UKF in ML so far...

well yes, you can use croc or avre with comet
or regular 120 double church hill with firefly

i think synergy is good and open more options to ukf players

If you want AI focused vehicle that works with firefly, there is centaur for that already too.

Why are you so hellbent to nerf churchill again? Why are you trying to push it into a role that is already covered by another vehicle, 2 out of 3 ways of doing it is a churchill already? It completely lost its relevance after last nerfs to the point where it had buffs.

nah im suggested buffs by reducing pop cap back to old and increasing main gun aoe against infantry units, at the expense of AT damage. something like double churchill with 1 more RE support or ATG

aside from Panther wich is on its own in a competly different tier unit in terms of its pricing.

Why is that?

Both Panther & Churchil comes out with latest tier (tier4 / anvil upgrade / tier3 in OKW)

Costs pretty much same 490mp+185fuel / 490mp+165fuel.

nah im suggested buffs by reducing pop cap back to old and increasing main gun aoe against infantry units, at the expense of AT damage. something like double churchill with 1 more RE support or ATG

But why?
What is balance reason behind it?
What is that supposed to achieve?
What is not right with current version?
Why its current main gun + vet1 MGs + pintle is not enough vs infantry?
This is kind of "buff" I would expect from vipper trying to neuter another allied unit.

nah im suggested buffs by reducing pop cap back to old and increasing main gun aoe against infantry units, at the expense of AT damage. something like double churchill with 1 more RE support or ATG

You clearly don't understand how significant it is to reduce 160 -> 120 dmg.

One that used to require 4 shots to kill tank now requires 6 shots.
Reduce AI for significantly without huge buff to aoe.

You speak it as if it's nothing important. But it is.

Pls apply for a mod if you want to be a mod or don't try play one.
You're the redhead kid who instantly runs to the teacher crying abuse the second other kids look at you.

I must say I don't like where this is going.

But why?
What is balance reason behind it?
What is that supposed to achieve?
What is not right with current version?
Why its current main gun + vet1 MGs + pintle is not enough vs infantry?

I was with you until this one. Bro. Not a great way to have a debate if you attack the person himself not the opinion.

In all honesty, a 120DMG Churchill would completely neuter it. Nobody would ever build it again. UKF is already a rarety, and the solution is not to nerf the army even more. So many Axis players hate the Churchill and would love seeing it nerfed to death without any valid reason.

In all honesty, a 120DMG Churchill would completely neuter it. Nobody would ever build it again. UKF is already a rarety, and the solution is not to nerf the army even more. So many Axis players hate the Churchill and would love seeing it nerfed to death without any valid reason.

How ironic that I had to fight with someone over nerfing Churchil dmg to 120; when I wrote thread about how UKF having lowest WR & pick rate over ML & coh2stat site.

You clearly don't understand how significant it is to reduce 160 -> 120 dmg.

One that used to require 4 shots to kill tank now requires 6 shots.
Reduce AI for significantly without huge buff to aoe.

You speak it as if it's nothing important. But it is.

it's open for exploration, maybe increase rof alongside.

I believe that the lack of spotting for invisible units (namely the JLI) is what makes UKF unable to exploit it sniper versus OKW and therefore makes it a bad matchup.

it's open for exploration, maybe increase rof alongside.

I suggest you to explore it by actually playing UKF

it's open for exploration, maybe increase rof alongside.

Imagine reducing gren's rifle dmg from 16 to 12 and "explore" from there, that is what you're asking for..

What you are saying is like below.

Why not just remove HMG from Panther, to make it work as a other TD. Other TD (Jackson/Firefly/su-85) clearly lacks any AI & high armor. It's not fair for panther to have all.

How can it wipe 6 pounder & airborne faster than Comet right? No fair.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIxjdDb0CjE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xg0u1IAuKeQ

As I read this I thought never, ever is this true. This really can't be true. It would destroy what I thought this two tanks are balanced around completely. Both are at 18 population. so they have to be somehow compareable in population efficience.

Panther: more range, overall better survivability, higher penetration -> wins vs Comet in 1vs1 situation
Comet: does way more damage to Infantry to be more like an allround premium brawler

I tested it multiple times in CheatMod at different ranges. Vet0 Panther always with Pintle upgrade, Vet0 Comet with Tank Commander Upgrade.

Result: The result was pretty close with Panther having the edge over Comet overall at killing infantry


How is this even possible? Where is the way better AI of Comet?
Throwing grenades? -> situatuional/very short ranged/watch out for snares
Smoke shell? -> versatile, but prevents your maingun from shooting of course
WP shell at Vet1? -> is it all about this munition costing ability?

Oh man, Comet really should have higher AI base damage as a pintled Panther or be able to upgrade a turret mounted MG by itself, this is shocking.

The sad reality is that the last patch didn't have the permissions to go full deep on UKF and without a real rework out of Bolster to spread out it's powerspike towards other units and helping the faction have the right tools for teamgames (USF is in a similar spot) you won't see also any amount of commander diversity.

I seriously don't understand why Lelic insist on hamstringing the Balans Team like this. I get that they want to preserve factional "identity", but they really need to decide between allowing the team to make major changes (Removing/completely reworking bolster, giving UKF a nondoc indirection option, etc), or giving them greater modding access, and allowing them to implement new units to provide "flavourful" alternatives/patch these grievous wounds in the faction. (I.E: 2-inch mortar UC). The latter option might allow the team to implement enough new/interesting units to let them flesh out hammer/anvil in such a way to make the whole "two armies" thing a reality.

As I read this I thought never, ever is this true. This really can't be true. It would destroy what I thought this two tanks are balanced around completely. Both are at 18 population. so they have to be somehow compareable in population efficience.

Panther: more range, overall better survivability, higher penetration -> wins vs Comet in 1vs1 situation
Comet: does way more damage to Infantry to be more like an allround premium brawler

I tested it multiple times in CheatMod at different ranges. Vet0 Panther always with Pintle upgrade, Vet0 Comet with Tank Commander Upgrade.

Result: The result was pretty close with Panther having the edge over Comet overall at killing infantry


How is this even possible? Where is the way better AI of Comet?
Throwing grenades? -> situatuional/very short ranged/watch out for snares
Smoke shell? -> versatile, but prevents your maingun from shooting of course
WP shell at Vet1? -> is it all about this munition costing ability?

Oh man, Comet really should have higher AI base damage as a pintled Panther or be able to upgrade a turret mounted MG by itself, this is shocking.

Except Panther MGs are more affected by both veterancy received accuracy bonuses of infantry and cover. And this is on top of the Comet able to deliver sudden burst damage and move in and out to get shells in on infantry. Panthers need to be facing the target with all their guns.

Except Panther MGs are more affected by both veterancy received accuracy bonuses of infantry and cover. And this is on top of the Comet able to deliver sudden burst damage and move in and out to get shells in on infantry. Panthers need to be facing the target with all their guns.

Its not that the Comet main gun would perform like a PZIV or T34 versus infantry... Why not giving the Comet a way to increase its MG damage too (would get affected by inf vet too)? The Panther should deal more AI damage than Comet in absolutely NO combat situation, since that was always the reason for me Comet looses badly to Panther.

Its not that the Comet main gun would perform like a PZIV or T34 versus infantry... Why not giving the Comet a way to increase its MG damage too (would get affected by inf vet too)? The Panther should deal more AI damage than Comet in absolutely NO combat situation, since that was always the reason for me Comet looses badly to Panther.

Comet already got a buff to its MGs in one of the last updates. Or did they scrap that as well?

Comet already got a buff to its MGs in one of the last updates. Or did they scrap that as well?

Cromwell, not Comet I believe. Comet just had its AI AoE hammered.

Panther has Comet AI when facing infantry along with better survivability and not consuming the shot, so its always ready to shoot any incoming tanks. It invalidates Medium armor and lets the Panther punish AT guns. I can hug other TDs safely, Panther MGs really tingle. The Panther is some weird cross between a heavy tank and a heavy TD.

Removing the Pintle would cement its position as a TD, and not a heavy tank along with making Tank Commander an upgrade and not a side grade.