Overpowered Maxim Video Evidence

Except for the maxim.. its a squad in its own right and needs no support. I said molatov has a decent chance of it, ie if the mg gunner dies, the next man runs in burns and dies, nect one runs in.. even if u hit retreat.

It needs no support if you act like the guy in the video and do the braindead equivalent of the Persians in 300. A modicum of tactics (IE flanking) renders the Maxim useless if its unsupported. It's also worthless against any vehicle, which can get build in T2, 5 minutes into the game.

Sorry. But anyone who complains of the Maxim being OP, or (heavens forbid) loses to Maximspam, needs to get better at the game. Simple as that.

Sorry. But anyone who complains of the Maxim being OP, or (heavens forbid) loses to Maximspam, needs to get better at the game. Simple as that.

I think most people here aren´t complaining about an OP Maxim but an UP MG42. As of now it can´t fight on it´s own. If you always have to support it, you sacrifice a lot of mobility: Not enough that you didn´t build a Grenadier for that 240MP - no, you need another Grenadier to babysit your MG. And even then it´s performance is rather "meh".

I´m better off getting out two Grenadiers. In fact half of the games I don´t even get a MG42. One ammo cache and you can use Grens with LMGs.

On thing I still find annoying is that offensive Maximspam still seems to work decent. Im not a top player, but the other day I faced a guy spamming maxims a lot, and though I could easily use truesight to outflank him, killing of the entire team takes a long time, especially as I have to micro the grens while he can just press attack, and then attack me somewhere else.

In fact, its my main tactic when playing Soviets as well. Three or four maxims, followed by an AT-gun to counter that flamerhalftrack. Even if one of my Maxims get overrun I still have a backup and if he sends another unit to flank that one as well the maxims can basicly cower each other.

I see some people saying mortars counter maxims, but early game, I have to dissagree, as the maxim is an effective assaultweapon, and a german with early mortar will be assaulted by maxims.

Playing Soviets, I really miss a vCOH style MG to establish controll, and playing germans I find the maxims frustrating to play against, because it dosent reward smart flanking and manouevering that much.

I dont see them changing it though, and I dont think the maxims should be nerfed to much, as it would make them pretty much useless. I just think the design of the unit was a mistake to begin with.

I hate using maxims. They are good units but one ability nullifies them and that is the riflenade. Toss a riflenade from max range, gunner dies and when the next crew member gets his hands on the gun the maxim is already swarmed. They are also impossible to effectively dodge because maxim tends to act like a vCoh motorcycle, spinning around when ordered to pull back.

I'm just sick of having suppressed conscripts crawling up to my mg, lobbing a molotov and barbecue half the mg crew before I can redeploy...

Yup, I hear you man. I was sick of that 2 so I started supporting my HMG with Grens. It works well, they tear apart those crawling Cons. You should try it You can also, pack up and reposition, while they are still crawling. Usually plenty of time to bring some reinforcements to help out.


Maybe also try not using them as first line unit. They work best when moving after Grens and backing them up

Yup, I hear you man. I was sick of that 2 so I started supporting my HMG with Grens. It works well, they tear apart those crawling Cons. You should try it You can also, pack up and reposition, while they are still crawling. Usually plenty of time to bring some reinforcements to help out.


Maybe also try not using them as first line unit. They work best when moving after Grens and backing them up

If the MG is left unsupported it should be extremely voulnerable to flanking. Leaving it voulnerable to head on assault, that it is designed to stop, seems countrrintuitive, an to me, just plain stupid.

That was, in my oppinion, the beauty in vCOH. MG were absolute beasts if you faced them head on, an totally helpless when outflanked. It encouraged, and rewarded, smart tactics, while this new system encourages reckless assaults.

In my oppinion vCOH pretty much nailed it in that regard.

Leaving it voulnerable to head on assault, that it is designed to stop, seems countrrintuitive, an to me, just plain stupid.

It will stop head on assaults as long as you have extended line of sight, if you really don't have a spotter for that you can setup behind a capped point and the area around the pole will provide extended los.
but the bottom line is that even if the mg has no extended los it will still be able to stop a single conscript squad heads on (maybe will need to reposition to dodge molotov). It will probably lose if unsupported to multiple conscripts squads but that's what I would expect

Yesterday I had an opponent move in a maxim against my already setup MG42 and own it totally. In my opinion we're basically back to the old op maxim days.

If u manage to successfully flank a maxim with grens you still have to micro like crazy cause the thing turns around in a split second. Also when you're behind the maxim with your grens you seem to do hardly any damage, and you're getting killed almost as fast by the pistols of the crew members. Especially cause you have to keep moving back and forth when the maxim is turning around trying to shoot you.

This is supposed to be a support unit, not a "spam this in the opening phase of the game" unit. It just looks plain ugly seeing people spam 3 maxims as their first units on the board.

Ive been trying to field 2x Grens + MG as a solid cohesive onfield force.
As a slowly but inexorably advancing infantry presence.
Works well in open areas, but has trouble in cluttered LoS areas.

I think the MG does a good job supporting the Grens, but the Grens have some trouble preventing flanks on the MG.

Not really sure what to suggest to improve the MG42s backline, essentially defensive, impetus.

I dont usually like to rely on Vet abilities as a way to xompensate for a units base purpose, but perhaps the Maxim/MG42 asymmetric balance allows for that here, to diversify the MG42 a bit.

Basically Im talking about:
-Reduce "load time" of Incendiary Rounds
-Reduce suppression of Incendiary Rounds
-Increase DPS, perhaps by increasing the rate of the bursts

This to the end, that MG42 can be used a bit more aggressively for hard DPS, in an offensive sense, later in the game when it really, lets be honest, is needed to move from open area defensive positions, into more cluttered areas of the map.

It still has the setup time, meaning it needs careful pre-positioning.
I think that positioning care, needs to be a bit more rewarded.
A more DPS centric Vet ability allows for that, as a reward later, for using it defensively, effectively, earlier.

If u manage to successfully flank a maxim with grens you still have to micro like crazy cause the think turns around in a split second. Also when you're behind the maxim with your grens you seem to do hardly any damage, and you're getting killed almost as fast by the pistols of the crew members.

I agree on this, Maxims should die faster when grens get at point plank range.
Another issue I have is that the mg42 is really underperforming while garrisoned to the point that it's preferable to leave it outside if it's unsupported.
Other than that I'm happy with the maxim/mg state.

This is supposed to be a support unit, not a "spam this in the opening phase of the game" unit. It just looks plain ugly seeing people spam 3 maxims as their first units on the board.

Buildings completely negate this, plus 3maxims seriously compromise capping power and lends to be owned by ost T2 vehicles

Buildings completely negate this, plus 3maxims seriously compromise capping power and lends to be owned by ost T2 vehicles

What I see mostly is maxims heavily stalling play: they go in buildings, you have to go in buildings to avoid their instapin. Then the waiting game starts until you can field a counter. The whole "infantrydance" of coh, which makes for such a fun chess-like earlygame, gets replaced by "camp the buildings till you can field a counter". It degrades the game in my opinion.

how can ppl cry about con getting up close to mg and trow molly and wipe yout them squad.. 1 they con wil prob retreat as wel that much damage it has taken and 2 you mg is a support unit!!! it is not ment to be a stand alone get of my lawn defence units its needs a unit around it so it can not be flanks by 2 or 3 cons!!! and if its alone then it sould be flanks by 2 units aleast grens can use rifel grandade form max distance and have a change to almost instant kil a mg unit wile con never have that option as easaly

maxim is a support unit to , yet that needs neither a los nor any support to be effective.

A conscript squad can also run right up to an mg head on with no flanking and still destroy the mg.

That is the problem here and that is why its not balanced.

It will stop head on assaults as long as you have extended line of sight, if you really don't have a spotter for that you can setup behind a capped point and the area around the pole will provide extended los.
but the bottom line is that even if the mg has no extended los it will still be able to stop a single conscript squad heads on (maybe will need to reposition to dodge molotov). It will probably lose if unsupported to multiple conscripts squads but that's what I would expect

I think both MGs are balanced fine, except that you shouldn't be able to counter them with a single squad by using a Rifle Nade or Oorah/Molotov. I think the solution to this is to shorten the range of the nade and the molotov while suppressed. Maybe if you entered the cone of fire on the far right/left and it takes the MG a long time adjust its aim, you could manage to get close enough...but straight on, it should never work.

Also, wasn't there a mention of a change in the beta patch notes that said something about giving infantry the ability to turn and shoot better while moving. A lot of times, I'm running my squad to try and get out of the MG's cone, but they're not able to fire at the MG squad until they stop safely out of the cone due to their angle of approach. If the moving squad can turn and fire (at even a 45 degree angle), they'll be able to deal damage that whole time.

What I see mostly is maxims heavily stalling play: they go in buildings, you have to go in buildings to avoid their instapin. Then the waiting game starts until you can field a counter. The whole "infantrydance" of coh, which makes for such a fun chess-like earlygame, gets replaced by "camp the buildings till you can field a counter". It degrades the game in my opinion.

Maxim instapin?

maxim is a support unit to , yet that needs neither a los nor any support to be effective.

A conscript squad can also run right up to an mg head on with no flanking and still destroy the mg.

That is the problem here and that is why its not balanced.

Except it's just not true. Even with Ooorah, rushing a setup MG head-on without using fog of war trickery will end up with pinned conscripts unless they're vet 3 or something.

And against a semi-competent player, Maxims also need support or they're toast. Not to mention the bevy of possible counters I've mentionned earlier.

So far in this thread I see a lot of people blaming the game for their own failings. Unless the Soviet player rushes for them (which destroys his map control), Maxims will arrive roughly at the same time as riflenades/T2, which provides every possible counter to them and then some.

Again, MG42 could use a slight suppression buff. But some of you are making it out to be completely useless since it doesn't instantly pin, which is silly. You're always supposed to support your MGs. It's been like that since vCOH, and the fact that it wasn't like that in the early stages of COH2 was a big problem.

there needs to be a price for these kinds of topics.

just plays a game i had 1 maxim and 1 gren force me to retreat becuz he 1 shot granade me from 6 to 2 man.... and that happend twice in that game also when in close range to the maxim its is a usles unit as its fire arc is so small you have to mictro every step the opponent make to have them able to shoot back so again once you get close to an maxim its dead unles there is support same goes for the mg42 the fact that is deploys faster its just becuz its an agresive units to it wil go with with 2 cons to help me suppores so they can trow moli at them he is just a bit at the back.. how often have i seen mg42 spam lulz and i cant get tru coz once they get 3 out they are covererd 360* and none of my cons can get in and im FORCED to get penals clowncar to take them out fast

I think the solution to this is to shorten the range of the nade and the molotov while suppressed.

I think that the rnade is a fair counter. It's not non-dodgeable but it won't wipe a full health Maxim, 2 or 3 are needed. No need to reduce its range while suppressed.
At the same time I wanna be rewarded when playing vs noobs as Sov if my opponent is dumb enough not to reposition his mg42 when I get in molotov range.

It will stop head on assaults as long as you have extended line of sight, if you really don't have a spotter for that you can setup behind a capped point and the area around the pole will provide extended los.
but the bottom line is that even if the mg has no extended los it will still be able to stop a single conscript squad heads on (maybe will need to reposition to dodge molotov). It will probably lose if unsupported to multiple conscripts squads but that's what I would expect

A dedicated defensive unit, like the MG42, shouldnt need forward observers in order to stop a single infantrysquad assaulting it from its strongest angel. Yes it will eventually supress the squad, but not before receiving a molotov, basicly forcing it to retreat. Again, this worked great in vCOH.