Profile of Fargoth88

On the contrary, Boys AT rifle spam is the mark of someone who's played CoH 3 long enough to have experienced 8 Rape Armored Car and Wespe spam.

The incompetent UKF players spam bren sections because they think that all they need to deal with LVs are one or two AT guns, a la CoH 2. They quickly learn that's not the case. Lmfao.

I think the problem is that the DAK’s entire gimmick is overwhelming your opponent around the 6 to 7 minute mark which you can way more easily do if your opponent isn’t going for handheld at. Not sure if this is a DAK or UKF problem, but after playing 30 games with DAK, I can say that it’s not the most fun matchup.

I wanted to respond to just this section.

If a unit such as the bp ruins authentisity, why are you people silent in coh 2 about the inclusion of the st and no rescritions on heavy spam? Or about
early war soviets vs late war germany? I know why snub nose p4,s that bounce off t34's arent cool, not having panthers and tiger and wunderwaffen/niche units is detracting to the axis factions appeal and makes less money. Every one wants a big cat and then authentisity disapears.
Its quite sad that when authenticity comes for axis "gameplay and fun" is suddenly more important.

The good reasons for a unit such as the black prince is money with hype. What they did for axis in coh1 and coh 2. I 100% like it that allies now get a wunderwaffen/niche angle as well to mix it up.
And freeing allies of td spam every single game. Wich both axis and allies complain about.

Well firstly, I disagree that there is this ‘unrestricted’ heavy tank meta. This is partly because I mostly play 1v1 but even in 2v2, I rarely see Sturmtigers and Jagdtigers. Kingtigers and Tigers often make appearances but those have every right to be there. There were German formations that had a lot of those tanks and OKW is pretty specifically based on the 6th Panzer army in the Ardennes on the 16th of December, which had plenty of King Tigers at that time. Even the sturmtiger has a right to be there since it was used in the Ardennes. Panthers also weren’t exactly rare in the Ardennes. If you’re going to make a faction on the Germans that amassed all the equipment they have left for a final counterattack, it makes sense that the faction actually has that equipment.

Late war Germans vs early war Soviets is such disingenuous framing. I agree that the T34/76 and conscripts just armed with rifles make little sense for 1944 but the soviets still have plenty of competent infantry and heavier vehicles. The Wehrmacht also doesn’t have that many late war vehicles either. Tigers, Panthers and Elefants were all at Kursk.

It's not that the BP completely ruins authenticity but it’s the one unit that stands out right now. There is no individual thing in COH2 that is on the level of the BP. Even if I were to grant you that COH2 has a lot of smaller things that don’t make sense, COH3 currently has only one. We might as well remove that one thing. If they want to generate hype with heavy tanks, then why is it only this one vehicle? If they want to do 1944/1945 all over again that is fine by me, but that doesn’t seem to be what the direction is of the DAK and the British. I wouldn’t mind the BP if it was added to the British in COH2 but the vehicle stands out a lot in COH3.

Then what's the problem? At this point i have no clue what ur problem is

U concede that coh2 already has even less realistic elements. That is the central point of my argument...


If u don't think that's what relic is going for then why the fuck r u so worried about the BP??? That's completely self contradictory

I would prefer the armies not to be made up entirely of prototype units either. So far that doesnt seem to be whats happening. It seems like there's 1 prototype unit. Is that enough to make me complain? Not really

R u worried about trickle down fiction or something? Like Relic is going to get addicted to proto units and once they start they can't stop? I find that silly


Im not concerned about other games, were talking about the standard across coh games. U have already admitted that US and brits on eastern front is more absurd than BP, so i dont see how my opinion is so confusing to u

Because there are no soviets in COH3, so its not something we have to worry about. If there were Soviets in COH3, then I wouldn’t mind the BP. I already stated I would at least like the individual factions to represent what they’re based on to a certain degree. The DAK is the opposing faction of the Brits in COH3 and they don’t have weird 1945 gear, so why should the British? There is literally no reason for including this vehicle at all.

I said I think that is what Relic is going for. It’s pretty obvious they try to get some things right. All the other gear the Brits and DAK have is significantly more accurate than the BP. Expect for the Walking Stuka maybe but the vehicle itself was used. You stated you don’t like the heavy tanks and they have largely moved away from that but you’re defending the one heavy tank that shouldn’t even be there. You can make it sound silly but including a KT or a JT to the Wehrmacht and a Panther to the DAK is fair game at this point. You can hide behind balance again but it’s got more to do with the design inherent to heavy tanks you don’t like.

Adhering to history is more complex than either being used or being a prototype. No one wants to have entire factions made up of prototypes but the question is to what extent factions can be up of prototypes, rare vehicles and vehicles that were deployed after fighting in a theater ended.

I wouldn’t mind if the BP was in COH2 since it is later war and they have taken liberties, but many of those are not in COH3. The British are more based on the army of 1942/1943 but they somehow feel the need to include a vehicle that is off by a larger margin than ever before. By you own admission, there is only one prototype. That makes it stand out even more and raises the question on why that number couldn’t be zero.

I am comparing the immersion of the entire games, not just the units included. If tanks being too fast for soldiers to dodge crushing doesnt break immersion for u, i dont see why the BP does. If a flare providing any kind of visual assistance in broad daylight doesnt break immersion, why does the BP?

U can say its different all u want, the result is the same. Coh2 was not historically immersive by any means


Well it happened constantly in coh2 so its a valid concern to bring up.....


Then its a good thing i didnt say that. I said that i was talking about the specific patch that launched ST meta:

Do u know what the word temporary means? I was not talking about right now for ST

JT and elefant on the other hand clearly dominate team games. Thats not even debateable, the stats literally back it up. Breakthrough and jaeger armor are the most popular commanders in 2v2, 3v3, and 4v4...https://coh2stats.com/stats?range=month&statsSource=all&type=2v2&race=wermacht&timeStamp=1661990400


OF course it doesnt, but it does require ppl to be much more careful with them. Rather than being able to replace them easily which happens all the time in team games due to resource float


ANd ive been wondering the same thing about u this whole time. U have no issue with tanks having absurd speed, flares providing reconaissance, the brits fighting on the eastern front, planes being able to track vehicles as if they have targeting computers. But suddenly a prototype shows up and NOW the game is inauthentic? That makes no sense at all


Ur point isnt about balance, but mine is. I care more about competitive balance than i do about history for the video game. THat doesnt mean history is unimportant, its just a secondary concern to balance...

If you look at top 200 in 2v2, overwatch is actually the most picked commander. In all 1v1 games Luftwaffe ground forces is most picked but that commander isn’t exactly meta either. This is the level you are roughly playing at, so it is way more applicable. There is a 1/5 change breakthrough is picked, if you’re facing OKW at all, which doesn’t have to be the case. Then the game also has to reach to point for your opponent to actually get a chance to deploy it. Choosing breakthrough also doesn’t mean that you go JT. So, I highly doubt you see one every game. You might encounter one every 1 in 10 games or so if we’re being generous. I guess the elefant is there but that’s not exactly a late war wunderwaffe.

Since you didn’t bother answering the question, I will. To start off, I already said I didn’t like the US and UK fighting on the eastern front. My dislike for it is even greater than the BP. Seeing people who want to see soviets in COH3 makes me want to cut my eyeballs out. Flares providing recon isn’t anymore insane the having the entire map covered in some sort of fog. And I don’t actually see the plane, I just hear it. None of these things have anything to do with faction design though. How liberties with mechanics are related to liberties in faction design is impossible to say. Factions don’t typically have units that were developed two years after fighting on that theater ended. Up to a year can be fine but 2 year definitely not. If it was absolutely necessary to include the BP, I wouldn’t be against it. It’s inclusion isn’t necessary though.

Liberties with game mechanics can probably go way further since they enhance the immersion and don't really matter since you're playing a game anyway. That’s why the entire map is covered in a weird fog, every unit has an invisible radio and my small hq building has hundreds of reinforcements waiting in it. It’s similar to war thunder which is idiot as a whole but still tries to portray the individual units as accurately as possible. COH can have really silly mechanics (to a certain degree) but still do its best to give the factions gear that they actually used as much as possible. Since it is possible to do Brits without the BP and they didn’t use it, it probably needs to go.

It's the same for AoE 4. The general mechanics and structure are not realistic but there still goes care in each civilization. It's probably the same for any historical game. An almost idiotic set of rules with components in them that should adhere to history as much as possible.

I don’t need to know all of that for you though. I’m just curious to roughly what extent individual factions need to have actually used gear.

‘Another way u limit it is by making other options viable, and avoid doing things like overbuffing ST (which caused the temporary period where u saw one every game)’. This statement is heavily implying that other options weren’t viable at some point in the game’s lifespan. Making other options viable implies that they weren’t at some point.

Im not walking away from it. Im saying that the m1 Abrams is an absurd exaggeration of my argument

Little boy and fatman would be bad for gameplay reasons. Nobody wants to play an rts game where they can lose everything all at once to an uncounterable unit

It all depends on frequency. Irstgs on every single squad would be too much. Just like if BP is closing out every single game for brits it would be too much. Have to wait and see how its implemented

Irstgs in coh2 are good exanple of the right balance. Only available on elite squads thru specific doctrines. That itself is still an exaggeration but at least it was well limited

I didnt say i agree its more of a stretch, i said they are different. They are different stretches but the result is the same: breaking immersion from a realistic ww2 experience

Its only "more of a stretch" if the timeline is the only thing u care about. Why does BP bother ppl while tanks having nascar engines does not? I do not understand that


BUt the 1st two games didnt strive for authenticity, so why shuld the 3rd?

I would rly just like them to be honest. They were dishonest in coh2 when they said they would never add pershing because it didnt fit USF design. Then they added it

With BP they are at least acknowledging up front that they have gone in a more fictional direction. Is BP alone enough to stop you from buying the game? Cuz thats the main thing i don't understand

The BP is not going to stop me from buying the game at all. It just going to make me sigh a bit every time I see it.

If this game shouldn’t strive for authenticity, then anything goes right? As long as IR StGs are balanced, they can be on any squad and little boy and fatman are only wrong for balance reasons. It follows from your argumentation that we can just go overboard with the amount of prototype units that never saw action. You obviously believe that there is no historical standard for this game, so why shy away from that. It’s not absurd at all to ask if the Abrams would be ok since you think the game shouldn’t strive to be authentic in any way.

It’s pretty reasonable to say that a BP call-in would function similarly to JT and ST call-ins. It is also likely that the BP, just like most vehicles in COH, will be pretty OP at some point in the game’s lifespan. Controlling the frequency of a unit is almost impossible if it’s already a doctrinal call-in. If it is rarely used, Relic will buff it until it is a good pick in team games. The BP has also way more potential in 1v1 and 2v2 than the JT and ST currently have due to it being way less specialized. What makes you assume that the BP won’t see frequent usage? Accessibility is exactly the same for both of those vehicles.

Having tanks drive faster than they actually did, was probably a necessary sacrifice. I don’t think a super heavy is necessary for a faction at all. If they felt that just 1943 units was too limiting, they could have taken liberties with a bunch of 1944 units. Instead, they went for a prototype from 1945.

Just because COH had and will have immersion breaking elements, doesn’t mean we should open the floodgates. I don’t think USF needed a Pershing either but that doesn’t mean any immersion to be had in COH2 as a WW2 game is now completely gone.