Profile of CieZ

Paid DLC is necessary. Paid DLC that affects gameplay is not. The game has no hope of being popular competitively if all commanders aren't available to everyone eventually.

There are so many ways to do it and still make money. You can sell faceplates, unit skins, interface skins, XP boosters. You can sell commanders to those who don't want to grind but have them be unlockable as well at certain levels. You can have a rotating list of new commanders that you can pay to use, and make those commanders free when new ones come out. There are a lot of ways to make money post-release that don't involve locking game-changing units and abilities behind a paywall.

Totally agree man. Finding some way to let everyone get access to all the multiplayer commanders is a big first step in building up a truly competitive CoH 2 scene.

Heck, they could just keep releasing single player/co-op ToW exclusive content/commanders for the people that love those modes to play. The ToW scenarios can be pretty fun so I'm sure there are plenty of people that would keep buying them and/or commanders exclusive to ToW to play with their friends. I wonder if that would generate enough revenue? Then they could continue to release a couple of commanders at a time/rehash old commanders for use in multiplayer.

I've thought about letting people buy the ability to customize their faceplates. Give them a large set of different colors, borders, star patterns and whatnot and then let them put special symbols/decals on from earning X number of wins with each faction or whatever they want to keep achievement chasers going.

Whatever it takes to sell people cool cosmetic stuff without affecting gameplay is welcome in my book if it means that everyone gets access to all the multiplayer commanders.

Another suggestion that I think James Hale had that I really liked was to get the community more involved in designing commanders. More community involvement is always a good thing in my opinion.

I think that a lot of the strategic depth that you say is missing actually comes in the form of commanders in CoH 2. For the sake of this discussion let's pretend for a moment that all commanders were/are free because I'll admit that constant paid DLC is lame.

Before you even go into a game you have to make commander choices, and these choices are something that I don't find to be taken lightly at the higher levels of play as they can drastically change/affect the entire course and outcome of a game. I have different load outs for 1v1s, 2v2s and 3v3/4v4 and find myself using different commanders for different situations frequently.

Creating/balancing a load out properly requires knowledge of the not only the general German vs Soviet meta game but also how that meta game transfers to different maps and even how enemy commanders can have an impact on the meta game. The meta game is constantly evolving and already in the course of CoH 2's life we've seen commanders fade in and out of prominence and commanders have entirely shaken things up. In some cases (Industry/Elite Troops) commanders have initially had a negative impact on the game but as they've become more balanced their presence is welcomed.

Now in team games you are going to want a set of commanders that will be able to compliment your teammates while also being flexible on different maps. Moscow Outskirts plays way differently than Minsk Pocket for example. I won't waste too much time going into detail on this point because it is so similar to 1v1 load outs, just with an extra layer of depth required.

I guess you can argue that the CoH 2 commander system adds artificial depth to the game but I don't see it that way. Commanders in CoH 2 are much more of a strategic choice - one that has ramifications throughout the entire course of the game. You fight off Shocks differently than you fight off Guards differently than you fight off PPSh Cons etc etc. Commanders have very real and very deep impacts on the game - I think this is something that has evolved since you stopped playing CoH 2. Hell, back in the beta people didn't even pick commanders half the time because everyone was just trying to figure out how to play the game. And then Relic showed us how great the Panzer Tactician ability was, but now it is used way more rarely because people's unit control has gotten so much better.

Anyways, I think I've harped on the commander system enough. It is a wonderful system outside of the fact that so many commanders have to be purchased (and even that isn't as big of a deal as some people make it out to be). On the point of "global upgrades" I think that the Soviets may be lacking in this aspect of the game, but the Germans certainly aren't. As a German player you have to decide between LMGs, FHT, G43s, Schrecks, tank MGs, and flamethowers while taking into account wanting to use grenades, tellers, off maps, vet abilities etc etc. There is a lot to take into account when spending munitions as German. Additionally the Elite Troops commander has to decide if/when to vet units - an ability that is fine for the commander but doesn't fit CoH 2's meta game as a whole. An LMG Gren squad has to be used different than a G43 Gren squad (or you can try and get both... but you better not let that squad die). A Schreck PGren squad is a huge investment and you're giving up a lot of AI capability to buy schrecks. None of these choices can really be made lightly and they all involve the same level of depth that you mention being present in vCoH. If you buy an early LMG for your Gren you won't be able to get a FHT in case Shocks come out. Saving for a FHT in the case of shocks makes your Grens significantly weaker to Cons. Purchasing a FHT is a huge risk because you're investing so much into one fragile unit, but if you control it properly it can be a monster. Each of these choices is vitally important to the overall flow of the game.

As I mentioned before, unfortunately this level of upgrade choice is not present on the Soviet end of the spectrum with PPSh being "brain dead" upgrades that you should ALWAYS get once they're unlocked and the same is basically true of DPs for Guards (although this is more of a choice early game since early DPs means no CE flamethrower, mines, or Guard Grenades). However this is something that could be easily fixed and it almost not necessary because Soviet choices come in the form of tech choice/timing. While it is possible for a Soviet player to build T1 and T2 or T3 and T4 these are such huge investments that it is unlikely. I'll spare the specific CoH 2 meta game details since Soviet teching is similar to American teching so the same principles probably apply but knowing when/why to tech and which tier to tech to as a Soviet player is hugely important.

Another difference that I really like is the upkeep/popcap system in CoH 2. Both of these systems offer more chances of a comeback, which are always exciting to watch and to pull off. The two most intense SNF games involved Barton making miraculous come from behind wins that probably would not have been possible in vCoH. More importantly the upkeep/static pop cap system of CoH 2 constantly presents players with an opportunity to make important decisions in much the same way that WarCraft 3's upkeep system worked. In the middle/later stages of CoH 2 I find myself frequently questioning whether I should build an additional unit (for capping power/map presence/etc) or if I should continue to "bank" resources. Having another unit will help me now, but banking resources will ensure that I'm able to both consistently reinforce my high vet squads but also have the ability to react to my opponent properly. However, if I make the wrong choice and choose to sit on a lower total number of units I risk not getting tech out in time or being overrun. While the upkeep dynamic is somewhat similar to vCoH it is different enough in the sense that upkeep is directly related to population, not unit type and that regardless of how much/little territory I control I always have a cap of 100 and a set manpower income. These differences also allow for players to express their own styles.

Of course CoH 2 is not a perfect game and many things could/can be improved but, as I've said before, I really think you downplay the amount of strategy/important player choice that is present in CoH 2. The game is not as clear-cut and shallow as you constantly say it is. New strategies arise constantly with people figuring out new/better ways to play each map or deeper ways to weave a commander into their game plan. Each game of SNF between Barton and Andy the players used different strategies/commanders/etc. Honestly it was awesome to watch and significantly more entertaining than most, if not all, of the vCoH casts I've seen.

I think what it really boils down to is that you played CoH 2 in an entirely different era. This game barely resembles what it was in the beta with flamer M3s, SU85s, and Soviet snipers being so overpowered that nothing else was viable. Commanders were barely even touched on back then and we had to play on terrible maps like Prip Spring half the time. I too took time away from the game back then because it was frustratingly stale and disgustingly imbalanced, but that isn't the case anymore.

I'm lucky enough to be a part of the balance beta so I too have spent a lot of time working with the developers on improving the game and so far they've been doing a phenomenal job listening to community feedback and implementing good balance changes and bringing us interesting commanders/content. The developers/Relic are here for the long haul. They're more than willing to listen to good feedback.

So my question to you is that same as it has always been - why spend so much time bashing CoH 2 (a game that you say you want to see succeed) instead of continuing to work to improve it? Why constantly bash CoH 2 instead of helping to build up the community? Honestly we've all discussed this to death at this point. If you (or any vCoH veteran) want CoH 2 to succeed then help those of us that also want it to succeed. If not, just enjoy vCoH and let us enjoy CoH 2. There's no reason this community can't enjoy both games simultaneously. Frankly the CoH 2 bashing (not necessarily from you specifically Inverse) gets old.

Hello and welcome from the COHEXPERTS! You are more than welcome to use our teamspeak server, we are more than happy to accommodate you. We hope to play with you a lot in the future!

-Esky, COHEXPERTS

Thanks for the offer man but I actually went ahead and got us a mumble server. If you guys ever want to scrim for fun or practice let me know, always a good game when we meet COHEXPERTS on the ladder in automatches

Awesomely intense games. Huge props to both players. Was great to see how this patch has really shaken up the metagame and these games showcase how many different strategies are actually viable at the highest levels of play. Gives me a lot of hope for the future of CoH2. So much unexplored territory that can be charted in the future!

GG WP Andy and Barton. Both excellent players.

Thanks Marcus, great job so far with SNF today! Always a pleasure playing with/against you as well, feel free to hit me up for games anytime