Conscript 7th men too much?

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 02:15 AMSkysTheLimit

What is the relevance of this? Both in general and especially to the example of lmg grens vs conscripts?

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 02:15 AMSkysTheLimit

Ostrupp lmg and 7 men con are unlocked at such similar times that whether one comes earlier will depend on build choice

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 07:13 AMKatitof

Yes, cheaper things tend to be worse, Mr balance developer from Wish.
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Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 07:13 AMKatitof

Yes, cheaper things tend to be worse, Mr balance developer from Wish.



In vaccuum of the void maybe.

Compared to literally any other weapon upgrade at long range, its a joke increase. It is still an increase, but it gets outperformed badly even by a singular DP.

Sooooo no, its not substantial in any way.
But then again, DPS increase is not the strength of the upgrade given how even osttruppen LMG perform twice as good at long range.

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 08:12 AMSerrith

Proportionally it is compared to volks Stg44, a single BAR, all G43s at mid and long range, the SVT upgrade for cons. Basically all your midrange stuff.

Yeah a general purpose upgrade is worse at long range then dedicated long range weapon upgrades. But then the 7man conscript upgrade is superior mid range to close range over LMGs in terms of damage increase.

Thing is unlike most weapon upgrades, the 7man upgrade gives a substantial DPS boost at ALL ranges.

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 09:08 AMVipper

One has to consider also another factor. The fact the since there have so many more entities there are more conscript entities focus firing on single entity making them die faster.

The performance vs other mainlines when vet 3 and in cover as I have seen them in test seem to be too good.

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 07:47 AMVipper

It a direct response to this claim:
"It comes the absolute latest and also locks out the possibilities of any other weapon, even dropped ones. I think all is fair in what 7 man brings considering its rather large offsets."

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 07:47 AMVipper

Ostheer T4 is a higher Tier building.

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 07:47 AMVipper

I would suggest that people test how 7 men conscripts perform vs grenadier/vgs in cheat mod before claiming that this upgrade is in an ideal place.

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 14:26 PMSkysTheLimit

It does come at the absolute latest. Tell me how could it be delayed any later in the Soviet tech tree? It can't, it's in the final tier
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Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 14:26 PMSkysTheLimit

I've been using them and playing against them in game for a while now. So has everyone else...

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 14:53 PMVipper

The claim is "absolute latest" not "absolute latest as soviets", that is simply false

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 14:53 PMVipper

Using the timing as an excuse for the performance is simply not enough since the timing can easily change.

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 14:53 PMVipper

Since you have used them in your opinion how many fight would vet 3 7m conscripts would win vs vet 5 VG in heavy cover and long range and how many model would they lose on average?

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 08:12 AMSerrith

Thing is unlike most weapon upgrades, the 7man upgrade gives a substantial DPS boost at ALL ranges.

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 15:11 PMSkysTheLimit

It's not simply false though. As I have also said multiple times, the actual timing is so similar that build order determines which comes first

It's the latest it could be in the current tech structure. If you want to redesign to the soviet tech structure even more because of one upgrade, I'm pretty sure you will be alone in that idea

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 15:11 PMSkysTheLimit

What??? You're the one who wants to change the timing. What kind of circular logic is that


Seriously? I literally said I used them in game and then your comeback is "tell me exactly how many models die in this specific engagement that I have tested in cheatmods"

Tell me, how often in game do squads get manually placed at exactly max range, in heavy cover, facing each other, and then start shooting each other with no positioning during combat involved?

Are the volks going to leave cover to throw a flame made? As they almost always do to fight anything in heavy cover?

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 16:14 PMVipper

This a simple fact accept it and move on (or do not accept it fine by me), I am done arguing about it.

The are other upgrade that come later than this upgrade like LMG/ OstruppenLMG for Obers/FG44 and cost reduction for Ostheer infatry.

Jump back to quoted post16 Oct 2020, 16:14 PMVipper

(but you might want to test anyway and get a better opinion on the matter)