Vet 3 Stormtroopers have a good chance to win vs vet 3 Commandos, anyway.
You sure about that. I didn't just post this with doing test first you know. vet0 storms actually loose less harder to vet0 mandos compared to vet3 storms vs vet3 mandos. (without cover and under 10 range cus storms and paras have quite a considerable dps advantage over other squads at ranges over 10)
But that is a non-issue? Storms already absolutely destroy unvetted or otherwise low RA infantry and support weapon crews in mere seconds. Generally without taking a single casualty. They don't need extra DPS against those targets?
Still killing them even faster is not a bad thing. Considering how fast USF infantry can kill squads their ttk is not all that impressive.
But this completely disregards the Stormtroopers' camouflage which allows them to ambush other squads under favourable circumstances, and also allows them to not take any fire from other long range sources before opening up, unlike PGrens. Their ambush role is sufficiently different and powerful to distinguish them from PGrens. If you want brute force infantry that can hold their ground against charging assault units or help assault themselves, pick PGrens. If you want to wipe support weapons, line infantry or pick off wounded squads, pick Stormtroopers. Both are excellent in their own roles.
Buddy let me tell you a story. I once had an s-mine field on point with some storm on at nearby piece of cover. A shock squad came in lost 2 models got in range of my vet2 storms and I said supprise mofo! Only to see that shocks(vet0) proceed to obliterate my storms. I was down to 1 model when I retreated and the shocks were down to 2. Gotta say kinda don't see where the ambush is so great is comming from. |
And just some added information:
Apparently storm mp40s hold a higher DPS than pgren stgs all the way up to 15 range, according to this google doc. I know. |
Also, with tactical assault, youre supposed to fire on the move when you pop the ability. So with the moving accuracy multiplier, youre not going to be getting overkill accuracy even with vet and the ability.
Storms actually have very good accuracy on the move though (75% compared to 50% of other smg's)
So they actually do get overkill accuracy with vet3 which is currently 28%.
Overall, there are indeed situations where youre getting overkill accuracy. But theyre extremely rare and arent likely to be too impactful (vetted storms are going to be shredding high RA squads anyway).
How is it rare to not get overkill accuracy. The moment you see rangers, mandos, shocks. You have to runaway. For the other targets it's just overkill acc. And with the larger squads of the allied it isn't bad to have less wasted potential dps. |
I'm fairly sure either >100% accuracy is used to multiply by target size or base accuracy is multiplied by target size before any veterancy accuracy bonuses are calculated.
Here's an example of how a vet 2+ Obersoldaten Kar 98K at ~20 range (~0.9 x 1.4 = 126% accuracy) can miss on a low target size squad such as Rangers (around 0.5 RA).
Whatever the case, the result is the same: the +40% accuracy does help with its full potential on vetted low received accuracy units.
The reason why I am saying that the +50% TA/+40% Vet3 does onthing because storms will never be facing units like rangers, commandos, shocks in 1v1 fights because these squads both out tank and out dps them at the mp40 stormtroopers preferred range. So +50%/+40% is pointless to the out come of those fights. What the whole lowering accuracy does is increase the max dps they do which helps vs squad with 1 or more target size like unveted infantry and support crew.
My main point is that at vet0 the dps difference between storms and pg's are 20.1 % but at vet 3 it is only 3.3% (both in stormtroopers favor), This is not much and pg's have considerably better dps at all other ranges. Which mean vet3 storms aren't really better but actually a lot worse. |
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I'm not saying that storm mp40 sucks.
They are pretty strong, But I like to make issues where there is none.
#All numbers are in respect on range 0-10
Currently the mp40's near accuracy is 81%. Which mean that, both the Vet3 bonus (+40%) and Tactical assault ability's bonus (+50%) is completely wasted, Gaining only +23.4% at vet3 or tactical advance. The cooldown bonus also accounts for nothing as it only adds little (+3.1%). The other smg's get mp44(+40% from acc and +6% cd)(yes it is classified as smg in the game), ass gren mp40(+40% from acc and +5% cd), commando sten(+30% acc, +11% cd). The paratrooper thompson(+25% acc, +5% cd). (airborn guards are also the type who can't use their vet bonus full 22% out of 30% of their full bonus from)
So very clearly tout of all of these weapons the The stormtrooper mp40 is effected by it's vet bonus the least.
So my solution,
Reduce near accuracy from 0.81 to 0.65(0.648) and increase the near rof multiplier from 1 to 1.25.
This should retain the current dps at vet0 while allowing the mp40 to gain more dps at vet 3.
What does this really do.
Against infantry with less than 1.0 Target size, Absolutely jack shit.
Against targets with more than 1.0 Target size, It shreds them even faster at vet 3.
Also this will give a buff to tactical advance i mean a dps increase of +50 at vet 0 and at vet 3
a bonus of 10%(for comparison the paratrooper tactical advance gives +50 at vet 0 and +39% at vet 3, #note: this is just from accuracy if I include the buff from burst which is always active then it would be +111% at vet 0 and +96% at vet 3, so there is no way the changes to the storm mp40's should seem that ridiculous)
Why do i suggest these changes:
Ost faces Support weapons with greater mobility/survivability. Efficiently clearing out which is the job of stormtroopers. This won't really change how much dps it does to retreating squads either.
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Sorry, I dont really see your point. Heavies are 20+ pop cap each. Allied TDs are 14+ each. Double AT gun and double stug fall in a similar ball park. Heavies and their counters are pop cap heavy, yes.
isn't the volume approach also suited for countering allied infantry. Don't you need more infantry to counter allied infantry. Won't you a bit constricted in the pop cap department. |
For axis, volume is the answer. Multiple stugs, multiple AT guns, even multiple pumas if you wanted to. Obviously allies have high pen TDs for their side. The reason why its hard to find "a unit" axis has to counter heavies is because the answer is multiple units.
Sadly pop cap is a b**ch. |
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First thing you do is be on alert for ass grens euther by using buildings engies anything that gives more vision. The earliest you can encounter one is when you have 2 cons. So you will always have numeric advantage. The trick is to forc the ass grens to engage one of you cons while risking taking massive damage from other cons.So if you spot the first ass gren/ ass gren assault force(3x) you need to use the advantage range numbers and multiple angles and even the sandbags of cons to ward the off before you get MG's. Since there is no Grens t70 may not be needed go for m5 Quads and rush for T34/85's and keep 1-2 zis. They can be handy if the blob gets caught by the mg or quad the zis barrage will force the blob to retreat or slaughter them outright. Once you have 2 t34/85's and 2 zis. That tiger wont be an issue. |
The problem is that now the best strategy is to get a heavy tank narrowing the number of commanders used.
It more a diversity issue than balance issue. Either this vehicles become stock or they should become less attractive.
Can't we just nerf the OKW tiger and keep the OST one as is. I mean T4 is a death sentence for OST but OKW can still get the KT with any doc. |
Gasp, how dare an opponent have nearly twice the manpower invested in troops as well as be on the defensive and have good odds against my übermensch?! Heresy!
I guess everyone thinks of themselves as that Carthaginian general who destroyed a larger more well supplied force with a smaller one. |
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