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Pak and scott feel cheesy and QoL bad because they are hard to counter especially for wehr without stuka or jp4. They are too far, too fast and deal accurate heavy damages.
While pak cost more than wehr mortar, usf also is able to float more mp and popcap and forward bases. I don't think we have good excuse for it.
Imo either reduce pak damage/accuracy or the range so that it is counterable without needing a fast pwafer.
Scott definitely needs it pop to go up to same as pwafer or higher because of the free repairs. Pwafer may have aoe advantage, but scott is dead accurate and much higher survivability. I dont see why it should be cheaper. |
So, allies use heavy artillery to counter your mg/bunker spam, use medium/ai tanks to support infantry and cover their units from your tanks using tank destroyers? sound like combined arms to me
In other words, allies are coordinated, and between 3 factions use 13 differenct units and you complain you cannot Panther spam them to death? or lock down half the map by spamming bunkers XDDDD?
Also "allies start with blobs, then usf can do calliope", so I guess nothing happens inbetween?
Question is: where are your mortars, Leigs, 251 Stukas, JP4s, Pak 40, Brummbars, Shreck blobs, Ostwinds, flame 251, LEFHs, Elefants, JTs and Pak43s? mines? panzerwerfers? Raks?
All support/static weapons wont work against this. I think Sherman outnumber panther 3:1, 2 stugs cant beat a single ff/su85/jackson.
Granted it is 4v4, but i find this getting outta hand with the ptrs guards and calliope/bulldoser doc. Lots of arty
As per title, allies mass and speed are really stronk now.
Im thinking of looking at reduce td range 60 to 55.
Scott pop needs to go up. |
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Some maps like lanzerth ambush and red ball and hill.
Allies start with infantry blob, then Usf can do calliope, rifles and pak/scott and jackson, the other do sherman blob and caliope. Sov mass guards with ptrs, and su85 and katsuya, Brit just do ther mg and mortar lockdown and call in 2 howies, before FF come to support. All using stock/mostly stock units.
As Wehr, i having trouble countering the pak/scott/kats/calliope taking out our position. And their sherman blobs comes in clearing up. Every time we try to use our Panthers, Tigers and Stug to chase after their shermans and scott, but inaccuracy on the move, TD behind and danger of snares, it was hopeless. Our infantry cannot handle guard and rifles blob, mg is useless in late game, even bunkers go down easily.
I feel the situation is unplayable. If panther blob is bad, please look at Allies range and speed, and how their med tanks can survive easily with such strat, or they can rebuild faster. |
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Yea i did read. Thats why i asked. Retreating units are moving away from your range. Allies can chase but wehr cant due to dps. Hence im thinking gren can have additional range to compensate.
Pgren can move a bit faster to compensate.
I just tested in cheatmod, cons move speed is higher for sure.
Can we get 2 grens vs penal at around same time? Besides if you move 2 squads to combat, you lose the capping advantage. Im not sure if earlier map control helps in 2v2. I think the meta now is for allies to build up a sizeable force even if you lose earlier map.
Issues like better retreating wipes add to that force build up imo
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Thanks for sharing friend.
My problem is that you still need to move your grens and pgrens to chase the retreating units since they are in relative motion. Perhaps to give grens longer range and pgren slightly faster movement to compensate?
If i not wrong, conscripts are the fastest moving infantry. Perhaps grens should be inbetween cons and rifles/penals?
In terms of cost, i have not done the sum. But i dont think you can get out 2 grens vs 1 penal that fast? So it is not enough to offset the first encounter? |
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Yea i thought so too.
Do you think we should relook these base stats?
Imo losing units as wehr 2v2 player is very serious hurt, and you are more likely to lose them. |
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But we are about chasing retreating units. Pgren as bad as gren in chasing no? In relation to penals and rifles, usf and sov is trading too good against wehr imo.
As for hmg 1.25, i think it should go back to 1 for wehr and sov. And 1.25 for the other 3 factions. Reasons because the penalty of no forward bases. Is mortar also 1.25?
Felt very cheap to get wiped by penals much faster than grens can do the same. I saw a new build, penals into AA ht these days.
Anyone also think 222 is underperforming? In my games, if you got shot by ATG, it is probably dead, the 2nd shot always comes in before you can retreat. I don't know if its the slow acceleration or TS or pathing.
Hence i think except in 1v1, very little use for 222. Maybe in 4v4, slap a spotting scope and use it for recon, hopefully level up shooting planes and have longer sight |
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but g43 is doc, while penals and rifles are better at killing retreating squads?
anyone also find wehr mortar and mg42 pack up slower than allies? |
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Maybe it is not target size per se.
How about looking at why allies infantry are better at dealing more damages to retreating squads? |
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Just curious, as a Wehr 2v2 player, my grens have trouble wiping their weapon teams and retreating infantry.
On the other hand, i experience Penals,Rifles and BrensIS, wipe my retreating units far easier.
This cause me to suspect the target size? Or the more firing mens?
Feels frustrating as Wehr player, you need to retreat off map faster than Allies. |
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