Balance vCoH Trolololo

Yeah, but we could create a balance mod, future tourneys will be played. This mod will fix the issues most players agree on (like the list, tommy created).
Maybe such a mod could also redesign brits and PE to be more on the competetive line and remove reward units.

That would be nice addition. I think this mod have huge potenial to bring more life into CoH.

That would be nice addition. I think this mod have huge potenial to bring more life into CoH.

Yeah I agree

I feel like Sherman Smoke might also need a small buffs, since it is pretty much never used ever, it does cost 50 munitions which seems a bit too much.

In my opinion the mod shouldn't change too many things, it should only focus on balance problem (at least when first release).

I feel like Sherman Smoke might also need a small buffs, since it is pretty much never used ever, it does cost 50 munitions which seems a bit too much.

Thats's true. 40 Mun sounds right.

M3 could possibly be buffed but you've gotta bear in mind just how freakishly strong the gun actually is when upgraded. If it was as strong as an M8 but with the same gun (and also cheaper to build than an M8) there's a good chance people would pick it almost every time over an M8. It's worth considering indeed, but I think there's quite a fine line to be achieved there.

If the upgun was freakishly strong then more people would pick this even though it is a glass cannon. But that just isn't the case. The quad, which would mean 4 x 500 bpm .50 cal machine guns, doesn't even provide as much suppression as a single mg42 let alone doing much damage at any significant range.

No one ever really knows if it does damage at short range since it can be killed so easily by shreks, fausts, paks, etc... which makes it a very risky use of 25 fuel and 100 muni.

I don't think it is the unarmored nature that makes it less used but the poor return coupled with the expensive cost. It just doesn't serve a purpose except in some very select situations (PE anti-AC, Allied Anti-air, or a use for floating munitions). Also remember that the cloaked nature of the pak means the first hit is "free" and almost unavoidable and that is a big reason no one uses m3s and also why no one uses an m8 without a skirt.

Perhaps an alternate upgrade choice? 50 muni for a crew on the regular 50 cal and lose one or two of the crew slots?

Arbitrary hardcaps are bad. They limit options = limits strategic depth. I don't want to _stop_ people from building double or triple snipers if that's what they wanna do; but I want to force them to micro harder to use them, or face being more flankable or more easily countersniped.

Why a defense of hardcaps only in the case snipers? We have caps on other units (admittedly non-doctrinal) like Tigers, Pershings and Calliopes. And there is an effective cap on spammed arty (they use a ton of population as each costs 11pop).

There is a fair argument to be made that sniper spam just isn't what COH was supposed to be about. Once a sniper, let alone 3 or more, shows up the game seems to become all about the snipers.

The best is, that automatch works with such mods too

Yeah, but how about leaderboards?

Yeah, but how about leaderboards?

Leaderboards are already a drophack mess

If the upgun was freakishly strong then more people would pick this even though it is a glass cannon. But that just isn't the case. The quad, which would mean 4 x 500 bpm .50 cal machine guns, doesn't even provide as much suppression as a single mg42 let alone doing much damage at any significant range.

No one ever really knows if it does damage at short range since it can be killed so easily by shreks, fausts, paks, etc... which makes it a very risky use of 25 fuel and 100 muni.

I'm sorry but the quad 50 upgrade, is Really damm strong, it can completely obliterate any infantry quite quickly, also the fact that it doesn't supress as much as a single MG42 can be an upside, since supressed targets take less damage, and since the rifleman do less damage to supressed and pinned units compared to volks or grens, also if the supression was increased to the same as an MG42, it would be completely overpowered since it can already supress a squad well enough to escape from one.

I'm sorry but the quad 50 upgrade, is Really damm strong, it can completely obliterate any infantry quite quickly, also the fact that it doesn't supress as much as a single MG42 can be an upside, since supressed targets take less damage, and since the rifleman do less damage to supressed and pinned units compared to volks or grens, also if the supression was increased to the same as an MG42, it would be completely overpowered since it can already supress a squad well enough to escape from one.

The problem with your argument and Tommy's is that if it were true it would not explain why you just don't see these! I doubt you see a quad in 1 of 1000 1v1s or 1 in a 100 or more multi-player games and even then probably only for the kicks of making a quad.

If there was a valid trade-off on survivablility vs. firepower then for sure someone would be finding ways to use them, but the lack of these things proves that it they just aren't worth it regardless of what you think of the gun.

I also happen to disagree with you on the strength of the gun. I LOVE this weapon in concept, not really sure why. But even though I actively look for the successful ways to use it I haven't found it myself on seen it in anyones streams or playbacks. Instead, while I seek a glimmer of their utility I find instead that they do... not much.

I am open to being wrong, but I made an argument, and coupled with the EXTRAORDINARY limited use of this, it is really up to you to show how that is wrong. I am really sorry, but a few assertions on your part just don't cut it without a playback or clip.

Maybe it belongs in T2? Maybe the upgun needs to be cheaper? I don't know, but there is not vehicle in the Wehr arsenal that is used so little.

M8 has more impact to the gameplay than the halftrack quad. Its armoured and can counter the up to wehr tier3, while the halftrack can only counter up to tier2.

Halftrack doesn't even counter T2 all that well. 2 shots will kill it, so a practically free one from the cloaked Pak and then the other from a pak, mine, faust, shrek or whatever happens to be in the area or can get there or intercept.

In other words, a T3 unit that costs an additional 100 muni to upgrade can at best counter only T1 units since Wehr T2 has hard counters (Pak, shreks, even the mortar can help with smoke).

Compare that to Wehr halftrack... It comes in T2, is pretty durable for the point in the game in which it arrives, and as a Stuka it is pretty survivable in late game play.

The reason people don't build them in competitive games is because an M8 is safer- it protects against pumas and can soft counter stugs and stuhs. The halftrack is just a very niche unit (good against PE, good on certain maps with lots of shotblockers against an opponent using a lot of infantry) and buffing its health will not change that. I agree it would be nice to see more variation than just M8 every time from T3 but I don't think that's possible without changing the nature of the unit (or reducing its cost significantly, which is possible but then risks being an expendable death machine).

Another thing that needs changing would be the bombing run, 250 munitions for no damage at all, and also easily avoidable.

damage is very high, but AOE is not. I would reduce it to 200mun and adjust balance from there.

damage is very high, but AOE is not. I would reduce it to 200mun and adjust balance from there.

I guess it is more of an anti infantry kind of call in.

Bombing run is fine as it is. Just the chances between nothing and overkill is sometimes too high.

Airborne gets enough mun from his airsupport

US Halftrack needs like 50 Hp more, thats true.

Bombing run at 200mun is bullshit. It would eliminate strafe after you get it.
Air support gives you 100 mun already, you could spam Bombing runs.

Bombing run is fine as it is. Just the chances between nothing and overkill is sometimes too high.

Airborne gets enough mun from his airsupport

US Halftrack needs like 50 Hp more, thats true.

Bombing run at 200mun is bullshit. It would eliminate strafe after you get it.
Air support gives you 100 mun already, you could spam Bombing runs.

I don't like throwing around the fanboi term around and I hope it isn't the case here either, but when you say things like the bomb-run is effective anti-infantry or the supply drop allows you to spam bomb runs, than I have to think you don't play much Airborne.

Supply Drop is not spammable. While it is cheap enough at 100mp (though mp is the single biggest constraint on US players, and really any CoH player) the cool down is enormous. Also AB is more muni-hungry than other US doctrines since you don't have doctrinal artillery (and please please don't bring up the bomb-run when those of us who try using it will tell you how miserable it is to use).

It would also be cool if there was a way to change the hotkeys to what they are in CoH2. That would be the only thing I think was done better in CoH2 than in CoH1

It would also be cool if there was a way to change the hotkeys to what they are in CoH2. That would be the only thing I think was done better in CoH2 than in CoH1

Think that is the inverse gridkeys.