[Winter Balance Update] UKF Feedback

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 13:23 PMSupport Sapper

and all you have said about them uptill then was EHP

i suggest you actually use them in live game to get a grip of what they are now, then may be provide some replay of your "tests"? a couple of k dmg again AI or some win on empty test map mean very little.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 13:23 PMSupport Sapper

a ton of munition for a mediocer performance and locking out the comet isnt "drawbacks", sure, im done with this.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 13:23 PMSupport Sapper

there are nothing wrong with the fact that an unit can punch above there weight with that kind of invesment, i pay triple the amount of munition to get similar lever of performance.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 13:31 PMVipper

I live the are build in T1 and heavy sapper have moving penalty both changes are a huge buff to them.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 13:31 PMVipper

The upgrade at 60 mu for repair speed, weapons and armor is one of the cheapest upgrade in game.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 13:31 PMVipper

Comet/Churchill are separate issues.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 13:31 PMVipper

In the preview there are no real drawback in getting the upgrade and still remain a badly desing upgrade.

The unit perform above it cost and role with heavy Sapper upgrade alone, it does need any other weapons upgrades, that 3 weapons option is simply the icing on the cake.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 13:53 PMSupport Sapper

apart from the moving speed debuff, all other stat is the same, meaning the EHP and dmg output is the same, and in live they dont create any issues/complain about combat performance with 3 lmg setup.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 13:53 PMSupport Sapper

The repair is on par with other engie, and the combat performance of it ALONE is nothing special.

the tech path to get to heavy engineer is related.

and what exactly match up that a heavy sapper with an vicker K alone can stand up for ?
The upgrade alone provide a solid combo, but doesnt dis out any thing special COMBAT-WISE (as you mostly concern about their combat capable), and if more weapon upgrads are stacked up, the cost kick in and is a drawback.

i will make it clear, being badly designed and being broken/OP are two difference thing that you are trying to mix up when picking up my line and assuming that we share opinion. And, you are deflecting away from the part that you have to provide your replay on testing that prove the OP in heavy sapper 3 lmgs combat performance.

Jump back to quoted post22 Dec 2020, 22:49 PMVipper

With the changes to Sapper heavy sapper upgrades with 3 weapons + minespweers need to be look at.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 13:58 PMVipper

The moving speed penalty is enough to keep the unit from fighting effectively.

I am not mixing anything up and I have not claim the the upgrade is "broken", that simply katitof.

This is my original post which I think you agree:

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 20:14 PMKatitof

Show Spoiler

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 21:10 PMVipper

Here is a little and game stat from a preview game.

https://www.coh2.org/file/19332/heavy-sapper1.jpg

https://www.coh2.org/file/19331/heavy-sapper-2.jpg

19 kill and 652% efficiency

Now feel free to install the game, use the RO.E and prove that "are very bad in actual combat" as you claim.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 21:14 PMKatitof

Is this some kind of early April fools joke?

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 21:16 PMVipper

once more you are projecting (because you are an April fools joke)

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 21:34 PMKatitof

Show Spoiler

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 21:46 PMVipper

Still waiting for any test done by you that backs your claim that "are very bad in actual combat". Until then pls stop quoting me.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 21:48 PMKatitof

I just did and posted the results.
It shows that pioneers perform much better then upgraded REs as you can see if you compare our screenshots.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 21:49 PMVipper

Seriously now, have played a single preview game?

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 21:49 PMVipper

Because my stat come from actual 2vs2 preview game.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 21:50 PMKatitof

Ofc, how do you think I got these pio numbers up for you so we can compare which one is more efficient?
Its clearly pios despite your claims.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 21:10 PMVipper

Here is a little and game stat from a preview game.

https://www.coh2.org/file/19332/heavy-sapper1.jpg

https://www.coh2.org/file/19331/heavy-sapper-2.jpg

19 kill and 652% efficiency

Now feel free to install the game, use the RO.E and prove that "are very bad in actual combat" as you claim.

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 22:10 PMEtherealDragon

To be fair post-game efficiency scores don't prove much at all because it provides no context whatsoever for how they were used. It's pretty easy to rack up high efficiency if they are flanking support weapons and killing crews vs. equiping them with Brens and going toe to toe with other infantry or whatever. It's also doesn't say anything about the quality of the match as beating up on a lower skill opponent and racking up efficiency doesn't prove much either. Now if you have a replay of a heavy sapper death blob then by all means share it, otherwise I think we can all agree that Sappers are fine-ish combat troops but nothing about the heavy sapper buff is going to really change the fact that most people will continue to use them primarily as repair and PIAT platforms...

Jump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 22:15 PMVipper

The problem is we can not all agree that "Sappers are fine-ish combat troops" since katitof claims they:

"are very bad in actual combat"

I suggest you test vet 3 heavy sappers vs any infatry you see fit in cheat mod and see how they perform.