USF pop cap problem

You can easily solve this problem by not being a fucking camper against USF and actually engaging in combat to generate attrition instead of sitting there behind elephant, doing absolutely nothing despite being maxed pop already.

Lmao, instead of calling out something that is actually wrong, you attack the player by calling him a "fucking camper". You really are a gem of this community.

Notice : This is 5 (FIVE) years ago.
https://community.companyofheroes.com/discussion/124362/whats-the-deal-with-the-usf-population-number-when-you-take-crews-out-of-vehicles

MikeHaggar
Posts: 635

Anyone notice this? I'm not really sure what to make of it.

Like you'll have some vehicles, and your pop is at like 98/100, so you can't call in any more vehicles. Then if you order the vehicle crews to get out of their vehicles, your population will drop to say 80/100. Then you call in the other vehicle. Then you put all your guys back in their vehicles, and your population is now like 120/100.

I guess it's because uncrewed vehicles don't belong to any faction, but crewed vehicles need a higher pop # to account for their superiority, and vehicle crews need a low pop cap because they can lose their vehicles and are crappy units on their own. But it just seems kind of unfair that no other faction can do this, and it isn't a very elegant solution. Seems like they could give uncrewed vehicles a static pop value until they are captured by the enemy or destroyed. It just feels a bit exploit-y.

======
Answer:

Tablemat
Posts: 270

Zupadupadude wrote: »
The vehicle's popcap should be tied to the crew. I think it might be possible with SCAR.

Exit vehicle, march high pop crew off to enemy base (sacrifice them), crew vehicle with Rear Echelon. Alternatively, crew exits to repair, vehicle gets blown, you now have a 'Rear Echelon' equivalent squad eating a disproportionate amount of pop.


As TheSoldier mentioned, this only really comes into play in highly dubious scenarios (ie. sitting back building a horde whilst the enemy presumably is afk/slaughtering your undermanned team).

There is no simple fix, because the problem is artificially created (as mentioned above). Also note, that in going over the pop cap with this method, reinforcing standard infantry squads would become a micro intensive and risky chore.

=========

Lmao, instead of calling out something that is actually wrong, you attack the player by calling him a "fucking camper". You really are a gem of this community.

Yea, but he's right. It's quite difficult to do this as USF.
He has to uncrew all his tanks, basically. If you hit him with rockets while all his infantry is out,
you now have ~10 uncrewed tanks you can easily now take over for free.

https://community.companyofheroes.com/discussion/245874/usf-exploit-breaks-the-game

USF EXPLOIT BREAKS THE GAME.
#1
9 months ago
R2V2
R2V2
Posts: 5

When a USF player decrews a tank the players pop no longer includes the cost of the tank. I have just seen someone with 137 pop cap.

When challenged on this ingame they replied "US has no pop cap" admitting they had used this exploit and had been planning to use it.

Until this is fixed playing as AXIS is pointless .

Tagged: USF Multiplayer exploit

Severely lowering manpower income when over 100 pop is the simplest and least contrived solution I've heard yet. I hope such a thing is possible with CoH2's engine.

Those who think pop cap abuse is only relevant against campers are simply wrong. I especially see allot of Korean top players abuse it whenever they can to get triple Jacksons or Pershing + double Jackson. I might return with some example casts once I get home.

Stop all manpower income after 110 pop cap and there’s no more problems.

Another option could be introducing vehicle specific crews, like 'Jackson crew','Sherman crew', etc, similar to how the M20 had it's own crew, each having the exact same pop as the vehicle they came with.
(Just a quick idea, haven't considered yet if it can be exploited somehow)

Severely lowering manpower income when over 100 pop is the simplest and least contrived solution I've heard yet. I hope such a thing is possible with CoH2's engine.

Those who think pop cap abuse is only relevant against campers are simply wrong. I especially see allot of Korean top players abuse it whenever they can to get triple Jacksons or Pershing + double Jackson. I might return with some example casts once I get home.

Thankfully we are not living in an M10 meta.
Relives memories of 3/5 M10 uncrewed in base waiting to hunt some shit Sprice style.

Thankfully we are not living in an M10 meta.
Relives memories of 3/5 M10 uncrewed in base waiting to hunt some shit Sprice style.

I was remembering the exact same thing in a few patches ago, when M10 commander was good.

A lot of pro players in 1v1 tournament games were abusing M10 pop-caping, just sitting them in the base, waiting for a hunt.

Another option could be introducing vehicle specific crews, like 'Jackson crew','Sherman crew', etc, similar to how the M20 had it's own crew, each having the exact same pop as the vehicle they came with.
(Just a quick idea, haven't considered yet if it can be exploited somehow)

I think that denying the recrew is an easier option to implement.

I think that denying the recrew is an easier option to implement.

That would defy one of the reasons there is a crew at all in USF vehicles. Get your light vehicle crew into your mid-late game tanks.

How about making decrewed tanks still belong to the USF player? This way when the crew hops out the enemy doesn’t have to attack move it, and the decrewed vehicle can use up the difference between the crew and crewed tank’s pop cap

Severely lowering manpower income when over 100 pop is the simplest and least contrived solution I've heard yet. I hope such a thing is possible with CoH2's engine.

Those who think pop cap abuse is only relevant against campers are simply wrong. I especially see allot of Korean top players abuse it whenever they can to get triple Jacksons or Pershing + double Jackson. I might return with some example casts once I get home.

===========
Zupadupadude wrote: »
The vehicle's popcap should be tied to the crew. I think it might be possible with SCAR.

Exit vehicle, march high pop crew off to enemy base (sacrifice them), crew vehicle with Rear Echelon. Alternatively, crew exits to repair, vehicle gets blown, you now have a 'Rear Echelon' equivalent squad eating a disproportionate amount of pop.
============
Other solution is to make it so uncrewed vehicles keep their pop.
So 0 crew Jackson for 16 pop. Gets captured by German. German's pop does not increase,
but original America builder still gets shafted for -16 pop. Crew has it's own full value
pop value, so -32 pop per Jackson. Also make Germans have more Panthers than Americans have
tanks. Historical. Stellar.

I think that denying the recrew is an easier option to implement.

How about removing de-crew from all american units?
This way, USF ends up with less vehicles late-game than German players?

How about giving USF tanks the same costs and stats and abilities as German tanks?
Give gren +1 model, give them G43 with same stats as M1 Garand. All commanders identical.
Give Pershing Tiger-stats.

Wouldn't that be an elegant solution?
Also reduce Jackson range to 50, but give it 3x MGs, Panther armor and health and costs.

Perfect. No more arguing.
Mirror-stat factions.

Would this please you?

Note : Pershing, Priest, Callioppe Shermans don't have de-crew ability.
And the buff would seriously improve the Pershing. What do you say?
I can't wait to see Jackson with up-armor and health and hulldown (Having 60+ range anyways).

Just say yes.

Make units unable to crew tanks at 105-110 pop, ez fix.

i think usf needs a small buffer above 100 so they dont accidently reinforce too many models while their tanks are repairing

If it was me balancing I’d stop all manpower income when a faction has over 110 pop cap.

You'd need to add the Ardennes Assault ability to dismiss units in your HQ sector, but that aside this is something that should definitely be in the game.

That would defy one of the reasons there is a crew at all in USF vehicles. Get your light vehicle crew into your mid-late game tanks.

Sorry, I expressed wrong. I tried to write deny the recrew only when the pop cap is 100+.