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russian armor

OKW has too much Ammo

23 Sep 2014, 00:52 AM
#21
avatar of Sierra

Posts: 432

A big problem with OKW's faction design is that they have literally ONE munitions sink in the early and mid game: PANZERSHREKS

In the late game you have doctrinal artillery that serve as ammo sinks. With increased muni rate, OKW was able to more often use abilities such as grenades, and plant mines etc. The Shrek blob was still a problem because there was literally no other munition sink.

To fix OKW you need to not lower the munitions rate, because all that does is prevent OKW players from using grenades and mines to save for shreks. Instead you need to provide OKW players with different munitions sinks.

Maybe make the Retreat Point upgrade cost 100 munitions instead of manpower, force Obers to UPGRADE to the lmg34, Falls to upgrade to their fg42, additional pioneers at the mech truck require a munitions upgrade, etc etc.



The Shocktroops should only be outfitted with Mosin Nagants and be forced to upgrade to PPSh's, and forced to upgrade to smoke grenades. It's only fair right?
23 Sep 2014, 01:02 AM
#22
avatar of gman1211

Posts: 133

Yes, I do consider it good. It penetrates armour regularly, does decent damage, and its especially good when you consider what everyone else gets.
23 Sep 2014, 01:18 AM
#23
avatar of LemonJuice

Posts: 1144 | Subs: 7

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Sep 2014, 00:52 AMSierra



The Shocktroops should only be outfitted with Mosin Nagants and be forced to upgrade to PPSh's, and forced to upgrade to smoke grenades. It's only fair right?


there needs to be some sort of penalty if a player decides to dump all their munitions into shreks, and that penalty should be that you suffer in other firepower departments.
23 Sep 2014, 02:17 AM
#24
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Sep 2014, 00:52 AMSierra



The Shocktroops should only be outfitted with Mosin Nagants and be forced to upgrade to PPSh's, and forced to upgrade to smoke grenades. It's only fair right?


Where do i sign? So i can deploy them at 300mp and then upgrade them for 60muni. I don't think you want OLD shocktroops which vet a lot faster and are cheaper to reinforce.
23 Sep 2014, 02:35 AM
#25
avatar of FestiveLongJohns
Patrion 15

Posts: 1157 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Sep 2014, 00:42 AMPorygon


You count Volks screck are good? They are just supporting AT weapon (with 90 expensive cost), you still need Raketen or other specialist AT unit to kill.
OKW have no good vehicle ensnare (except Falls faust and mines) (Fusis nade is still buggy as hell), if you are not asleep, you won't lose tanks to Volks screck.


Volks are the best baseline anti tank infantry in the game no questions asked.
23 Sep 2014, 03:58 AM
#26
avatar of frostbite

Posts: 593

i thought of an interesting idea. what if every okw truck gave them more munitions. like first building 33% 2nd 66% then last 100%
23 Sep 2014, 04:10 AM
#27
avatar of AchtAchter

Posts: 1604 | Subs: 3

Reading the topics here recently makes one think that it's impossible to lose with OKW.

Some commander abilities might need an adjustment, like the recon flare, but decrease the Ammunition and you bring more boredom into a interesting faction.
Some abilities you would simply never use, I can't remember even use one time Zeroing Artillery when OKW had a 66 % muni income.
23 Sep 2014, 04:12 AM
#28
avatar of lanciano

Posts: 210

i thought of an interesting idea. what if every okw truck gave them more munitions. like first building 33% 2nd 66% then last 100%


Good idea
23 Sep 2014, 05:10 AM
#29
avatar of QueenRatchet123

Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2

Permanently Banned
OKW have free munitions. very cheap upgrades, and elite infrantry that spawn with lmg's

they should have to pay for lmg's LIKE EVERYBODY ELSE
23 Sep 2014, 05:33 AM
#30
avatar of JohnnyB

Posts: 2396 | Subs: 1

Yep, reduce their amo income. And GIVE BACK the former Wurframen, former raketenwerfer, former sturmpios, former obersoldaten, former JLI, former sdkfz AA. Totally agreed.

Or while thinking at OKW your brains are scraming just nurf nurf nurf, without any thought about balance? Cause it seems there are some OKW haters around here.... making from OKW their primary target.
23 Sep 2014, 05:34 AM
#31
avatar of Romeo
Honorary Member Badge
Benefactor 115

Posts: 1970 | Subs: 5

i thought of an interesting idea. what if every okw truck gave them more munitions. like first building 33% 2nd 66% then last 100%


No... original problem was that shreck comes too late. Problem now is that okw has too much late games munitions for spam some doctrinal off-maps. So really this will just amplify that problem a lot. Take forever to get first shreck, then late game right back to square one. If anything it would make more sense for 100% munis at start, then less after every truck, but I definitely think the game should never penalize you for tech up.
23 Sep 2014, 05:58 AM
#32
avatar of MarcoRossolini

Posts: 1042

I mightn't like OKW but I've been okay with its Muni income, however as I don't have as much experience with the factions as others I don't feel I can vote reasonably.
23 Sep 2014, 06:08 AM
#33
avatar of Hitman5

Posts: 467

jump backJump back to quoted post22 Sep 2014, 23:46 PMPorygon
If you are in the alpha, you will know OKW with 66% muni income is bullshit. (even after first buff)
because with the fuel struggle, you can only have 33% muni which is close to nothing.

Sturmpio can never mine, they even struggle to piss out a sweeper, Volks can only getting screcks and never able to spare a nade, not even talk about Falls and Ober special ability and their nades.

Now with conversion OKW can choose 50% muni, 100% muni, or sac fuel for insane amount of muni, which is great for strategical design, you can finally able to choose options, but not sac a hell lot of mines or nades opportunity for a sweeper or stupid screck.


Seriously, WTF with these forum posters, "BECAUSE BY DESIGN", this is NOT a FREAKING valid argument.


a reasonable post amongst an ocean of trash
23 Sep 2014, 06:53 AM
#34
avatar of Sierra

Posts: 432

Reading the topics here recently makes one think that it's impossible to lose with OKW.

Some commander abilities might need an adjustment, like the recon flare, but decrease the Ammunition and you bring more boredom into a interesting faction.
Some abilities you would simply never use, I can't remember even use one time Zeroing Artillery when OKW had a 66 % muni income.



That ability alone costs 300 friggen munitions.

The Luftwaffe air drop, that's 250 munitions for what essentially comes down to a single Fallschirmjaeger squad that can only be dropped on a hostile position.

The Scavenge Doctrine 105mm barrage, that consumes a massive amount of munitions even after it's be activated!


Panzershreks cost 90 munitions each, 85 if you have the 5% off bulletin. What people are essentially asking for is a global nerf to solve what is basically a non issue. If an OKW player invests into 4-5 squads of Volksgrens with Panzershreks.

Try an anti-infantry solution, because the OKW player will be lacking in a lot of areas with such a heavy manpower and munitions investment. Not to mention his Pop-Cap will be eaten up, leaving little room for vehicles and elite infantry.

Try just using Soviet famous anti-infantry solutions, they have TONS of them. Shocktroops being some of the most lethal!
23 Sep 2014, 07:31 AM
#35
avatar of JohnnyB

Posts: 2396 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Sep 2014, 06:53 AMSierra



Panzershreks cost 90 munitions each, 85 if you have the 5% off bulletin. What people are essentially asking for is a global nerf to solve what is basically a non issue. If an OKW player invests into 4-5 squads of Volksgrens with Panzershreks.



Oh, that bulletin :). Never got it.
But, anyways, I don't get Relic math: Pzgrens are getting 2 schrecks for 120 amo and volks are getting one schreck for 90 amo.

Now some people will say: exactly!! Make Pzgrens schrecks cost 180 amo! :lolol:
23 Sep 2014, 07:57 AM
#36
avatar of QueenRatchet123

Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2

Permanently Banned
jump backJump back to quoted post23 Sep 2014, 05:33 AMJohnnyB
Yep, reduce their amo income. And GIVE BACK the former Wurframen, former raketenwerfer, former sturmpios, former obersoldaten, former JLI, former sdkfz AA. Totally agreed.

Or while thinking at OKW your brains are scraming just nurf nurf nurf, without any thought about balance? Cause it seems there are some OKW haters around here.... making from OKW their primary target.



OKW can keep thier ammo income. but make mg's on tanks cost the same for every faction.

Make obers and falls have to pay for thier lmg's Flare arty and other offmaps need to be adjusted as well.

But u cant possibly defend the fact that okw can field obers, and falls without having to pay for thier lmg's.

I cant wait to see the day when a player must pay 120 munitions to get the lmg's for thier instant spawning falls. (im being generous with this price, due to the fact that they get 4)
23 Sep 2014, 08:15 AM
#37
avatar of Australian Magic

Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2

I have a strange feeling that guys who are defending 100% ammo income (which is against OKW desgin) are the same people who keep saying that USF should not get Pershing cause it's agasint faction design..

Obers and Falls without upgrade are like Paratroopers already equipped with LMGs yet USF need to pay for it.
23 Sep 2014, 08:31 AM
#38
avatar of QueenRatchet123

Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2

Permanently Banned
I have a strange feeling that guys who are defending 100% ammo income (which is against OKW desgin) are the same people who keep saying that USF should not get Pershing cause it's agasint faction design..

Obers and Falls without upgrade are like Paratroopers already equipped with LMGs yet USF need to pay for it.


SHHH.. Logic has no effect here...

23 Sep 2014, 08:47 AM
#39
avatar of JohnnyB

Posts: 2396 | Subs: 1

I have a strange feeling that guys who are defending 100% ammo income (which is against OKW desgin) are the same people who keep saying that USF should not get Pershing cause it's agasint faction design..

Obers and Falls without upgrade are like Paratroopers already equipped with LMGs yet USF need to pay for it.


LOL, verry wrong. You assume that some players lost their reason just because they like OKW. I can search for my posts related to Pershing and post them here to prove you that I have nothing against USF getting the Pershing and even non-doctrinal too.
Related to paying for LMGs or such I disagree though. Remember in most of the games OKW needs to trade amo for fuel and, in addition, cannot build caches and augment their amo income, like all other factions can.
23 Sep 2014, 09:14 AM
#40
avatar of GustavGans

Posts: 747

OKW ammo income is fine. What exactly makes you think otherwise?
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