The problem is a bit deeper because 25p arty is also available to tommies and sniper and has very little friendly fire damage, while the whole faction lucks early indirect fire support.
I would try making pyrotechnics ungraded that gave tommies scoped Enfield took all weapons slot, removed cover bonus and reduced moving penalties (turning them into a normal infantry) while separating barrage from the first 25p with smoke barrage and second with high explosive.
That make thing easier to balance.
That's why the mortar pit option is fucking retarded, you are supposed to get howitzers as you tech but you keep this howie range mortars uber effecient that needs PERFECT positioning and a well established static frontline.
Imho
Phyrotechnic: only sniper, it mark target for a reworked pounder strike not necessary anvil reliant to be more than visual effect
Medikit: in the trash can, uc can be upgraded as a mobile medical station carrying medics that can dismount like ambulance
Royal arty barrage: like pyro barrage, but fires a creeping barrage, or better barrage a RECTANGULAR area WITHOUT anvil regardless of teching, but create green cover craters to use as cover to advance (huge ukf artillery doctrine flavour here =))
Goddam mortar squad, than if i choose anvil i get to decide if i want a mortar pit by building a special trench for the squad, but i DECIDE it.
Tommies scoped has to be reworked.
I would outright remove those, because if somebody ever noticed, they tend to drop brens easily.
Btw am i the only one who would make vickers cgeaper and remove the building bonus range ? It makes it a counter to sniper builds which is ironical, and mp starve ukf. |
The anvil artillery has zero scatter making it problematic. On the other hand 25 artillery is rather useless. The whole 25p need to be reworked (actually the UKF faction needs to be reworked).
In pratical terms a few inconsistencies can be buffed and cheese nerfed, and we are lucky if it happens..unfortunately. |
I think that Volks shouldn't have a snare, but rather a panzerfaust upgrade that gives them access to fausts that won't damage engines. So if you need some quick AT you got some disposable shit ready to use. It would be an interesting mechanic, I think. I would've preferred that to a 2x StG. 44 package. OKW have too many long-range infantry squads. (Pfusiliers, Obers w/ LMG34, JLI --not sure if that really counts, and Fallschirmjaegers which are kind of a silly unit with their FG42 having good dps at every range).
Pfusiliers need a popcap of 8 or 9 and a reinforce increase. If Relic would take the time to do this, maybe they could pull a UKF and get a reduction in reinforce cost at vet 5 or some stupid shit.
I forgot why we're arguing about TDs but ok.
Lol no they already have the worst, most bugged and least accurate atg to face light vehicles, any valuable at mine.
Fallschirmjaeger are glass cannonn |
Pack howie has less autofire range than isg. I don't have the numbers or the game in front of me, but I know that for a fact from experience. 3 shells means the barrage is only good against buildings and okw trucks and mayyyybe weapon teams but it's really rng dependent.
I also don't understand why sherman isn't good against large blobs with he. Scott is good but it's no rocket arty, same goes for the priest, so they won't really be very good blob counters, but do good as support.
Jackson is dead weight on some maps due to the fact that it gets 3 hit by regular hard at sources (raks, paks, and tank cannons). In perspective, the luchs also gets 3 hit by hard at sources. This means that if your jackson bounces (which can definitely happen against panthers and heavier) and it's not at absolutely max range with perfect positioning and support, then it's really vulnerable to being dived and will probably die, leaving you with nothing to kill the diving tank with unless you have more Jacksons or they really really suck and just leave their tank there for your riflemen to chase down and use their two hour at nade and your zooks chase them down after that. And they get invalidated (like they might as well just die and free up popcap and upkeep) by elefants or jts just like all other mediums, but more so them because they die to other supporting at even easier. Non turreted tanks is a totally different issue but can apply to the same maps (jackson is garbage on urban maps or any sort of slightly constricted space since it's only advantages are speed and range.
They both have same autofire range
"Good only against buildings, okw bases and team weapons.." isg at buildings was already like this 
"Rng dependant"
Welcome in coh 2
I can't see why you are using a kiting vehicle like a panther sniper.
Well except urban maps, true that...pershing and ez 8 are necessary there.
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ISG AA (live) is 100 range, same as 120mm mortar. 105 at vet 1 and 140ish (barrage) with vet 3.
Equal scatter with OH mortar on AA. Mortar barrage has less scatter. ISG has way less scatter on both modes. If Pack Howie gets vet2, it doubles the scatter so it's way more RNG.
ISG needs a overhaul in order to be able to deal with garrisons and not be a 105 afk weapon.
A demo is a good blob deterrent. Rocket artillery as well. A sherman with HE is a deterrent to blobs in the same way a KT is one. I guess you are thinking about blobs which are all one on top of each other. I'm talking more about "intelligent" blobbing such as Cpt price.
Priest is good, it's just overshadowed by cheaper or better alternatives.
Wiping tool > annoying tool
Low HP + cramped maps, specially with shotblockers or other dead tank chasis. Meta wise, if a map is good for JT/Ele, you are better investing in mass shermans. Thxfully you are no longer 2 shotted by mark vehicle cheese (unless you combo it with Elite armor for the lulz or you manage to late-game get a vetted JPIV).
Anyway, going back to P47. It's not that it's bugged, it's simple bad for cost or performance compared to other simil abilities.
Pack howie:
Range 160
Auto 80
Isg:
Range 100
Auti 80
There is nothing that outrange pack.
The isg has les scatter but minimal aoe,it's like shooting rocks, you either hit them in the head or they are fine.
"ISG needs a overhaul in order to be able to deal with garrisons and not be a 105 afk weapon."
This is what i advocated for a long time.
Priest can be more of an annoying tool, can efficiently deny a specific area, it's better than calliope against okw bases and big howitzers are porn for me
Nono, it's freaking bugged against anything smaller than panther, it wipe anything on the tank sides but doesn't hit the tank. |
The Jackson is wicked unreliable. Look at the changes it was getting before the patch was scrapped to "unforseen circumstances". Far to unforgiving of a unit for how reliant the US are on it (unless you go armor). The sherman is great, but when you compare US final tier to the rest in the game it is clearly the worst.
I'm not even denying how big a problem Armor Company is. But call-in abuse is in no way a one-sided issue. And there is no argument to defend how god awful of an ability thompson crews is, US is the most muni-hungry faction in the game and its not at all worth it to drop that on that crew.
Jackson wasn't unreliable, it was m10 on steroids that nobody wanted because m10 is good enough and jackson requires a tier.
The changes made in FBP (which i btw support completely as usf being my "second" main) were aimed towards giving usf jackson a DIFFERENT role from m10 of sniper rather than kiting vehicle in a way it doesn't overlaps with m1.
The FBP version doesn't come from a buff, but an overhaul, costed more but got more staying power against vehicles.
It's a good change because it gives usf a tank sniper like other factions, rather than a hit and run vehicle, but by no way it means jackson now is "bad", especially if you look at 20 fuel difference over same gun.
Thompson given to vehicle crews are extremely good and make those usf sturmpios.
Problem is that double bar doesn't require a braincell to be in activity.
Fact that people consider bad a unit that is basically core in 2 factions for a faction that has all kind of smoke to support such cqb units just show how stupid is the concept of mainline fullfilling any ai role against any threat.
I wished you cared to explain how a unit that cost you nothing but 200 mp to recrew, outdps dedicated cqb units and can exploit only starting bad RA with smoke is bad..
And you still need to find me an axis doctrine that can provide you ai/at call ins abd eventually avoid teching like lend lease and armored company do, because if i call stug e/command panzer but than tech to stug g/panther the problem doesn't exist. |
a nugget of information you should note is the DPS and range of the IS-2 and pershing in contrast to the KT.. hell even a panther....
although the IS-2 has the armor of the KT it has 13.49(!!!) far DPS and a measly 40 range in contrast to the KT`s 21.55 and 45 range...
the pershing is closer at 18.60 far DPS and 45 range but suffers in terms of armor at 300 armor...
the cheaper panther even compares to these with 16.71 dps 50 range and 320 armor (but of course sacrifices anti infantry capability)
now lets compare the SU-85 and the JP4
28.88 far dps 185 penetration 230 armor 20 rotation rate 5.7 top speed and stealth capabilities(!!) for the JP4
25.48 far dps 230 penetration 160 armor 22 rotation rate and 5.5 top speed for the SU-85
the jagdpanzer 4 with 185 penetration of course isnt going to fare well as an SU-85 with 230 against a KT or a panther... but since the allied heavies either have anemic DPS or weaker armor much of it is compensated... not to mention the fact that the JP4 still maintains the range advantage over the mentioned allied heavies meaning it can still harass the said heavy and drill them with higher DPS (but at lower penetration) than the equivalent SU-85... not to mention its stealth capabilities which are always handy
lastly hard countering allied heavies isnt the JP4s forte with only 185 penetration.. but what it does have is 230 armor and 28.88 far DPS and a romulan cloaking device making it the perfect counter to all allied medium tanks and tank destroyers (except the SU-85 ironically since it can self spot and kite to alleviate the dps trouble)... very much worth the 50 manpower and 5 fuel increase
Ok that's factored in cost difference but you still NEED to destroy them, sonehow...
A jadgpanzer 4 can't do that. |
I meants the thorough salvage ability. My bad 
Anyway, I think we´ve agreed on everything, laughed a bit on my meme and not it´s time to go back to topic 
Yeah nice meme XDXDXD |
but they fall into a same category as radio silencio or scavenge
Radio silence does nothing but conceal your units in a map nobody ever uses but imperial dane when casting.
Situational, indeed, not a useless muni sink.
Scarvenge is simply good with everything useful, i have it among my three doctrines like i have heavy cav in usf and mobile defense in ukf, but it can give you any at power at all.
The problem would be if scarvenge had a stug g call in for example. |
-Pack Howie is trash cause it's unreliable, expensive, not too much mobility requiring 3 guys to operate. Barrage is top tier, specially at vet2, but it only shoots 3 fucking shells. Auto attack is only 80 range, so it will get trashed on by any of the indirect mp based units from axis (turbo mortar, which after the deserved nerf to USF mortar is the best mp based indirect fire bar mortar pit and ISG 100 base range).
-Scot is not a good blob killer. It's a single unit wiper or attrition machine which needs to be in the front (60 range).
-Major arty is good nowadays but doesn't fulfil the role of indirect fire.
-Sherman HE are amazing but mostly against single flanking units. Not the norm on the late game or most teamgame maps.
-Priest is good (if you decrew) but it's not CalliOP good.
-MHT is good but most often that not it works against your main "win condition", if you are playing against meta OKW. I don't want to face OKW in the late game as USF.
You play USF because u want an aggro faction which can defeat 2xOKW in the early-mid game or transition into the late game with enough advantage. There are plenty of maps on which Jacksons end up been dead weight, specially on the 2v2 map rotation. The CalliOP is one of the few reasons you would even play USF in teamgames. Armor and Heavy cavalry are mostly 1v1 commanders. For the rest, either UKF/SU can do the same job better. 2xBar rifles are good as long as you stay ahead on the game and you don't lose vet.
CalliOP is basically a back up plan.
1v1 meta =/= teamgame meta.
And 80 range autoattack is the same of isg autoattack, but on top of that pack has good aoe.
At any range at which mortar can hit it pack has still less scatter and better aoe.
The three shells limit is a pain in the a** but giving vet 0 4 shells is quite op.
Isg itself need a nerf/buff overhaul that put it closer to pack howie imho.
Both sherman he and scott projectiles have aoe, so i don't get how they are good against single squads.
A bunched blob is going to suffer terribly from both and 60 range is enough for trolling blobs.
Nah that is cheese bullshit, priest is good, period, no freaking decrew.
Priest is far more annoying against okw than calliope,with their constant pounding.
Calliope is less situational and more of a wiping tool
How jackson can be a dead weight ? i thought it was more of a su85, jadgpanzer 4, stug issue, how can a turretted tank have issues regarding maps ?
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