Upcoming Comander Update - Wishes

If it JUST provides an FRP, perhaps it could be the ability of an unit, rather than a building or structure? The USF major does this, perhaps a new OST officer squad could be designed with this as an ability? (Or give it to the Artillery Officer, even)

Or perhaps there's some sort of unused Funkerwagen model that could get it. Unfortunately OKW already have the 223, and that has a different ability, or you could otherwise use that.

Actually now you mention it I had a similar idea before, giving the FRP ability to an Sd. Kfz. 260/261. This is basicly a turretless 223 (perhaps replace pintle mg with panzer commander), so it would be possible to make with the modding tools. My idea was that this vehicle would have dual purpose: it would have a very long sight range (70~80), so, if it is indeed put into Festung Armor doctrine, then you can either use it to spot for hulled down panthers (they have longer range than elephant actually) or deploy somewhere safer for FRP.

Actually now you mention it I had a similar idea before, giving the FRP ability to an Sd. Kfz. 260/261. This is basicly a turretless 223 (perhaps replace pintle mg with panzer commander), so it would be possible to make with the modding tools. My idea was that this vehicle would have dual purpose: it would have a very long sight range (70~80), so, if it is indeed put into Festung Armor doctrine, then you can either use it to spot for hulled down panthers (they have longer range than elephant actually) or deploy somewhere safer for FRP.

Quality suggestion, if its possible to remove the MG from the 223 (Which I believe it is, fairly easily... I think this is one of the sorts of "model edits" that can be done with the modtools)and replace it with a Panzer(spahwagen) commander, then this would be an interesting addition to one or two doctrines. I wonder if it might be good in Mobile Defence, as well as your suggestion of Festung Armour? A mobile FRP would be thematically fitting in the former, but it's not exactly very synergistic with the rest of the doc.

Would such an unit have ANY means to defend itself, or offensive/utility abilities other than the sight and ability to deploy as an FRP? Admittedly both of those are probably enough, especially if it only costs 2/3 pop.

Anyone else got any comments? Sanders, perhaps?

Quality suggestion, if its possible to remove the MG from the 223 (Which I believe it is, fairly easily... I think this is one of the sorts of "model edits" that can be done with the modtools)and replace it with a Panzer(spahwagen) commander, then this would be an interesting addition to one or two doctrines. I wonder if it might be good in Mobile Defence, as well as your suggestion of Festung Armour? A mobile FRP would be thematically fitting in the former, but it's not exactly very synergistic with the rest of the doc.

Would such an unit have ANY means to defend itself, or offensive/utility abilities other than the sight and ability to deploy as an FRP? Admittedly both of those are probably enough, especially if it only costs 2/3 pop.

Anyone else got any comments? Sanders, perhaps?

It would be defenseless and thus wouldn't have vet either, similar to Uhu. Perhaps it can have an arty ability, an interesting one would be arty officer's coordinated barrage, requiring the player to build a panzerwerfer if they want to benefit from that.

It would be defenseless and thus wouldn't have vet either, similar to Uhu. Perhaps it can have an arty ability, an interesting one would be arty officer's coordinated barrage, requiring the player to build a panzerwerfer if they want to benefit from that.

Even being defenceless, it could well have shared veterancy and still have three levels of vet, if that might provide something interesting to the unit. Not all vet need be offensive, after all.

Cons also perform better than grens late game and wehr also don't have end tech elite infanty with 20 long range dps most of it focused on single target.

HMG42 doesn't disappear from the game past 10 minute, you still have access to it, its still best infantry support weapon and it still supports grens.

Have you seen what 5 man sections with 2x brens are like bro, they'd be very upset that you think that they are weak.

That's my point, you baboon... they don't have powerful infantry to supplement them, they don't have strongest HMG behind their back, they don't have cheap mobile reinforcement, or best sniper in game behind them, they scale themselves according to cost for all of that.

Hmm... you do know that the new VSL gren who's upgrade costs 60 munis and 30 mp can't beat svt cons at any range across all veterancy levels. explain that.

You do know that VSL grens still have best HMG and sniper in game supporting them?

But the guards come with 3 ppsh and 3 thompsons.

Thx. Nice to point that out, i never noticed that (okay I played them once, so maybe I didn't notice because of that single try). So it fits thematically at least.

I remember they felt underwhelming as I played them. So I just tested them a few times in comparison to ShockTroops and sadly Assault Guards are worse combatwise.

So the mix of target size 1 at Vet0 + Vet1, no additional armour and no smoke grenade (or sprint) results in loosing quite a few models by closing in. They are just worse in many ways.

Further drawbacks:
- because of M5 they hit the field at 3 CPs = less game impact / less time for vetting
- exclusively come in bundle with M5

I really hate that bundled abilities. It is the same with the Combat Group ability (Reserve Falls + Howitzer) at USF Recon Support Company that comes at 4 CPs (!) or the Mechanized Grenadier Group (LMG Grenadiers + 250 HT) / Mechanized Assault Group (Pzgrens + 250 HT) at Ostheer Mechanized Doctrine / Mechanized Assault Doctrine that come at 3 CPs.
The worst one is the Combat Group Ability of USF, it means you can't drop your Reserve Falls behind enemy lines, because you will give away that Howitzer to the enemy.


Maybe there is a chance to get this abilities reworked. You should have the option to build the units seperatley in your base at least once you unlocked the ability. Assault Guards should be reworked somehow or just exchanged for something different.

Not for commander，but I wish add UI for some unit like Sherman to show which type ammunition are using

That's my point, you baboon... they don't have powerful infantry to supplement them, they don't have strongest HMG behind their back, they don't have cheap mobile reinforcement, or best sniper in game behind them, they scale themselves according to cost for all of that.

Judging by that perfect and briliant logic, arent USF supposed to be much stronger then UKF? If what you mentioned is a justification of how cancerous IS is, then why they are over-all stronger then Rifles and scale better and have more unitility?

You do know that VSL grens still have best HMG and sniper in game supporting them?

The best HMG, certainly, its undeniable that the MG42 is the strongest all-round MG, though HMGs become less relevant as the game drags on due to increased yellow cover, and the prevalence of things such as Rocket Arty.

But best sniper? What, in terms of availability? The Ostheer sniper fires slightly faster than the Soviet and British one (Significantly faster than the brit one at vet3), but relative to squad sizes of each faction, the Soviet sniper is actually stronger (I.E, it kills/bleeds faster). (Yes, even with VSL, and you don't have that immediately). The only thing holding the Soviet sniper back is the Soviet tech system.

If we're going from abilities, it's a little hard to determine which is more valuable between the Flare and Incendiary Shot, and the Brit sniper is in a category of its own, with its ability to damage vehicles with its autofire (generally relevant only against lights), temporarily debuff enemy vehicles with Crit Shot, and call in artillery.

Thx. Nice to point that out, i never noticed that (okay I played them once, so maybe I didn't notice because of that single try). So it fits thematically at least.

I remember they felt underwhelming as I played them. So I just tested them a few times in comparison to ShockTroops and sadly Assault Guards are worse combatwise.

So the mix of target size 1 at Vet0 + Vet1, no additional armour and no smoke grenade (or sprint) results in loosing quite a few models by closing in. They are just worse in many ways.

Further drawbacks:
- because of M5 they hit the field at 3 CPs = less game impact / less time for vetting
- exclusively come in bundle with M5

I really hate that bundled abilities. It is the same with the Combat Group ability (Reserve Falls + Howitzer) at USF Recon Support Company that comes at 4 CPs (!) or the Mechanized Grenadier Group (LMG Grenadiers + 250 HT) / Mechanized Assault Group (Pzgrens + 250 HT) at Ostheer Mechanized Doctrine / Mechanized Assault Doctrine that come at 3 CPs.
The worst one is the Combat Group Ability of USF, it means you can't drop your Reserve Falls behind enemy lines, because you will give away that Howitzer to the enemy.


Maybe there is a chance to get this abilities reworked. You should have the option to build the units seperatley in your base at least once you unlocked the ability. Assault Guards should be reworked somehow or just exchanged for something different.

Think you underestimate Assault guards, once vetted they are deadly.

You have to keep in mind that thompons and SVT have very good DPS at MID range, although they named "assault guards" they are not an typical smg squad that perform better at range close to 10.

Thompson is far better weapon than Shocks PPsh at all ranges and they unit does not have to move to range 10 to get good DPS.

You should have the option to build the units seperatley in your base at least once you unlocked the ability.

If nothing else, I definitely agree with this. Any "package" ability should allow you to build the units separately instead. You might want two Assault Guards, but why would you want two halftracks?

My wishlist for an upcoming patch:

1. Buff or exchange meme commander abilities (for example plane strafes that deal next to no damage inspite of the fact that most can be easily doged in addition)

2. Rework bad designed commanders that either have too much munition abilities or no real munition ability at all. Worst case for too much munition abilities: UKF Commandos, follow-up: Ostheer CAS and Luftwaffe Supply doctrine (which are only better because of the fuel to munition exchange ability, which makes sense with so much munition depended abilities). Take a look a Commando doctrine. Using all commander abilities just once means to spend 510 munition. In addition UKF has many ways to spend its munition already (mines, upgraded weapons, grenades (Commandos!), squad upgrades,...). A horribly designed commander.
On the other side you will find a least one commander at each faction where the only commander ability that cost somehow munition is trash. This is awful in high ressource games (3vs3 and 4vs4).
Commanders need to have a mix of passive abilities and abilities which need different types of ressources.

3. Remove commander offmap flare abilities and fill in other ways of unit depended recon or counterable plane recon (OKW+UKF).

4. More consistent damage over a wider AOE for Calliope and Walking Stuka with lower wiping AOE (80dmg distance).

5. Standardize soviet ressource drops to german version of Supply drop at mun/fuel ressource points. Soviet version is not counterable at all or gets shot down every time in dependance of the map and gamemode.

6. Combine multiple doctrinal unit upgrades in one commander ability. Many doctrinal unit upgrades (weapons/abilities) are not worth a commander ability slot on their own. Bundle two of them to make place for an additional commander ability. Similar to Assault package at Feuersturm doctrine or Urban assault Kits at Urban Assault Company.
Just one examples: I would bundle some of the tank upgrades at OKW Elite Armored Doctrine. Two of them are not worth it on their own at least.

7. Have a look at CP requirements. Just one example: I don't get while PPSH for conscripts comes at 2 CPs while you get multiple doctrinal assault units at 0 CPs at other factions. As soviet you can have SVT for conscripts for 1 CP, PPSH for Penals at 1 CP and the perfect elite close combat unit at 2 CPs. Why do PPSH for conscripts even have a CP requirement at all, its not that they are free?

8. Every doctrinal bundled unit call-in should give the option to build the units seperately at according tech structure.

Think you underestimate Assault guards, once vetted they are deadly.

You have to keep in mind that thompons and SVT have very good DPS at MID range, although they named "assault guards" they are not an typical smg squad that perform better at range close to 10.

Thompson is far better weapon than Shocks PPsh at all ranges and they unit does not have to move to range 10 to get good DPS.

An elite close to midrange unit that comes bundled only at 3 CPs with target size 1 resulting in a huge manpower drain? Man that is really bad. Since its comes with zero utility/versatility (compare to the utility/versatility of the other two guard versions please) the only thing it should be good at is combat but it just drains your manpower.

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6. Combine multiple doctrinal unit upgrades in one commander ability. Many doctrinal unit upgrades (weapons/abilities) are not worth a commander ability slot on their own. Bundle two of them to make place for an additional commander ability. Similar to Assault package at Feuersturm doctrine or Urban assault Kits at Urban Assault Company.
Just one examples: I would bundle some of the tank upgrades at OKW Elite Armored Doctrine. Two of them are not worth it on their own at least.
...

I disagree

Either all abilities should of the same power level or total power of abilities in commander should be about equal to other commanders.

Since making all commander abilities the same power level is not really an option "weak" abilities are need to fill commander with strong abilities.

I disagree

Either all abilities should of the same power level or total power of abilities in commander should be about equal to other commanders.

Since making all commander abilities the same power level is not really an option "weak" abilities are need to fill commander with strong abilities.

I would agree with you if Elite Armored Doctrine would be a strong commander, but Sturmtiger is only situational good.

An elite close to midrange unit that comes bundled only at 3 CPs with target size 1 resulting in a huge manpower drain? Man that is really bad. Since its comes with zero utility/versatility (compare to the utility/versatility of the other two guard versions please) the only thing it should be good at is combat but it just drains your manpower.

Test Vet 3 A.G. in cheat mode vs other squads and you will see who gets drained.

Allow me to remind you that Thompson paras start with 0.95 target size and get to 0.71 at vet 3 and AG start 1 and get with 0.71 at vet 2. In addition at vet 3 AG have +15% more accuracy bonus.

They are simply are not meant to be used as Shock troops.

And soviet can build m5 themselves

Test Vet 3 A.G. in cheat mode vs other squads and you will see who get drained.

Until you get them to Vet2 where they get target size 0.71 you are definitely the one who gets drained. Other elite units get even better target size with Vet. I would still question that.

In addition you have always to purchase a M5 with them... resulting in very high manpower costs if you want more than one.

I disagree

Does that mean you agree with me about the other seven aspects?

Until you get them to Vet2 where they get target size 0.71 you are definitely the one who gets drained. Other elite units get even better target size with Vet. I would still question that.

Again compare them to paras. Target size 1 vs 0.95 and at vet 2 0.71 vs 0.95.

Unless in your opinion paras bleed too much also.

(edited typo)

In addition you have always to purchase a M5 with them... resulting in very high manpower costs if you want more than one.

The combination is dirty if you consider that you get a unit close to SMG US Paras and vehicle for no MU cost and relatively low manpower.

It is true that is not very easy to get multiple squads but the unit is simply not bad.