G-43 vs SVT-40

Jump back to quoted post18 Dec 2013, 23:24 PMMr. Someguy

I'm talking about just Penal Troops. I'm well aware that the "unarmed Russians charge into battle" was just an act of severe desperation during the Battle of Stalingrad. Penals on the other hand were just prisoners plucked from Gulags, rounded into a group, charged at enemy positions, then the survivors were put into another group and charged again. Sometimes they held sticks to make them look like Soldiers, and in winter they wore the darkest uniforms so the Germans would fire at them first and not the Red Army men nearby.

Jump back to quoted post18 Dec 2013, 05:45 AMMr. Someguy

I feel like Penals were a later addition to the game, their role does not match their description or voices, and their weapons and further contradict it.

Personally I would have made Penals like this:

Shtrafniki: "Armed" with sticks, shtrafniki are just meat-shields designed to take the heat off real combat troops. At 7 men for 105 manpower, costing 15 manpower to reinforce, there is no immediate resource benefit to keeping them alive, and they only give half the XP of conscripts on death. Having no weapons of their own, shtrafniki prove their loyalty by dying in the field. Once enough men have died to achieve Vet 1, shtrafniki are considered trusted enough to be given real weapons, and a free upgrade for Mosin-Nagant rifles (conscript rifles) become available. Vet 1 shtrafniki are slightly effective as a conscript squad. Vet 2 increases their durability and lethality, Vet 3 further increases durability and lethality. Shtrafniki cannot capture points until Vet 2, and cannot capture at normal speed until Vet 3.

Jump back to quoted post18 Dec 2013, 12:17 PMCrecer13

if you're handy with the Russian language (or Google Translate) you can read about penal battalions here.
penal battalions
And about the SVT-40 here
SVT-40
About assault engineering brigade here
1
2

Jump back to quoted post19 Dec 2013, 12:57 PMtokarev

Sorry, but you are out of your mind.

Jump back to quoted post20 Dec 2013, 11:50 AMMr. Someguy

I never intended it to be a serious suggestion, more of a fantasy idea than anything else. I just think it's a bit silly that Penal Troops are described in-game as worthless scum, but in practice are treated like skilled front line troops with fancy weapons that even Guards aren't allowed to have. Now maybe historically they weren't considered as worthless as I thought they were, but either way I'm pretty sure they weren't considered better Soldiers than the rest of the Red Army.

Even just listening to their voices is contradictory. "The real soldiers are busy", says the guy leading a squad of SVT's and Flamethrowers, while the "real soldiers" have Bolt-Actions that they can barely aim. "You need a suicide squad?" seems much more in-line with the literal suicide squad I outlined.

Maybe I'm just nit-picky, but there's a huge divide between their description and voice, and actual combat role in-game.

Jump back to quoted post20 Dec 2013, 12:14 PMAradan

PS: they never use helmets

Jump back to quoted post5 Feb 2014, 00:44 AMJazzwind

I think what bothers me a bit about the Relic rendition of the PTRD / PTRS is that they say it's a crappy anti-infantry weapon. While the PTRD certainly had (what could be termed)a poor rate of fire, they both had 1.) range and 2.) stopping power. Getting hit with a little (hah) round like that at those velocities would easily tear off a limb, or cause instant catastrophic internal damage just from the velocity, itself, let alone the tumbling factors of a ballistic round. Unsure of what Relic chose to call it a poor AI weapon. It wasn't, at all.

Jump back to quoted post5 Feb 2014, 02:56 AMVolsky

Give Guards Mosins, two SVTs by default, and the ability to purchase two DPs.

Why is there not a non-doctrinal PTRS unit? Bah, refer to my post on page one. Chop chop, make it so Relic.

Jump back to quoted post5 Feb 2014, 03:15 AMMarcoRossolini

Regarding someone saying Shock troops didn't exist, the unit as it is portrayed graphically did exist, they were assault engineers with SN-42 body armour and loaded to the gunnels with AT grenades, Flamethrowers, SMGs, LMGs demo charges etc. VCoH's Eastern Front mod is the most accurate portrayal of them.