AoEII Definitive Edition does 2 things good: it has a nice framework for a perfected game and the company running it does not care. AOEII is to this day the gold standard of hardcore RTS titles, and DefEd makes it compatibility and graphically friendly to new systems. This example you cited though is mistaken for a single reason: COH's legacy is not the same as AOE's legacy, in many many respects. AOE is maintained by a giant corporation basically for fun whilst COH should be a competitive title in order to make relic (due to limited resources) care about it. You should see what AOE4 did, which tried to emulate the 1998 formula for 2021, and ended up in the bargain bin.
I mentioned it in another thread a while ago, one big difference for AoE4's failure is that the game has to compare against AoE2, which as you say is considered to be one of the best, if not even THE best RTS out there. The game does not have many issues in its core design. CoH3 on the other hand has to beat CoH2, and what I read on this forum and the official Relic one I have the feeling that many players would be happy to get a "CoH2 reloaded" without all the bullshit design that is still stuck in this game to this very day.
Paradox's games basically consist of trying to squeeze out every last penny of a very hardcore fanbase and only that. They are not normie friendly and, judging by HOI4 right now and CK3 right now, they are just not fun if you don't buy DLCs which can rack up 1000$. So yeah, it's a good thing that relic does not turn to that business model. As I previously said, the most untapped market right now are 20somethings that have not commited to LoL or DOTA.
Civilization games are almost exclusively single player which allow for a more casual non competitive aura (I know this because Civ VI is my favorite game outside of COH2) and frequently go on sale for like 15bucks for the whole franchise. Again, not really saying something about a competitive WW2 RTS like COH.
I play HOI4 and I find it enjoyable even without DLC. The DLCs themselves often have even bad reviews and are considered optional. While the Paradox DLC flood pisses me off, at least they have a decent policy of introducing features for everyone and not splitting the player base.
The point about SP focus is true though.
With all due respect, I do not think you get the F2P business model. You are also mistaking F2P for P2W which is something else entirely. For starters, all F2P titles encourage balanced gameplay by removing P2W mechanisms (LOL, DOTA, TF2, Smite and all that do not have paid content that makes you a better player but paid skins that make you look nicer without affecting the gameplay and yes people buy more of that than actual P2W).
How do you think games like TF2 (kind of offtopic I know but I am examining the business model) have become so so prominent and still around after 15 years with numbers that 10-12x COH2? Because it's free and you play the full experience without paying shit. No P2Ws either. Hence, the player is in so good an environment that basically begs to pay for something to reward himself.
I know both concepts decently enough.
Again, we can find plenty of examples for both sides. The issue is that most F2P games that finance themselves via cosmetics have some central character for identification of the player. This makes the player's buy cosmetics.
CoH does not have that, or maybe I am just too old to want to make my tanks or whatnot "look cool". But if the tone of the game is supposed to be dark and gritty, you can't go crazy with cosmetics.
Oh come on that is a childish argument. DOTA2, LOL, CSGO, all have servers that handle 100x COH2 traffic and the manage to catch cheaters and smurfers on time and make them stay out. TBH, on COH2 has actual problems with smurfs and cheaters. Not to mention that with seasons and ranks all that becomes pointless.
Everything but childish. I don't know about the other games, but CSGO had and still has large issues with cheaters. Just check out the Steam reviews, you'll still find plenty of people complain about cheaters and smurfs.
You've previously made the point that CoH2 and CoH3 are not backed by huge companies and have limited resources. Apparently even the giants in your cited games don't manage to filter their community properly.
It is obvious that if your only repercussion is the need to create a new throw-away email address and make a new Steam account, cheaters and other highly toxic people will never get filtered out and have it easier to cycle back into the game.
Good thing you are not an exec though because those bullshit games are taking away COH's market share and potential playerbase.
It's not even proven that those games compete with the CoH franchise. The games you cite are Mobas, not RTS. I love RTS, but would never touch Mobas. Am I representative? Probably not. Did you show any data or at least game dev statements that those games compete? Also no.
These are different types of games and they likely cater to different audiences.
That's a perfectly fine personal preference. But when it comes to the grand scale of videogame economics in 2022, paying 60$ for a game is a gamble almost nobody makes consistently for AAA games. What makes you think that COH3 will be different and not end up with the same playerbase as AOE4 did?
How did you come to that conclusion? There are so many huge AAA franchises (BF, COD, AS just to name a few) that charge 60-80 bucks per game plus nonsensical DLC or season passes and release games on an annual level, and people keep buying it.
Relic Entertainment
cblanco ★ 
보드카 중대 
VonManteuffel 
Heartless Jäger 
