COH2 winter balance mod - discussion

I'm not sure, but i think OKW can't get a 250, or scopes.

Of course not, I'm just comparing the utility each gives. Scopes are in a lot of very popular docs, and can be put on pretty much anything. Meanwhile this gives the same (or less) utility, but is a dedicated unit - so it has an MP/Fuel/Pop cost.

I've done some tests and here's my feedback.

Let's start with UKF:

-Smoke barrage addition to Pyrotechnics IS is definitely great but I think cost should be increased since it doesn't require IS throwing a flare and arrives fast. Something like 40 munitions is a good price for an ability that has so much range and doesn't work like flares/grenades but works as a call-in. If we consider the newly added Medic upgrade to the T0, everyone might start to go for Pyrotechnics IS and it might be too OP.

-While we're talking about T0 medics, I think something like Soviet HQ medics would work better than the current implementation. Everyone will just keep their medics on their base anyways, there's no point in making them mobile.

-Airlanding Officer is too OP. Back then when he was in an overpriced doctrinal ability that nobody uses, his abilities were okay but now that it's added without the glider and as a stock unit, no less, free Officer Charge and 30 munitions for the best Recon Sweep are too much on top a Gammon Bomb. Gammon Bomb should stay since it's an assault squad but Recon Sweep definitely needs a price increase and Officer Charge shouldn't be free.

-HQ Glider is just fine. It works as a Commando Glider now but with Medics and FRP for 100MP (Both of them nullified the instant Glider is destroyed). It's still a big target, its HP depends heavily on the location it lands on and it can be killed with small-arms fire. There's no need to buff/nerf it further.

Now, let's get to the worst part of the patch: Fragmentation vs Cluster bombs.

-Fragmentation Bombs now arrives way faster than it was before, it's practically impossible to completely dodge them on the edge of the map even if you start dodging the moment you see the red flares. I don't think that's fair at all. Fragmentation Bombs, unlike Cluster Bombs hit the enemy instantly the moment they're dropped from the plane and it's guareented to wipe anything with a flesh on the line. Buffing the speed of the plane to 275 is way too much. I think something like 225 should suffice.

-Cluster Bombs are now completely easy-to-dodge. I'm sad that Recon Support is nerfed twice and given nothing in return but at least Cluster Bombs are balanced for their price now, I guess.

Some bugs I want to report btw:

-For some reason, Paratrooper Support Squad has 28 reinforce cost in the Winter patch. False alarm. It was 28MP all along. Thanks to RepoRogue for correcting me.

-Falls can't capture points any longer. I can understand an elite squad such as Falls shouldn't have snares but taking away their ability to capture points? Isn't that too much? Lol False alarm, I just tried spawning them through the ability rather than the control panel and there is no problem.

-Tiger, just like King Tiger, no longer appears on the commander abilities when the commander is selected and only appears when all HQs are deployed. Now, this isn't a big problem but I think people will be shocked (I did, lol) when they see this after patch is implemented. So, letting it appear on abilities but locking it with a "All HQs need to be deployed." notice ,just like you did with other factions, is the best option. Although, this isn't a priority.

Because now you don't need to fight at long range. You can just move your blob around to chase wipes, because one of the effects of this change is that Tommies will be much better at wiping squads on the retreat.

That's just not how tommy blobs function.

Again. Tommy blobs were strong because they sat and fired from max range (and had good durability, but that's already addressed). They were the best at this because they had the best long range DPS of any core squad in the game. This ideal use case is why they were strong.

Now you're suggesting that they're not going to be used at max range, and are going to be used aggressively to close in. In this use case, they are simply worse than volks and riflemen.

A moving tommy blob is worse than a moving volks/riflemen blob. Having a moving tommy blob means entirely giving up on the reason why tommies are blobbed in the first place.

-For some reason, Paratrooper Support Squad has 28 reinforce cost in the Winter patch.

Just to be clear, this is what they cost to reinforce on live, along with regular Paratroopers.

Just to be clear, this is what they cost to reinforce on live, along with regular Paratroopers.

Thanks for correcting me, I thought since they're elite squads, they cost more to reinforce like Shocks/Guards.

Thanks for correcting me, I thought since they're elite squads, they cost more to reinforce like Shocks/Guards.

They're relatively fragile on a per model basis for elite infantry, which is why they're relatively cheap to reinforce. I also think it was done to push their power level in comparison to Rangers.

Alright! Looks like some of my UKF redesign made it in:
-Pyrotechnic Supplies smoke barrage
-WASP armor to 7

And similar:
-more healing options
-Close range squad in Platoon CP

I think that will help UKF a lot. I would also suggest changing the Cromwell's Near AoE radius to .375 or .5 from its current, terrible, .25. Still lower than other mediums this way.

Bug report,UKF officer can not pick up slot item,and UKF medic don't automatic heal

Some things I think need to be looked into:

-Panther veterancy

-Comets

-IRHT being saved by heavy engine crit (bug kinda)

-IRHT cost and HP

-Soviet AT rocket strafe

-stuka dive bomb (make it come faster but add flares?)

-axis casemates penetration

-Jackson (again)

-ostwind power/cost ratio

-m2HB 50 cal pintle mounts (cost 70 muni, unsure how much better than MG42 pintle)

-USF airborne P47s

-USF Rifle co

-IS2 frontal armor (basically the main issue of the axis casemates pen problems)

-MG bunkers costing 0 popcap

-soviet repair bays having no limit

-soviet advanced warfare IL-2 sturmovik attacks indicator being offcenter still (I think)

-JP4 vet 5 still 99% useless

-JT vet 5 still 100% useless

-G43 potential nerfs

-spec ops flares nerfs

-pfusi grenades have no callout

-soviet PTAB

-bundling molotov and AT grenade for cons?

-landmattress vet 2 potentially not working, if not, should be removed and given proper vet. -10% barrage CD or +10% rocket delivery speed or something.

-landmattress vet requirements should be looked at

and Officer Charge shouldn't be free.

The Officer Charge was changed to behave like the USF Captain's On Me!. It's no longer the aura buff.

-IS2 frontal armor (basically the main issue of the axis casemates pen problems)

IS-2 armor was changed from 375 to 340.

IS-2 armor was changed from 375 to 340.

It's a start, not enough IMO.

The Officer Charge was changed to behave like the USF Captain's On Me!. It's no longer the aura buff.

That's right but as far as I tested, you can use it on non-supressed squads unlike Captain's ability which requires a specific condition to buff an unit. On top of that, buffs it gives are powerful. As it is now, there isn't any reason for UKF player to not spam this ability as soon as its cooldown ends.

Also, I noticed that the sprint only applies for first few seconds, is this intended or a bug?

That's right but as far as I tested, you can use it on non-supressed squads unlike Captain's ability which requires a specific condition to buff an unit.

On Me! doesn't require the target unit to be suppressed, it's just useful for that purpose.

The concept behind the IR HT change is good, but the execution is lackluster. It's inferior to things that aren't dedicated recon units like the T70, Valentine, or even Pyrotechnic Tommies in cover.

Sight range needs to go up quite a bit to be worth the cost/popcap. Also, consider making it able to camo like the New Ost commander HT ability, or give it shared vet and work in bonuses that way.

I think the biggest issues that were not addressed yet is the horrible Soviet IL2 AT rocket strafe and SVT Cons. Both are insanely OP in this patch. T34+Ram deletes expensive Axis tanks way too easily, including Panthers and Tigers.

SVT Cons are cheaper than Volks yet have more combat power, can merge and on top have urra. It's broken as fuck. SVT Cons bully STG Volks as I pointed out weeks ago and it shouldn't be like that considering price and utility.

On top of that you can airdrop SVTs to your Soviet teammate and also supply him with Dhsk. It's just too good overall.

Then we have the USF Scott cancer that is going on unchecked even though basically everyone agrees the Scott needs to be less durable. 3 ATG hits + smoke is just too much for a unit with this range and price. I made a threat about it and literally everyone except one USF fanboy agreed. Maybe the balance team can look into it?

It's a start, not enough IMO.

I think it's better to keep these kinds of changes small and see what happens, and if needed adjust later, rather than immediately slapping on a big reduction. -35 armor will increase the most common Axis AT weapons' chance to pen by 5% (f.e. from 45% to 50%) which can be quite a significant increase overall. Only time will tell. I find that Axis AT feels much better against the ISU-152 (340 armor) so I hope the decrease will feel significant enough. If it doesn't, we can always lower it further in the next iterations/patch. But we're trying to avoid the infamous tripple nerfs here.

so IS now just as good on the move as other squads so rip their only weakness

SU gets some nerf with late cons will see how they do now

RIP falls doctrine, was never used and will never be used again with this straight nerf with no compensation, the half truck is finally fixed but is probably dead too , at least let it reinforce and increase the price , now it can't see trough obstacles and has a PAID VERSION OF THE KUBEL MAP HACK, just build a kubel instead it cost 0 fuel not fucking 10

OST tier 4 still untouched while brits get a bunch of early game buffs

USF while being the best faction in the last 3 tournament continues to receive no nerf and get's buffed, well gonna enjoy me some more free wins

edit: kubel :Name: "Detection"
Duration: Toggle Ability
Cost: Free

+20 camouflage detection radius.
-50% speed.
Will reveal units in the mini-map out to 70 range.

vs the meme truck
New ability: Detection – Spot nearby units around the half-track on the mini-map for 30 seconds. 15 munitions and 60 seconds recharge.

The IR ht change makes this a good patch in my eyes before I even look at anything else in depth.

On the whole it seems like a solid patch.

Would still like call in flares (across all factions) to be replaced with recon plane.

Also MG bunkers should have a pop cost (mainly a teamgame issue)

Otherwise, looks good.

Why assault IS have rifle squad scaling instead of SMG squad scaling(aka higher RA and lower acc)?

Some things I think need to be looked into:

-Panther veterancy

-Comets

-IRHT being saved by heavy engine crit (bug kinda)

-IRHT cost and HP

-Soviet AT rocket strafe

-stuka dive bomb (make it come faster but add flares?)

-axis casemates penetration

-Jackson (again)

-ostwind power/cost ratio

-m2HB 50 cal pintle mounts (cost 70 muni, unsure how much better than MG42 pintle)

-USF airborne P47s

-USF Rifle co

-IS2 frontal armor (basically the main issue of the axis casemates pen problems)

-MG bunkers costing 0 popcap

-soviet repair bays having no limit

-soviet advanced warfare IL-2 sturmovik attacks indicator being offcenter still (I think)

-JP4 vet 5 still 99% useless

-JT vet 5 still 100% useless

-G43 potential nerfs

-spec ops flares nerfs

-pfusi grenades have no callout

-soviet PTAB

-bundling molotov and AT grenade for cons?

Also, double post but I just need to say +1