Panther overnerfed

As the title suggests, I think the vehicle is total crap.

The current (2v2) meta seems to be massing medium tanks (T-34/76, T-34/85 and Shermans) as Russians and then lolrush them at the enemy. In previous patches the Panther could handle armor, but nowadays German armor simply gets overrun.

The nerfs to the Panther plus the buffs to Russian armor was too much.

Over the patches the Panther go nerfed and nerfed

- cost increase
- less health until vet 2
- blitz nerf (useless)
- less additional armor on vet 2

and Russian tanks got buffed

- damage increase of the T-34/76
- penetration and armor increase on the T-34/76
- Su-85 got slightly more speed again
etc.

The only thing the Panther got was a penetration increase - which might be a buff but in most cases doesn´t change a thing. It could penetrate most targets before that.

The fact that Russian tanks now can flank the Panther is good. But for that price the Panther doesn´t pack enough of a punch. Even the frontal armor doesn´t deflect enough shots of 85mms. Throw in abilities like mark target and the frotnal armor is non existent.

A cost decrease wouldn´t help, the vehicle has to be buffed. Who wants another Panzer IV?

Also with the lack of anti infantry power the vehicle should excel versus armor. If it´s supposed to stay this way versus tanks the anti infantry has to be buffed (again, I´m against that as that would make it a Panzer IV).

Imo the fact that the Panther isn´t built in most of the games nowadays speaks for itself.

Panther is overnerfed, yes, but you also forgot it got a range increase making it a very fast, high pen 50 range tank destroyer that doesnt require a doctrine.

But Panther does need some love again.

And current 2v2 meta is ISU + medium tanks of your choice

I think it's just too expensive (with the tech needed aswell). I've been trying to make it work in 1on1 but most of the times you'll have 11CPs when you can afford your first Panther even with fuel caches. That leaves getting one kinda pointless and so you'll want to get a Tiger instead.

PS.

I absolutely loved Tier4 with Command Tank last patch. If you went with Mechanized Doctrine you could get spotting scope aswell which was amazing. In this patch any doctrine with Tiger just outclasses that build

Panzerwerfer useless, Panther overnerfed, T4 is just not worth it anymore...

Maybe increase health a little but I think it's more the case of the heavies being too cheap and numerous for the Panther to be viable. It was useful in the last game I played because the opponents went for Forward HQ strategy and we needed arty to crush them. The Panther was thus needed as a non-doctrinal, high penetration unit. But in a typical game, a Tiger doctrine is always a better bet. Tiger is harder to kill, does more damage, is more effective against infantry too. The First tiger is about as fexpensive/late as the first Panther all things considered and that's the main thing. Sustaining Panthers long run might be cheaper but the first one is going to be the one that has the most impact on the game.


Make heavies require tiers so they can't be afforded until a bit later on. Soviet heavies require T3 or T4 building. German heavies require T3 building OR T4 upgrade.

It's role was completely changed due the blitz and hp nerf. It can no loanger soak damage storm the lines and disappear again (althought the bulletins still define that role), you should use the range and speed advantage it has to destroy other tanks.

I don't like the role change because it's impact on the game is rather low a tiger or a couple of stugs & p4 are more efficient than any panther.

However if relics wants us to play the tank in that new way, I guess you have to adapt your play.

there are 2 problems i have with panther: first its overpriced (i see it at 125-130 fuel) secondly its accuracy at long range sucks (its cool when we got the range but we cant hit a shit at that range and thats not so cool )
oh and since the great tank rework the panther got changed fron a breakthrough tank to a highly mobile at platform and im totaly fine with it - we have tigers for breaking thru a defensive position and soon the king tiger

Panther is overnerfed, yes, but you also forgot it got a range increase making it a very fast, high pen 50 range tank destroyer that doesnt require a doctrine.

Are you sure it wasn't 50 before last patch?! So in fact it didn't get this "bonus" but have it from start instead?

there are 2 problems i have with panther: first its overpriced (i see it at 125-130 fuel) secondly its accuracy at long range sucks (its cool when we got the range but we cant hit a shit at that range and thats not so cool )

Please, stay away from balance forums as far as possible.

T34/85 have 50% of the armor, penetration, 10 less range and costs 130 fuel.

Please, stay away from balance forums as far as possible.

T34/85 have 50% of the armor, penetration, 10 less range and costs 130 fuel.

Katitof 'The forumwarrior' telling other people to stay away from the balanceforum.
It's like Justin Bieber tells someone to grow up.

Katitof 'The forumwarrior' telling other people to stay away from the balanceforum.
It's like Justin Bieber tells someone to grow up.

Pot, meet the kettle.

I'd say reduce the fuel cost to the 145-160 range and either give it the armor or the health back that it lost in the previous patch.

T34/85 have 50% of the armor, penetration, 10 less range and costs 130 fuel.

Minus teching cost.

Panther needs some buffs, but it is indeed very tricky unit to balance. Maybe indirect nerfs for call-ins, small blitz buff (in current form blitz is just useless) and little fuel cost reduction will help?

For the love of God,Katitof, please be mature when posting replies. PLEASE, even when someone annoys you. I'm tired of having to sift trough all these shitposts, it's always the same in every damn thread.

On topic : getting a Panther isn't worth the cost in this patch. A Tiger is cheaper and since the Panther gets outperformed by T34/85's, it isn't really usefull.

The Panther is in a good spot. Folks were just used to it excelling at everything expect AI for a year. The Tiger is in a league of its own at the moment, especially compared to the IS2.

Agree, the panther could get some love and yeah, some mature discussion with facts and constructive feedbacks would help the game.

This obvious to any objective observer.

You nerf the Panther over in three to four ways and then significnatly buff it's counters at the same time. What result do you expect?

You don't have to be a NASA rocket scientist to know what the result is. Sometimes the Relic balance team is very frustrating.

150 fuel is probably more reasonable, and that heavy tanks require T4 too.

Perhaps the Panther was that over powered that it required that amount of adjustments?

120MM mortar anybody?

The only thing I'd see valid here is a fuel cost decrease.

The Panther is in a good spot. Folks were just used to it excelling at everything expect AI for a year.

Pardon me, you highness, but what you're saying is pure blatant crap. The only chance for this spot to be good or apropriate, is through a serious cost decrease for this miserable unit.