I like Barton's ideas, and I think it could work. Tbh, though, I don't think that an upgrade is really necessary to achieve this balance between early-game OK-ness and late-game scalability.
I mean, if they do get an upgrade, that will allow them to scale. Though, the question is what kind of upgrade to give them to prevent role overlaps:
- Guards have long-range DPS covered
- Shocks should, in theory, be the goto squad for short-range DPS
There are ways of letting Penals scale with their SVT rifles, with bonuses alone, without turning the unit into death-gods of they pick up weapons.
e.g. Suppose you want to make Penals 15% weaker at Vet0 and 30% stronger than what they are, at Vet3:
- Take WBP current Penals
- Apply a +30% accuracy buff to Penal SVTs (the weapon)
- Apply a -34% accuracy nerf to the squad (the models)
- Progressively, apply a 52% buff to the squad, as they vet up (according to how fast you want them to scale)
Finally, the reason we are fixated on fixing the Penals is because out of all possible openings, we deem that Soviet T1 to be the most problematic tier of all. Since we have the tournament coming up for Sunday, we wanted to make sure people would feel invited to try all possible tier openings, so that we can gather better quality feedback.
well, historically Penal battalions were very good equipped due to their hard role in combat, they use SVT-40, that could be like rifles standard rifle, give them upgrade for 90 munis that gives them flamer and 3 Ppsh, also i think that some standard nade or molotov at least would be a good idea, maybe AT nade? that way Penals can make a good close combat role |
damn, why the hell you guys try to make some ultra important role for Penals? why not let them be good anti infantry unit? maybe some slightly worse in early and better in late (compared to current CoH2 version not winter patch), there are actually a lot more things that needs to be changed and you are toying with Penals lul  |
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is it me or thiw winter patch gets more retarded over time? |
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IMO, the M42 in T1 would suit much better than PTRS's on Penals, why? because PTRS on penals make them useless vs infantry in most cases and it would make them somewhat good vs very light vehicles, M42 could use some buff, for example raketen camo option |
Do note that Stug-E becoming better, and more consistent vs stationary infantry is the intended design.
The trade-off here, is that stug-E should be considerably worse vs mobile infantry.
Also note that a Stug-E costs about half of the resources that a Brummbar requires. Thus, 2x Stug-E's should be somewhat comparable. Especially now that Stug-E packs inferior AT utility/durability to the Brummbar.
The days of cheesing the Stug-E commander are over.
However, Stug-E should still have -something- to draw people to picking this commander over the other commanders.
The real stress-test here is how Stug-E performs vs AT guns.
why do you compare easier to get Stug E to a high tech brumbar? in that case 2 Stug E's should be worse than brumbar |
Translation: We love our community doing everything for us. They create our balance patches, create us maps & skins, and playing in our warpaint tournies, which are just commercials to sell skins(which we didnt even make). We continue to make money while doing the bare minimum. We  CoH2.
Also was ESL & warpaint major accomplishments? Nothing really came after ESL. Majority of players & streamers left after ESL and only came back for warpaint (I know because, despite not playing for over a month, a lot of them were still high on the leaderboards #DemBoards). We lost our main balance designer and the balance team but they weren't replaced. The warpaint opening rounds had close to ESL viewership but the finals dropped about 300-500 viewers. There was little point to the physical finals. The penultimate interviews weren't even full screen. Thankfully they got a real webcam for the finals but the audio quality was bad. Ultimately, nothing came from Warpaint.
However Relic is fine with their performance because Warpaint was a commercial to sell skins. The tournament was a way to incentivize the community to buy skins so when the actual tournament started, we saw a lack of Relic support because the tournament served its purpose. There was no real hype. All Kyle did was post a facebook post & a tweet, which weren't promoted (you could get away with not promoting a tweet but a facebook post from a page needs to be promoted due to how the algorithms work; though you would want to promote the shit out the tourny so its a fail to have no ad campaign) Kyle even went on vacation after warpaint started #DatSupport.
At the end of the day, Relic can say all these things to impress their peers & maintain Relic's prestige. However, the truth is far different. No one knows what coh2 is, except for people who remember the original, and it has zero relevance to the esports ecosystem. It is much easier to do the bare minimum so you can say "ESL & Warpaint were a success & We still support our competitive scene" rather than actually making the tournies a success or actually supporting the competitive scene. Relic lacks the tenacity to "hunt with the big dogs & pee in the tall grass" so they stay in their comfort zone. In the comfort zone, they'll continue to make a good ROI from CoH2 and can pad their resume but the trappings of success aren't success. The truth is CoH2 is a failure and Relic doesn't care because they're continuing to make money for the bare minimum of effort.
lot of thing are true here
the major problem of Relic is that they don't make good competetive games, and it's not promoted as much as other competetive games instead, they prefer game for "fun" but i ask, where's fun in imbalanced game?, relic always liked the easiest way, release half made game into tons of patches, then some expansions that evolves in even bigger imbalance and more patches, some DLCs like skins and at the end relic works on other game and abandons the previous ones, that has always been with relic, they just can't make one good stable game and promote it as it should be |
PG nades being bundle wouldn´t be best idea becuase of their range and schrecks.
Gammon bombs are planned to work the same way as satchel but it cannot be currently changed because relic didn´t allow them to change british hammer and they don´t want to buff hammer without nerfing it (yes it need to be nerfed [comet])
so what's the point of nerfing bundle nade range? it's actually retarded that heavier nade could be thrown further than normal nade (or at least at the same range at rifle nade) |
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i just came to an idea, since penals now use satchels as AT thing, why can't PGs bundle nades, british gammon bombs work the same way? that could be interesting, despite the fact that PG's bundle nade was used as AT grenade |
so sticky satchel is still aq timing ability? if so then it's pretty much useless vs more skilled players |
dunno if someone mentioned it before but i think this bug shows when the tank you fire at is in cover or in other elevation, or behind obstacle, hope i helped, cheers |
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