That one volley also always hit wherever you want it to. And believe me, we'd like very much for katiusha to shoot 16 rockets at once instead of that silly voleys that allow you to completely avoid barrage after first 4 rockets.
Sorry, but since the OKW change back in alpha, OKW isn't really based on forward base anymore, its just as valid to get trucks on field as it is to get them in your base, difference being risk vs reward and even that can be mitigated by proper positioning. Truck in open field will die, truck behind tree line will live long and prosper.
If you're setting up forward base as OKW you need to make sure you have the means to defend it and by the time katiusha arrives you should have puma or stuka to hardcounter it anyway.
Many people set up forward trucks aggressively and get punished for that, because that is how its supposed to be. Its not like you can't use stuka on USF major+medic truck to destroy his forward base in one hit.
You can also one shoot soviet FHQ with stuka.
There is nothing wrong with indirect fire weapons hardcountering static exposed positions-thats their intended role.
....................
you're comparing a doctrine to a faction... right? Just so we're straight... you're explaining the validity of hard countering a doctrinal ability... and a faction's army essence... right?
I mean, on the alpha forums you threw around that point alot, the army essence that you had read so thoroughly. So I couldn't have mistook you there, because you're very thorough with your perceptions.
Your first point is almost as inane as your second being that you brought up the CHOICE of positioning your base aggressively or carefully. That point is void being that if you're playing against RU, the choice is made for you. You'd be an idiot to place outside, all based on one unit.
You also didn't engage all my points. Try again. |
I wonder if OP will quit the game all together when he meets stuka zu fuss.
You can't call Stuka balanced and at the same time call katiusha op.
Either both of them are OP or none is.
The threads and posts on this are a classic example of double standards.
Stuka annihilates whole armies, infantry and armor alike with pinpoint accuracy while being able to survive a tank shot, I'm fine with this.
Katiusha can be killed in seconds by osttruppen squad and now actually is a thread-all of sudden OP.
Yea, sorry, you can't call one OP without calling other one OP as well.
... Except one is more expensive, with a viciously longer cool down, and with one volley instead of four?
Where do you get these comparisons?
Even if you ignore all those glaringly valid points, you still have the fact that neither Allie faction is based on setting up a forward operation. So if you get wrecked by a stuka you're just blobbing. If a katyusha fires on an OKW deployed truck, it's gone in 2 (incredibly short) cooldowns and everything around it is too, rendering null any attempts to save it. |
It has a better suppression and a much larger arc. I'm sure as people start playing this patch this thread will grow in size because really it is pretty silly.
Whether the Maxim should be nerfed or not is at least debatable, this is just blatantly OP.
That's glaringly bias.
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What, are you telling me you don't like getting duplicate faceplates after 3 hours of gaming?
Madness!
Hah hah hah hah!
Duplicates, that would be mildly frustrating...
No, sir. I have 2 different faceplates that I have tripled up on now... |
They want to keep you grinding just enough to motivate you to keep playing but not enough to discourage you.
There will likely be adjustments and additions down the road but they sure as hell can't please everyone.
You're absolutely right, and I don't expect them to make everyone happy. But I can't see any logical positive to this approach.
It's literally content they've created and are utilizing to promote a grind to earn mentality. |
If your tactics and strategy are well planned and executed, you will still perform reasonably well.
This isn't a balance issue, nor a thread asking for advice. You're right, we still perform well.
But this does not mean that there isn't frustrations that are a direct result of the war spoils system.
I'm not saying that we don't have a system that works, I'm saying we have one system that works because that's the only system we're allowed. |
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I concede that this thread has a high chance of being locked and the reasoning is understandable.
Generally I don't like to create threads when there is already a suitable one for the topic. But I can't help but feel like this is an exception, especially when it's been blasted everywhere.
I am absolutely baffled by this new system and how it was ever approved.
I get to play with my brother once a week because we both work and have responsibilities. Throughout the week we spend about half an hour each day e-mailing or calling one another on strats and ideas we've managed to think up/read about. All so that when we do have that available time to play CoH2, we are as prepared as we can possibly be without playing hours every night.
I don't begrudge players who have more time to play their experience. You wouldn't tell an Olympic swimmer that his medal is invalid because "you stay at home all day and train, nerd." Infact, most of my competitive gaming experience comes from MMO's and MOBAs where generally, a huge time sink is necessary to compete at top levels.
But that is precisely why we don't play MMO's or MOBAs. Because so long as our tactics and strategy are well thought and executed, we can play reasonably well in an RTS game.
Trying to keep the point reasonably short. Why are you trying to turn this RTS into a grind session? It's literally killing my enjoyment with the game to have my options limited based on time allotted to play. Not to mention all the repeat bulletins I keep getting.
It's incredibly baffling how this system was ever approved. |
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As I pointed out before, I really don't see the validity in comparing Shocks and Obers. The only point I was making was the hypocrisy I'm seeing.
They are different units from different armies that have different economic values. That last point is more than enough to shut away the comparisons, but it won't.
To go into it a little further, this unit, unless replaced by a doctrinal unit, is the backbone of the OKW Army Essence. Volks are the worst starting unit in the game. Sturmpioneers do great damage at CQC, they also get murdered closing gaps unless using fog of war or cover to advance. I don't think there's anyone who can debate that OKW early game suffers the most. And there's nothing wrong with that.
There's also nothing wrong with all the other glaring gaps the army has. Because it's built that way.
Counter thought to your point. Do you think it's realistic that a 7 minute Obersoldaten squad will hit Vet 1 before any one of the 3, sometimes 5 or more, starting rifleman squads will hit Vet 2/3?
No one's debating that the obersoldaten aren't good, we're saying they need to be. |
No, the problem is that Obersoldaten have the damage output of shock troops that increases at long range with the MG34, allowing them to stay in cover rather than have to close in to do their massive damage. And they are a long range high damage DPS unit that also has a decent dual set of armour. And they also do more damage to units on retreat. Their assault rifles have cover denying bonuses.
Shocks have none of these advantages. They only work in close quarters, not from max range. They don't get retreat bonuses. They're doctrinal and deny you guard riflemen.
Obers are shock troops that work from max range and have a bunch of needless extra bonuses and barely cost more than shock troops do.
Yes, but Obersoldaten are not Shock Troops. The only comparison I made is that it's the same people spewing glaring hypocrisy.
You can't compare the two units otherwise because you shouldn't. As Gustav pointed out above, there are pros and cons.
Yes, they are an effective unit, because they absolutely need to be. And they are by no means this god squad everyone is making them out to be. |
.... but there were no Obersoldaten in WWII the way Relic is depicting them ... This is la-la land. Their were Russian shock troops.
Other German elite troops that were 'real' should get buffs and take this garbage out of the game if the plan is to represent WWII in a game. Otherwise bring on the zombies, robots and monsters.
I'm sure Relic wouldn't encounter any public relation problems renaming them to Schutzstaffel...
If we REALLY want to throw around the realism moniker, this game is going to go through some sweeping massive changes which I won't get into because it'll just incite angry posts fueled by bent pride. |
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