Is the STUG truly useless??

Plus its got a jammin' name. it sounds badass.

The Stug.

Sometimes I use it. However I think the Panzer IV is better for cost. The obvious weaknesses of the StuG are that a SU-85 will defeat it and a T-34 can flank it. The 40 manpower and 20 fuel more for a Panzer IV are usually better spent. This gives you the ability to flank SU-85 and prevent getting flanked from T-34.

I pretty much use the StuG only as an emergency vehicle when lacking fuel (happens sometimes when facing Soviet industry), but then never alone. It´s also useful to counter the T-34/85 pair.

The only reason to use it right now is if you skipped T2 straight to T3 and at some point you lost fuel control and now you need emergency AT asap and can't wait any longer for a P4. In theory Stug spam is probably a great counter to pure T34 spam in a vacuum but when you factor in that they get ass raped by SU85s and are almost completely useless once hit by an AT nade they aren't very practical.

PS: A few times I did spam Stugs in the very late game to deal with IS2/ISU152 and they worked great, but this was only after I already had several P4s out.

I pretty much use the StuG only as an emergency vehicle when lacking fuel (happens sometimes when facing Soviet industry), but then never alone. It´s also useful to counter the T-34/85 pair.

I do the same.



The Stug is a nice supplemental unit but it's just that: A supplemental unit.
It needs protection and flawless positioning just like any other support weapon.

The P4 is simply vastly superior thanks to its versatility. So why should I invest in a Stug unless I am really desperate for mobile AT?


The example when facing the threat of SU85s has already been mentioned.
The Stug is horribly outclassed by the Su85 - both in straight up fights and kiting (even if the Stugs powerful vet-stun-shot actually connects).
The P4 excels at flanking and thus stays useful under just about any circumstances.

In almost all situations I prefer a Pak. However, Stugs are good when you're facing mortar spam or someone who really, really likes flanking with shock troops, both of which can easily overwhelm a pak.

If you have Hull Down available to you, Stugs become more viable. They already have better range than P4s and Hull Down lets them shoot even further.

So...elefant with Hull Down has more massive range?

So...elefant with Hull Down has more massive range?

125 range to be specific. 50% of arty range.

Stug is *significantly* better AT than a P4. It has longer range, higher RoF, higher penetration and does the same damage. Basically any game that I see a T-70 or T-34 I'll grab a Stug as my first tank because they completely hard-counter the hell out of T-34s. They're also my go-to counter for T34-85s because of their range/rof they really hold up a lot better against them than P4s and it can be difficult to get Panthers out before the T34/85s with how soon they come in this patch.

You can't and shouldn't blindly make a Stug as your first tank like you could a P4, since P4s are okay-ish against everything and can be good at putting pressure on your opponent, but if they've revealed T3 you should definitely invest in one.

Also as the game progresses P4 + Stug can probably kill 3-4 T34s by themselves as long as you micro properly. Stugs are extremely good at what they do, but they're basically a more durable AT gun - on tracks, so you can't really expect them to tear up infantry.

Stug is *significantly* better AT than a P4. It has longer range, higher RoF, higher penetration and does the same damage. Basically any game that I see a T-70 or T-34 I'll grab a Stug as my first tank because they completely hard-counter the hell out of T-34s

Where did you get this idea from because the stug is far from a hardcounter to the t-34 even from the front.

Where did you get this idea from because the stug is far from a hardcounter to the t-34 even from the front.

From personal experience and from unit stats. As I said before the stug is better AT than a p4 in every regard, and it out ranges t34s, if your stugs aren't beating t34s, you're doing it wrong. :/

Having played many hours of (in addition to being an RGD coder for) Europe in Ruins mod for vCoH (persistency mod), I can say that the ability to rapidly engage an opposing unit from outside the range of effective retaliation, and with very rapid damage, is almost priceless.

A pair of StuGs will splatter an area with enough shells in very short order to make mincemeat out of enemy squads, and they work fantastically against anything that's not an SU-85. I started playing CoH2 and immediately stuck with building StuGs instead of P4s. Maybe two weeks ago I started dicking around with P4s, and found myself shouting at my screen in rage (even when facing the AI) because of their longer reload and general inability to ROFLSTOMP enemy armor in short order (or kite effectively). I play with almost all of my units within 1-2 screenlengths of eachother, so you must consider that there are 3x LMG42 Grens (or 2x LMG42 Grens with an MG42 backing them up), a Shreck-totting PG squad, and a pair of flammen Pios usually standing in front of my StuGs. Maxim spam? Spam them with lelshells from maximum range until dead or buy a mortar. Con rush? Que the LMGs -> rush flammens into the pinned mass. Tanks? Que StuGs.

TL;DR, I like StuGs. They're very... *StuGnatious* fighters.

Yuk yuk yuk yuk.

i wish stugs were like vcoh stugs
how they actually have frontal armour

If P4s are skipped, the Stug (s) + Ostwind. can work although the Ostwind is worse than the Brumabar in clearing out zis guns.

nuff said... i stug's

P4s and T34s have 50% more HP than Stugs in addition to a turret and much better anti-infantry.

Stugs are terrible in most situations. They are completely one-dimensional and sadly only useful for defense like a Pak40.

P4s and T34s have 50% more HP than Stugs in addition to a turret and much better anti-infantry.

Stugs are terrible in most situations. They are completely one-dimensional and sadly only useful for defense like a Pak40.

StuGs make a short work of T34 just as effective as SU-85 deal with P4s.
When you start seeing KV tanks, unless its KV-2, StuG is all you want if you're in T3.

While its not best idea, its definitely better to have StuGs against IS-2 then P4s that will simply loose without putting a fight, while StuGs can damage and at vet1 control IS-2.

You really underestimate StuGs. You just need to babysit them more, just like you have to with Su-85.

StuGs make a short work of T34 just as effective as SU-85 deal with P4s.
When you start seeing KV tanks, unless its KV-2, StuG is all you want if you're in T3.

While its not best idea, its definitely better to have StuGs against IS-2 then P4s that will simply loose without putting a fight, while StuGs can damage and at vet1 control IS-2.

You really underestimate StuGs. You just need to babysit them more, just like you have to with Su-85.

this link0 guy is good, he can say whatever the fuck he wants tho. i wouldn't be all that surprised if he said he can kill tiger aces with just conscripts. /sarcasm

but honestly he is good.

for mere mortals like us, it depends on who you fight with i guess, if he cannot keep up with the t34 micro, stug will end the game. if he can, he might very well destroy your stug with circle strafe.

Think StuGs could use a slight HP buff if anything. They do not perform according to their cost, like people already said.

That said, 2xP4 and 1xStuG is generally a better combo than 3xP4 imo, simply thanks to the faster RoF, HP not being a factor and Target Weakpoint. They are extremely situational though.

Think StuGs could use a slight HP buff if anything. They do not perform according to their cost, like people already said.

That said, 2xP4 and 1xStuG is generally a better combo than 3xP4 imo, simply thanks to the faster RoF, HP not being a factor and Target Weakpoint. They are extremely situational though.

Agree. Alternatively they should get slightly more frontal armour. Afterall that's all StuGs had...

P4s and T34s have 50% more HP than Stugs in addition to a turret and much better anti-infantry.

Stugs are terrible in most situations. They are completely one-dimensional and sadly only useful for defense like a Pak40.

Stug G != Stug E

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ApmrrrPr20ncdGF4VURuYjVGZXlIN3ptbV8tbzRzN0E&usp=drive_web#gid=16