IS2

Hello internet strangers,

I got bored with the current meta of Elephants vs ISU's so I've branched into IS2's. The IS2 underwent some changes during April 24, 2014 that modified it a bit.

"Heavy armor saw an increase in performance to better highlight its tech placement. When a player transitions from light to medium armor, there is a very clear differentiation in the power of medium vehicles vs. light. This change better highlights the transition from medium to heavy while still retaining the role of medium vehicles in the late game. Lower rear armor maintains the value of flanking while increased combat potential better addresses the tech level of the vehicle. The IS-2’s anti-infantry capabilities have been reduced and compensated with increased anti-armor.

Armor from 325 to 340
Rear armor from 225 to 205
Penetration from 170 to 220
Damage from 240 to 160
Reload from 9 to 6.2-6.6
Distance scatter max from 2.86 to 5.7
Manpower from 760 to 640
Fuel from 240 to 230"

In my opinion the increased anti-armor is lacking. Damage is consistent but it lacks the punch to really make it something to be feared. While the penetration has been increased the amount of damage that is applied has been reduced greatly (240 to 160). What also hurts the IS2's performance is the slow turret speed.

Proposal to make it feared:
- Damage from 160 to 200.
- Turret speed increased slightly.

With the incoming ISU152 over nerf the IS2 will have a proper place on the battle field again.

Western front armies will come with a big Balance patch that also changes Ostheer and Soviets.

I wouldnt mind the IS2 and Tiger coming a bit later too.

The biggest problem with the IS-2 is its HP. It has a lot less HP than the Tiger. The Tiger has something like 1280 while the IS-2 has something like 960.

This means that the IS-2 can't absorb so many hits.

Otherwise, they are actually rather similar tanks, with the tiger having slight advantages.

So it's asymmetrical: The tiger is clearly better than the IS-2 like the ISU is better than the elefant, etc.

The biggest problem with the IS-2 is its HP. It has a lot less HP than the Tiger. The Tiger has something like 1280 while the IS-2 has something like 960.

This means that the IS-2 can't absorb so many hits.

Otherwise, they are actually rather similar tanks, with the tiger having slight advantages.

So it's asymmetrical: The tiger is clearly better than the IS-2 like the ISU is better than the elefant, etc.

True I got charged in a 1v1 by Two IS2s in crossing in the woods. No mines just a faust and they were Pak bait. Talk about Anti Climactic. I almost felt sorry for the guy....

With Paks having more DPS then the Elephant and the IS2 being so slow its not to be feared really. Its to be laughed at. Unless they come with a massive support force they are NOT a Tiger tank by any stretch.

Edit: But if they do come with a support force its the force that makes it strong not the tank.

I'd prefer it if they got more health, like the Elefant has right now. And increase the reload like it was but give the damage back too.

I prefer some more punch/damage while retaining a slower reload.

I like the old IS-2 better- it felt more like an IS-2 rather than an inferior tiger clone.

eg.

pen @ 220
rate of fire nerf back to 9 sec.
damage buff to 210
buff scatter to 2.5

It must make infantry and support weapons cry, while having a different but still potent firing dynamic against armor.

I like the old IS-2 better- it felt more like an IS-2 rather than an inferior tiger clone.

eg.

rate of fire nerf back to 9 sec.
damage buff to 210
buff scatter to 2.5

It must make infantry and support weapons cry, while having a different but still potent firing dynamic against armor.

yeah, i think IS-2 was alot more fun and realistic AND made more sense pre elbe day.

Agreed. Although the IS2 maintains similar DPS compared to pre-patch, it just doesn't feel like a heavy tank. It lacks the punch when fighting late-game German heavy armor, which is when it comes out. A 122mm gun should hit harder and less often than a 76mm gun.

The nice thing about the IS2 is it could shrug off fausts, shreks, and the occasional pak shots (after sufficient prayers to the RNG gods, of course). If you hit a teller mine though, gg IS2. In large team games where Tigers and Elefants are common, you'll be better off with T34/85s or the ISU.

I'd agree that the old IS2 was better. However, given the infantry health adjustments it would be just as bad at one shoting squads as the ISU152 if it were reverted to the old specs. The AI ability needs to remain the same as they are now.

I'd agree that the old IS2 was better. However, given the infantry health adjustments it would be just as bad at one shoting squads as the ISU152. The AI ability needs to remain the same.

yeah, its the anti armor that needs a buff i think, either damage wise or buffing the health of the thing.

Agreed. Although the IS2 maintains similar DPS compared to pre-patch, it just doesn't feel like a heavy tank. It lacks the punch when fighting late-game German heavy armor, which is when it comes out. A 122mm gun should hit harder and less often than a 76mm gun.

The nice thing about the IS2 is it could shrug off fausts, shreks, and the occasional pak shots (after sufficient prayers to the RNG gods, of course). If you hit a teller mine though, gg IS2. In large team games where Tigers and Elefants are common, you'll be better off with T34/85s or the ISU.

RNG loves me because I have yet to have a faust bounce off of an IS2 compared at least to how many bounces Tigers get from AT nades (Unless I use the Tiger of course then its every AT nade actually pens it o.O)

Been getting a lot of time in with the IS2 preparing for the nerf of the ISU152. They work well as a support unit, move in, get a couple shots off, and back out. They are very poor as direct line breakers due to lack of HP. Damage is still 'meh' against other tanks until they are vetted to 3.

A HP boost would go a long way to making this a better choice over 2 x T34/85's.

same here, playing loads of is2 nowadays. exactly as you said, they just need a good hp increase and other softer boosts like speed increase and turret rotation to help them their inherent style of play, which is usually to shoot and scoot or flanking.

I think Tiger was permitted to be slightly better (though not allways) for a reason. Bringing arguments like "I can't use my IS2 like german nasty player here uses his Tiger, I wanna use my IS2 in the same way ...now!" are not valid. Ever considered that Tiger is maybe the only chance for german players to win the late/end game? If IS2 will be a Tiger in mirror, the balance would be even worst. In middle and end-game the soviets have anyway enough advantages and ride the germans hard untill Tiger. Tiger can be countered nevertheless but not by bringing an IS2 and expecting to beat it. Combined arms. Don't you like the concept?

If you are still not convinced, then you can get any of these: ISU 152, B4.

i think either the tiger needs to get its health reduced to 960 like the IS-2 OR is-2 needs a damage buff. There is zero reason to get an IS-2 if you can get 2 t-34/85s for the same price which do everything much better. IS-2 is fine really vs all other tanks except the tiger. I honestly think that this has to do with the tiger being too good at everything when in comparison to the IS-2. Buffing IS-2 damage would make it too good vs PIV, stugs panthers and what not, and would make it comparable to the tiger.

i think either the tiger needs to get its health reduced to 960 like the IS-2 OR is-2 needs a damage buff. There is zero reason to get an IS-2 if you can get 2 t-34/85s for the same price which do everything much better.

IS-2 is IMO stronger against inf and support weapons than the two 85s. Not because it would deal more dps per se (afaik it doesnt, even with the DSHK), but because it has more potential for squadwipes - and also because it tends to bounces fausts and Pak shots with some regularity - ideal for peaking around a corner, laying in a shot, and retreating, rinse and repeat. In a stand up fight against the Tiger the 85s are stronger though no doubt, especially since they usually come with mark target....

I think Tiger was permitted to be slightly better (though not allways) for a reason. Bringing arguments like "I can't use my IS2 like german nasty player here uses his Tiger, I wanna use my IS2 in the same way ...now!" are not valid. Ever considered that Tiger is maybe the only chance for german players to win the late/end game? If IS2 will be a Tiger in mirror, the balance would be even worst. In middle and end-game the soviets have anyway enough advantages and ride the germans hard untill Tiger. Tiger can be countered nevertheless but not by bringing an IS2 and expecting to beat it. Combined arms. Don't you like the concept?

If you are still not convinced, then you can get any of these: ISU 152, B4.

ISU isn't a great idea in 1v1, and even if you do, just a lame unit. B4 is just one doctrine. I agree that IS2 shouldn't mirror the Tiger, but right now it doesn't really have any use. T34-85s do everything that an IS2 can, but better. Also, the Wehr has the strongest AT atm, AND the strongest armor. Given Wehr AT, and that an IS2 isn't as mobile as the T34, it's incredibly vulnerable, even though it's a heavy tank.

Tbh fixing the IS-2 isn't top priority, but it's worth getting looked at imo, cause there's just no reason to get one right now (similar to the uselessness of Wehr T4 really).

ISU isn't a great idea in 1v1, and even if you do, just a lame unit. B4 is just one doctrine. I agree that IS2 shouldn't mirror the Tiger, but right now it doesn't really have any use. T34-85s do everything that an IS2 can, but better. Also, the Wehr has the strongest AT atm, AND the strongest armor. Given Wehr AT, and that an IS2 isn't as mobile as the T34, it's incredibly vulnerable, even though it's a heavy tank.

Tbh fixing the IS-2 isn't top priority, but it's worth getting looked at imo, cause there's just no reason to get one right now (similar to the uselessness of Wehr T4 really).

I hear you, but tbh there are so many more urgent matters than that. For instance, if we think at IS2 as not verry cost effective, then what could we say about Panther? That thing isn't even build anymore compare to IS2 who is widely used nowadays.
I must admit though that many of soviet players abandoned ISU152 abuse tactics, this prooving that they are interested in a fair chalanging game.