[Winter Balance Update] UKF Feedback

The Panther is 125 fuel now?

Is panther a generalist medium?

Comet is great, but it's not overpowered. Most of all, it's necessary to be in that state. UKF would otherwise have no ways of going forward in the late game, as they lack rocket arty and agressive infantry that can push out of cover. I've never been a fan of end-all units with no weaknesses, as tehy hinder variety, but UKF simply has no other options and limiting or nerfing Comets would simply doom the faction in longer games.

It can 1vs1 a panther,

it can not, simple as that.

it can not, simple as that.

I mean, it can 1v1 a panther.
Its just not going to win vast majority of time.

it can not, simple as that.

It's not that simple... Comet can engage it in 1v1 frontally and hope for good RNG, or simply get a bit of support and get into a winning position. But it doesn't matter whether Comet wins or not, what's important is that in your typical 1v1 engagement, neither side will risk that duel. Even if the Panther starts winning and pushes for the kill, it risks getting finished off by some other source of AT that had plenty of time to arrive on the spot, as the COmet can stall such duel for quite some time. This means Comet essentially counterweights the Panther despite its worse AT stats, while also providing quite a bit more AI power. Again, I can understand why this can be viewed as too good, but UKF simply needs it to even be able to move forward once late game army compostitions emerge.

T34/85 is better designed in this regard. It brings more AI power than Comet, but doesn't have the power to stall a fight with a Panther, it needs to gtfo once it encounters one. But SOV do have stock access to Katy and ZIS barrage, so they have other means means of breaking though late game Axis positions.

Comet is great, but it's not overpowered. Most of all, it's necessary to be in that state. UKF would otherwise have no ways of going forward in the late game, as they lack rocket arty and agressive infantry that can push out of cover. I've never been a fan of end-all units with no weaknesses, as tehy hinder variety, but UKF simply has no other options and limiting or nerfing Comets would simply doom the faction in longer games.

I disagree because Brits have a crazy amount of artillery options at stock with even 2 howitzers at base and their infantry out of cover can beat grenadiers reliably without the cover bonus .

But back to the Comet it's just a very poorly designed Jack of all trades Master of everything unit that really has no place in this game . It just cannot be balanced unless the comet is given a weakness..

The Comet should be strong I agree but in it's current form there really is no other word to describe it but overpowered.

I disagree because Brits have a crazy amount of artillery options at stock with even 2 howitzers at base and their infantry out of cover can beat grenadiers reliably without the cover bonus .

But back to the Comet it's just a very poorly designed Jack of all trades Master of everything unit that really has no place in this game . It just cannot be balanced unless the comet is given a weakness..

The Comet should be strong I agree but in it's current form there really is no other word to describe it but overpowered.

Heh, artillery options. That cost crazy muni, must be flared from an inf unit, and is the worst AoE of any heavy artillery shell. Good chuckle. Oh, and it takes forever to get on target AND has red smoke.

Dont make me start my leFH rant.

The other UKF arti is Land Matress (ive missed the MG squad i aimed at with a full min range barrage), mortar pit (its the mortar pit, dies super easy most of the time), and Sexton (the weakest and shortest ranged heavy howitzer). Though Sexton is priced for the job.

2 are doctrinal, 1 is being buffed so UKF has actual targeted indirect fire.

If they want to change Comet, they could make it like an easy8 but slightly better.
Nerf armor to 220 (so mediums have a chance to pen), nerf penetration, remove grenades. Give it better stats at lvl 2 and 3 so it scales better.
Reduce fuel cost to smth like 160-165 and population.
But I doubt such big changes will be made.

If they want to change Comet, they could make it like an easy8 but slightly better.
Nerf armor to 220 (so mediums have a chance to pen), nerf penetration, remove grenades. Give it better stats at lvl 2 and 3 so it scales better.
Reduce fuel cost to smth like 160-165 and population.
But I doubt such big changes will be made.

I think toning down it's armor will be a good place to start with Comet.

Heh, artillery options. That cost crazy muni, must be flared from an inf unit, and is the worst AoE of any heavy artillery shell. Good chuckle. Oh, and it takes forever to get on target AND has red smoke.

Dont make me start my leFH rant.

The other UKF arti is Land Matress (ive missed the MG squad i aimed at with a full min range barrage), mortar pit (its the mortar pit, dies super easy most of the time), and Sexton (the weakest and shortest ranged heavy howitzer). Though Sexton is priced for the job.

2 are doctrinal, 1 is being buffed so UKF has actual targeted indirect fire.

Artillery barrage is actually dirty cheap and certainly does not cost "crazy munition"

Artillery barrage is actually dirty cheap and certainly does not cost "crazy munition"

It's expensive for what it does, which is nothing. It's just too slow.

That would be a bonus if ukf sniper Has rof of regular sniper, it does not have rof of regular sniper, so it is not a bonus but a tradeoff, a bad tradeoff in my opinion because in most cases it is still better to not engage LV with a sniper. In my case i only use it to bleed enemy manpower, as most player do with ukf sniper.

So you want an ost sniper clone with none of the drawbacks the ost "pay" for with it? That would be too strong. Tommies are already very capable on defense so an ost clone sniper would be absolutely oppressive if not impossible to kill. Especially for OKW.
The multirole does offer something and the sniper does have base arty as well so it certainly shouldn't perform as the other snipers. Keep it unique and interesting...
Maybe buff it's absolutely and totally neutered crit shot ability. It being able to fuck with light vehicles was quite literally the point of it. I hardly see the issue in it do what it was supposed to..



As for the comet. Make it limited to one and make it worthy of that. It's supposed to be a fucking semi doctrinal elite unit. Quit ducking around and destroying it to prevent people making a bunch of em and just remove that option entirely.

It's expensive for what it does, which is nothing. It's just too slow.

And with the cancel throw when supressed, its pointless vs MGs unless they are in buildings.... but only if it breaks the building.

And the sniper unstealths long enough during throw to be supressed...

Pyro sections are for the insane Vet 1 vision these days.

Comets pretty much the only interesting unit for UKF at the moment. Would be a shame to take that away as well.

The faction has major midgame problems that this patch doesn't seem to want to address. It went after UKF's insane first 5 mins, but they still have a really crappy tier 2, a ton of crappy armor outside of the Comet, and few tools to retake ground or fight artillery battles. (Mortar pit is garbage late and always loses if made reactively. Arty calldown is trash)

And with the cancel throw when supressed, its pointless vs MGs unless they are in buildings.... but only if it breaks the building.

And the sniper unstealths long enough during throw to be supressed...

Pyro sections are for the insane Vet 1 vision these days.

The smoke calldown has the throw range of a smoke grenade but the delay of a smoke mortar barrage. Its really inefficient at what its supposed to do.

Snipers are also WAY too valuable to risk a smoke/arty calldown on. The calldowns would be way more practical on the Assault Officer.

It's expensive for what it does, which is nothing. It's just too slow.

It's not useless. Later on when there are two howis active in the base, it can be used pretty nicely to lock down a sector or to deny an area.

It's slow, and quite expensive, but situationally exceptional

As of late, I've been hearing a lot of talk about the balance on infantry sections (mostly among regular groups but it would be a lie to say it isn't a contested topic on here as well).

The argument I've noticed so far is the concern that infantry sections perform very well behind cover, which is a majority of the time if the player maneuvers properly. With brens, they can push that advantage further, which is one reason why I quite enjoy playing brits, haha.

So far, I've noticed the implementations for balance have been direct tweaks to Infantry Section stats or to adjust the cost of their investments. Both I agree with, but I recalled old concepts in the earlier years of the game that I felt like would better address the theme of the British mainline infantry while removing some of their assertive advantages behind cover in a game where cover is plentiful.

If folks recall, there used to be a buff for one of the USF commanders that provided Riflemen bonus vision while behind cover. This effect only activated when they are standing still and after a second or two. While this was ultimately scrapped as it was more or less a fairly weak bonus, the implementation of its effect is something I believe can be applied to Infantry Sections buff.

What I consider a more intriguing change to Infantry Section would be instead to maintain its current strong stats, but apply a delay on their cover bonus. This way, they can maintain the theme of a strong defensive faction, while severing the defensive bonus being applied on offense. While I am no expert nor have I the means to test such a concept for any subsantial data, I believe stock Infantry Sections could instead have the defensive buff apply only once they are behind cover for 2 seconds, while later veterancies can provide bonuses such as a shorter time (1 second or so) for the effect to take in.

tldr: Keep strong Infantry Section stats, but change cover bonus to apply only after staying in cover for some time. This helps emphasize it is meant for defense, not offense and promote faction theme.

As of late...

This will only serve to make Infantry Sections even more reliant on Bolster to be effective.

My least favourite thing about the Brits (my favourite faction) is that everything about Infantry Sections revolves around the fact that you can upgrade them at any time from an ineffective squad with less utility than Grenadiers to a very durable and dangerous mainline squad.

I've experimented this whole patch with never using Bolster but it just handicaps you severely and my wins have suffered greatly for it. I hate the way it's designed, but if the balance team or Relic is not willing to change Bolster then the British and Infantry Sections will never adequately be balanced.

tldr: Keep strong Infantry Section stats, but change cover bonus to apply only after staying in cover for some time. This helps emphasize it is meant for defense, not offense and promote faction theme.

And... how do you imagine them attacking anything?

Plus.... for the love of everything holy and unholy, they NEVER had any BONUS in cover.
They have PENALTY out of cover. How many times do we need to teach you this lesson old man?

They have 100% performance in cover only, others have 100% performance anywhere.

And... how do you imagine them attacking anything?

Plus.... for the love of everything holy and unholy, they NEVER had any BONUS in cover.
They have PENALTY out of cover. How many times do we need to teach you this lesson old man?

They have 100% performance in cover only, others have 100% performance anywhere.

Ah, fair enough. I mean, it's sort of a glass half full kinda thing, isn't it?
They are great behind cover which is hopefully the state of being that is under scrutiny.
As for how they attack, I figure that's still on the table, simply the player would have to commit to their positioning in order to make sure the Infantry Sections are putting out their best.

This will only serve to make Infantry Sections even more reliant on Bolster to be effective.

My least favourite thing about the Brits (my favourite faction) is that everything about Infantry Sections revolves around the fact that you can upgrade them at any time from an ineffective squad with less utility than Grenadiers to a very durable and dangerous mainline squad.

I've experimented this whole patch with never using Bolster but it just handicaps you severely and my wins have suffered greatly for it. I hate the way it's designed, but if the balance team or Relic is not willing to change Bolster then the British and Infantry Sections will never adequately be balanced.

They aren't as potent before bolster, but a section behind cover bolster or not is still a considerable threat to most infantry. I do think that the Infantry Sections more or less always will receive the bolster tech as they gain a definitive advantage over their mainline infantry counterparts. I also agree with the sentiment that Infantry Sections lack utility, though I specifically think of snares on that topic.