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[Winter Balance Update] OST Feedback

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5 Jan 2021, 03:36 AM
#381
avatar of mongman

Posts: 27

Alies got nerfed too. 60 range TD nerf pen vet, rocket atry got nerf reload. Cornet nerfed hard, USF Howie, M8 Scott nerfed to useless state.
is it a fair trade for brumbar nerf ?


don't be disingenuous, the allied TD's pen was already overperforming, ALL ROCKET ARTY timing nerfed, Churchill firefly and Cromwell got BUFFED and while I may agree slightly on the Scott it still needed a touch up in this patch
5 Jan 2021, 04:13 AM
#382
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5279

Not that anyone cares but like... The Brummbär armour nerf accounts for something a 3% increased pen chance... It's not the end of the world...
5 Jan 2021, 05:01 AM
#383
avatar of Olfin

Posts: 167

V5

Ostheer changes




Why u nerf the Brummbär and VSL , this doesn't look right, the Allies will have more powerful infantry in late game and they have KV-8 and Churchill Crocodile whitch are similar to Brummbär.
5 Jan 2021, 05:31 AM
#384
avatar of FunPolice

Posts: 133

Maybe this would be better suited for the next doctrine patch but I figure since this is affecting core army stuff it would be best to post it here. It's not my idea but a tldr is that with some slight cost changes in the tech of Ostheer that literally doesn't affect anything timing wise you can leave a clear place for some future buffs to stuff like the Stug IIIE and Puma.



Image from this thread https://www.coh2.org/topic/103763/ostheer-tech-restructure and a more in depth explanation there.


Beyond that has there been any consideration for a tiny buff to grenadiers? I remember seeing something about Grens getting bonus accuracy against suppressed units since Ostheer relies a lot on the MG42. It would be a slight buff to them and make them slightly more effective overall while kinda fitting the essence of the faction. I know this is a fairly devided discussion as a lot of people have varying thoughts on grens but a small buff like that shouldn't be to drastic a buff while still giving them a little more oomph.
5 Jan 2021, 06:30 AM
#385
avatar of vgfgff

Posts: 177

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 05:01 AMOlfin


Why u nerf the Brummbär and VSL , this doesn't look right, the Allies will have more powerful infantry in late game and they have KV-8 and Churchill Crocodile whitch are similar to Brummbär.


Brummbär armor should be nerf.

currently It already have good HP and with 260 armor They always run to frontline and kill infantry and support weapon by bounrcing a lot of AT shot.


5 Jan 2021, 06:34 AM
#386
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 06:30 AMvgfgff


Brummbär armor should be nerf.
currently brumbar can run to frontline and kill infantry and support weapon by bounrcing a lot of AT shot.



that is what it is meant to do. late game units, progression, positive leveling.

that is the design.

And no, it cant walk in and kill infantry and walk out like you made it sound uncounter-able

imo it is living on the edge in rank >1000 2v2. it works, you need to babysit and keep a close eye, not at all over bearing.
5 Jan 2021, 06:40 AM
#387
avatar of vgfgff

Posts: 177



that is what it is meant to do. late game units, progression, positive leveling.

that is the design.

And no, it cant walk in and kill infantry and walk out like you made it sound uncounter-able


Yes It is.
260 armor was bounced a lot AT even from SU-85. This is too hard to counter while brumbar fire 1-2shot kill whole squad.
They do have high HP that already need 5-6 shot form AT to take it down. plus they performance are better than KV2. I've test more than 10 time.

for the same thing on allies side
ISU-152 Got nerf too. both armor and range.
5 Jan 2021, 06:42 AM
#388
avatar of Olfin

Posts: 167

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 06:30 AMvgfgff


Brummbär armor should be nerf.

currently It already have good HP and with 260 armor They always run to frontline and kill infantry and support weapon by bounrcing a lot of AT shot.




It only punish blobing which is a good thing and in the time it came there would be plenty of Tanks an TDs.
5 Jan 2021, 06:42 AM
#389
avatar of vgfgff

Posts: 177



don't be disingenuous, the allied TD's pen was already overperforming, ALL ROCKET ARTY timing nerfed, Churchill firefly and Cromwell got BUFFED and while I may agree slightly on the Scott it still needed a touch up in this patch


Allies TD do have LOW speed /HP / Armour. they can get flanked easily. now with panther got acc buff it wouldn't be a problem anymore.
5 Jan 2021, 06:43 AM
#390
avatar of vgfgff

Posts: 177

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 06:42 AMOlfin


It only punish blobing which is a good thing and in the time it came there would be plenty of Tanks an TDs.


It is too good if we combine with other in same roles.
other AI tank arrived in this timimg too. KV2 / ISU-152 are more lately.

5 Jan 2021, 06:45 AM
#391
avatar of Olfin

Posts: 167

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 06:40 AMvgfgff


Yes It is.
260 armor was bounced a lot AT even from SU-85. This is too hard to counter while brumbar fire 1-2shot kill whole squad.
They do have high HP that already need 5-6 shot form AT to take it down. plus they performance are better than KV2. I've test more than 10 time.

for the same thing on allies side
ISU-152 Got nerf too. both armor and range.


Then KV-8 and Churchill Crocodile need to be nerfed too they bounce alote and the crocodile bounce more than the Brummbär.
5 Jan 2021, 06:51 AM
#392
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 06:40 AMvgfgff


Yes It is.
260 armor was bounced a lot AT even from SU-85. This is too hard to counter while brumbar fire 1-2shot kill whole squad.
They do have high HP that already need 5-6 shot form AT to take it down. plus they performance are better than KV2. I've test more than 10 time.

for the same thing on allies side
ISU-152 Got nerf too. both armor and range.


brumbar is slow and spin around
its cannon range is 35 and need to manual fire and slow reload. against sov 6 man teams, brumbar hardly 1-2 wipe. It hits hard enough (if you stand still!) to force you to retreat.

su85 has 60 range and 35 sight. su85 also have vet sight.
su85 easily ward off brumbar without the armor nerf.

again i disagree with the 1-2-3 nerfs to ostt-vsl-brumbar.
basically kills ost late infantry game..again!

if the mod teams want to close the gap between late game strenghts and compress all units performance for eek-sports. Then they need to look at allies elite infantry and heavy AI tanks too!

Why always Ost?
5 Jan 2021, 06:59 AM
#393
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

when i field a brumbar, i dont think of a i-win unit.

it is to have a counter to pressure late games vetted allies units. and highly depending on the maps with blockers.

at the same time, i know i need to micro it. a loss of attention, due to its field timings, it will be gone in seconds to snare, 60TD and ATG wall.

in short, nerf is totally unjustified!
5 Jan 2021, 07:02 AM
#394
avatar of vgfgff

Posts: 177

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 06:45 AMOlfin


KV-8 and Churchill Crocodile need to be nerfed too they bounce alote and the crocodile bounce more than the Brummbär.


Maybe Churchill Crocodile armor but
KV-8 armor are already weaker than brumbar (240 vs 260(250 inpreview)) and bothare doctrinal unit.
5 Jan 2021, 07:04 AM
#395
avatar of vgfgff

Posts: 177



brumbar is slow and spin around
its cannon range is 35 and need to manual fire and slow reload. against sov 6 man teams, brumbar hardly 1-2 wipe. It hits hard enough (if you stand still!) to force you to retreat.

su85 has 60 range and 35 sight. su85 also have vet sight.
su85 easily ward off brumbar without the armor nerf.

again i disagree with the 1-2-3 nerfs to ostt-vsl-brumbar.
basically kills ost late infantry game..again!

if the mod teams want to close the gap between late game strenghts and compress all units performance for eek-sports. Then they need to look at allies elite infantry and heavy AI tanks too!

Why always Ost?


Allies AI tank got nerfed too.
Scott/T70 got hard nerf in preview patch.
OST got passive reinforce reduction and gren with 3 also got -20% received damage.
5 Jan 2021, 07:05 AM
#396
avatar of Smartie

Posts: 857 | Subs: 2

I understand that you nerf op VSL and Osttruppen. But you should combine it with a buff for standard Grens.
Right now you are fighting the symptoms but dont cure the disease.
And it's fair to ask why Ost doctrinal units are rightfully nerfed when op allied elite infantry call-in units are still untouched.
5 Jan 2021, 07:06 AM
#397
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 07:02 AMvgfgff


Maybe Churchill Crocodile armor but
KV-8 armor are already weaker than brumbar (240 vs 260(250 inpreview)) and bothare doctrinal unit.


kv8 has higher health, stronger rear armor, faster and turret that can switch between flames and rounds.

yes it is a doc units, but somehow not limited to 1.

but the point is, the purpose of brumbar nerf came out of nowhere. and we should apply equally to allies heavy AI in that case. <444>_<444>
5 Jan 2021, 07:06 AM
#398
avatar of Olfin

Posts: 167

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 07:02 AMvgfgff


Maybe Churchill Crocodile armor but
KV-8 armor are already weaker than brumbar (240 vs 260(250 inpreview)) and bothare doctrinal unit.


Commanders units should give other strategy to the faction ,and not being OP.
maybe KV-8 is alright but the Churchill Crocodile is too strong and hard to counter.
5 Jan 2021, 07:08 AM
#399
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

I understand that you nerf op VSL and Osttruppen. But you should combine it with a buff for standard Grens.
Right now you are fighting the symptoms but dont cure the disease.
And it's fair to ask why Ost doctrinal units are rightfully nerfed when op allied elite infantry call-in units are still untouched.


bascially so.

doctrine ostt and vsl got ripped apart. 7man cons got some rotation. penals got buffed. shocks, commandos, guards, assualt enginee, sniper pathfinders, officers...allies infantry still OP

now brumbar nerf from the heavens!

and the plan to nerf pgrens is coming!
5 Jan 2021, 07:10 AM
#400
avatar of vgfgff

Posts: 177



kv8 has higher health, stronger rear armor, faster and turret that can switch between flames and rounds.

yes it is a doc units, but somehow not limited to 1.

but the point is, the purpose of brumbar nerf came out of nowhere. and we should apply equally to allies heavy AI in that case. <444>_<444>



Allies stock AI tank got nerfed too. T70/M8.
by the way.
KV-8 not fire 1 devastating shot like brumbar or KV-2.

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