infantry in the game) they are just that: shields with no punching power while every single rifle and even conscripts can be upgraded. if they didnt have such potent AI squad they would be overrun by simple spam.

You can get Obers at 7 mins. All units should be counterable. OKW fuel penalty is fake.

no your not and your bias is rotting the forum. no one is allowed to post of another faction unless they actually played it and thus know its strengths and weaknesses.

Apply that to yourself and stop posting.

If a unit is overpowered, then it doesn't mean how much it costs and how late it arrives-its still overpowered.

Want example? JagdTiger.
Obers are JagdTiger of infantry.

Oh, and obers cost menpower only, menpower have no penalty, OKW gets as much as anyone else.
Tech costs are also no argument, because OKW have fastest and cheapest teching in game, so lower income is completely irrelevant here.

Units are superior by superior scaling, this is the factor that balances fuel/mun penalties.

Play the game as allies and definitely play more as OKW, because you have no slightest idea.

no your not and your bias is rotting the forum. no one is allowed to post of another faction unless they actually played it and thus know its strengths and weaknesses.

You can simply look at an units stats proclaim it to be op. You also need to take into account the unit selection ,economy and arrival of said units. All okw need to be superior because of the fuel and ammo penalties. second their unit selection for AI is pretty poor. having only the luchs light tank as another AI and the doctrinal ostwind this faction would lack the AI punch it needs. third the obers arrive at a time where you should be well on your way to build a sherman/t-34. and fourth while vg's are excellent meatshields when vetted (and before that they are the worst starting infantry in the game) they are just that: shields with no punching power while every single rifle and even conscripts can be upgraded. if they didnt have such potent AI squad they would be overrun by simple spam.

On account of the whole OKW units need to be superior because they have ammo and fuel penalties, I can tell you right now that this is balanced by the fact that all OKW units can get vet 5. The idea of the fuel income reduction is to force players to be conservative with their units. On top of this, there is no such whing as an OKW manpower income penalty. This means that OKW will always have the same base manpower income as other forces.

OKW also has the most efficient tech tree of all the factions. You start with enough fuel to build either a repair depot or a healing/ forward retreat point. After this, you need to merely save up 80 fuel if you want to fast tech to move up to T4, where you can buy obers. On top of the obviously superior OKW tech buildings, you also get access to 1 Anti-Vehicle vehicle, one anti-infantry unit, and one extra unit in each building. THis allows you to not be punished for your tech choice as easily, due to your always-present access to counters to an enemy push. This is in stark contrast to the soviets, for example, who will be utterly screwed without guards if they go T1 vs. a vehicle rush or T3 without AT vs. Tigers.

Taking these facts into account, I cannot see why you would expect OKW infantry to be better that other factions' infantry at vet 0. All infantry should be balanced in different ways, there should be no unit that is exceedingly more efficient than another unit. Expecting obers to be the best infantry in the game at vet 4 is fair. I agree with that, but there should be some reward for making sure the OKW player cannot vet up his infantry properly. As it stands, using a vet0 ober squad, you can counter any other infantry unit in the game next to shocks (which are beat with micro) and upgraded paras (which are beat with the vet 1 grenade if vs. thompsons or with cover if vs. lmgs).

OKW has plenty of bonuses to cover for the reduced income, you should never have a faction that gets OP units because of ome other gimmick that only effects vehicles.

Your right. The problem is that other like infantry don't get the same benefit of a free awesome weapon. Grens have to pay 60 for lmg. Infantry company has to pay 70. Airborne has to pay 120. Recon gets them free based on rng. Gaurds have to pay (I forgot the cost). Obers LMG is better than all these paid for LMG's. Airborne are 20mp away from the cost of obers and can die upon deployment. Recon has to pay 900 for 2 (1 is not an option). Gaurds aren't exactly cheap either, 80mp less? Obers come with a lot of perks.

While thats true, in a game with asymetrical balance (Tm) such as Coh all the units in question are tied into fundamentally different tech structures and fulfill roles that are not exactly analogous. In the case of OKW for example, their basic infantry (Volks) are the weakest mainline infantry unit early on, but actually gain comparative utility through their scalability (5 Vet levels) and their Schreck - unlike for example conscripts whose relative utility rather diminuishes as the game goes on. In other words, looking at the unit in isolation won't yield anything meaningful. Dont get me wrong, but just play OKW a couple of times, and try doing it wihtout Obers, and I reckon you'll see why they have to be as strong as they are.

This forum... sums up where the U.S. is going ( yes into the ground)

It never made sense to me that Obsers, who are supposed to be long term veterans, would have more veterancy available to them in the game than fresh Soviet or American troops.

Theoretically, Obers should start tough, but have no additional scaling from vet.

Dont get me wrong, but just play OKW a couple of times, and try doing it wihtout Obers, and I reckon you'll see why they have to be as strong as they are.

I've played OKW plenty, and there is absolutely no reason why they should be as strong as they are. In fact, I've won many games where I haven't even built them.


Try again.

On account of the whole OKW units need to be superior because they have ammo and fuel penalties, I can tell you right now that this is balanced by the fact that all OKW units can get vet 5. The idea of the fuel income reduction is to force players to be conservative with their units. On top of this, there is no such whing as an OKW manpower income penalty. This means that OKW will always have the same base manpower income as other forces.

Bollocks. Veterancy is not an automatic given most okw units dont even see veterancy 3 let alone 4 or 5. the only one that vets up like crazy is volks with shrek and if their plenty of tanks nearby. even then its needed for the volks because volks veterancy 1 2 and 3 are significantly inferior to other baseline infantry

OKW also has the most efficient tech tree of all the factions. You start with enough fuel to build either a repair depot or a healing/ forward retreat point. After this, you need to merely save up 80 fuel if you want to fast tech to move up to T4, where you can buy obers. On top of the obviously superior OKW tech buildings, you also get access to 1 Anti-Vehicle vehicle, one anti-infantry unit, and one extra unit in each building. THis allows you to not be punished for your tech choice as easily, due to your always-present access to counters to an enemy push. This is in stark contrast to the soviets, for example, who will be utterly screwed without guards if they go T1 vs. a vehicle rush or T3 without AT vs. Tigers.

Bollocks. if you take in account the fuel penalty the okw is about as fast in teching as the soviets. and comparing them to the soviets is also bollocks because the entire faction is based around call-ins to coverup a weakness. dont like it either talk to relic about it. usf on the other hand is just as balanced as the okw/ost.

As it stands, using a vet0 ober squad, you can counter any other infantry unit in the game next to shocks (which are beat with micro) and upgraded paras (which are beat with the vet 1 grenade if vs. thompsons or with cover if vs. lmgs)..

What micro are you referring to? you cannot kite with lmgs unless you have some kind of sprint ability. Also micro? every time i hear that word i got the feeling some people here are suffering some horrifying disease that doesn't allow them use their hands and arms correctly. their is no micro involved just good judgement and anticipation. depending on the map either the shocks or obers are more useful but the fact stands that shocks have just as much impact as obers. in fact their was good reason why obers got changed from cp 1 to 2. their is no excuse for a ostheer player to be not prepared for shocks and the same goes soviets and us for obers.

I've played OKW plenty, and there is absolutely no reason why they should be as strong as they are. In fact, I've won many games where I haven't even built them.


Try again.

Uhhhh, edgy. Dude, I wasnt even talking to you. Nonetheless, the quality of your opposition must have been a tad underwhelming, but whatever.

some people are denser than a rock. okw is full of elites, the only reasons why they arent used because of this non doctrinal mother of all infantry, obers. okw is perfectly fine on their own, without obers and still have strategies to deal with infantry.

flak track has been buffed to awesome levels, instant suppression and a hell load of damage at barely 5-7mins. claiming that okw without obers will lose is really just an uneducated guess, seems like you havent been playing enough okw.

i think this is getting no where, the only way for them to understand is to make them feel the pain.

Bollocks. Veterancy is not an automatic given most okw units dont even see veterancy 3 let alone 4 or 5. the only one that vets up like crazy is volks with shrek and if their plenty of tanks nearby. even then its needed for the volks because volks veterancy 1 2 and 3 are significantly inferior to other baseline infantry

Bollocks. if you take in account the fuel penalty the okw is about as fast in teching as the soviets. and comparing them to the soviets is also bollocks because the entire faction is based around call-ins to coverup a weakness. dont like it either talk to relic about it. usf on the other hand is just as balanced as the okw/ost.

What micro are you referring to? you cannot kite with lmgs unless you have some kind of sprint ability. Also micro? every time i hear that word i got the feeling some people here are suffering some horrifying disease that doesn't allow them use their hands and arms correctly. their is no micro involved just good judgement and anticipation. depending on the map either the shocks or obers are more useful but the fact stands that shocks have just as much impact as obers. in fact their was good reason why obers got changed from cp 1 to 2. their is no excuse for a ostheer player to be not prepared for shocks and the same goes soviets and us for obers.

this is so full of shit, i have no idea where to begin. if you cant get vet3-4 with obers i suggest learning when to a move, dodge nades and pray to the rng god so mortar shells wont land on you. apart from that, obers can get to vet3 easily and usually the real reason why obers arent getting to vet 4 onwards are not because they are weak, because there's no more infantry for them to kill and the other team has already conceded.

i have no numbers to back me on the 2nd point so i shant comment.

3rd point, micro also refers to focus firing. shocks at range are useless and sniped down easily by obers and supporting fire from volks and sturmpios. considering that the other infantry in the soviet army dont do any damage at range, its simple to prioritize on shocks. infantry running at the same speed also means shocks can never get into close range if you moving back the squad they are targetting and let supporting infantry take shots at shocks. it is that simple. i have no idea why you dont understand just that.

or maybe thats why obers are a 'okay' in ur hands, i guess its totally l2p for you.

this is so full of shit, i have no idea where to begin. if you cant get vet3-4 with obers i suggest learning when to a move, dodge nades and pray to the rng god so mortar shells wont land on you. apart from that, obers can get to vet3 easily and usually the real reason why obers arent getting to vet 4 onwards are not because they are weak, because there's no more infantry for them to kill and the other team has already conceded.

I dont says its impossible but already won the game if they reach level 4/5 . at least in 1vs 1. depending on what they are fighting obers need to something between 4000 to 5000 damage. now take in account that every single infantry unit has 80 man and your looking at 45-55 kills per ober. if they reach vet 5 your winning by a landslide already.

3rd point, micro also refers to focus firing. shocks at range are useless and sniped down easily by obers and supporting fire from volks and sturmpios. considering that the other infantry in the soviet army dont do any damage at range, its simple to prioritize on shocks. infantry running at the same speed also means shocks can never get into close range if you moving back the squad they are targetting and let supporting infantry take shots at shocks. it is that simple. i have no idea why you dont understand just that.

this is a nice summary between skill levels and shows you are nowhere near my level. 1 my shocks will never ever run into a straight line to enemy infantry that is a noob mistake 2. if wish to ad shit to it fine i will ad the kv8 and this clearly proves shocks are op because the kv8 is roasting your infantry. at least thats your retarded logic. 3.if a shocks is pursuing an infantry squad where is the rest of the soviet infantry? or do you indeed have a horrifying disease that prevents you from a moving all your infantry. 4.i dont let shocks fight hopeless battles and what you described is a hopeless battle.

this is a nice summary between skill levels and shows you are nowhere near my level.

Now i'm curious. Do we have any chance of having a replay of yours ?

Now i'm curious. Do we have any chance of having a replay of yours ?

or playercard? seems like Jaigen called him out, and it is customary on this forum to reveal your playercard when calling someone out.

Now i'm curious. Do we have any chance of having a replay of yours ?

perhaps in 8 days when AA comes out. until then nope because all relevant replays are gone and im busy with other stuff.

or playercard? seems like Jaigen called him out, and it is customary on this forum to reveal your playercard when calling someone out.

As i said before i dont deal with e-peen and as i said before my playercard is unreliable as multiple persons use my account.

OMG people who are you arguing with ? JAIGEN ??? I'd say they were both created in secret Nazi laboratory, Jaigen and Lolcake

multiple persons use my account... that's actually good. i might store that for my own use in the future.

Jaigen nobody take you seriously. Pls grow up and pls do not take us for idiots.