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Only "buff" the KT needs is the removal of mutual exclusivity with the Command Panther and SturmTiger. |
Brit recon ability from command vehicle is a commander ability and so is the recon from air landing officer, you need right commander for that.
OKW has bunch of Stuka smoke drops which can serve as recon and decloak enemy units - just as the brit ability it comes from commander. You can also use Ober STG44, as they uncloak any unit that comes into range of Obersoldaten. Last but not least, in the early game you can use Kubelwagen vet for minimap intel.
I like Sander's approach to IR HT. Recon is a very powerful tool allowing you to always make the right move. It enables you to fire upon enemy units, call smart arty and lead better assault in general. He is doing right thing to approach IR HT vision with caution, especially that it's stock, doesn't need any vet, is cheap and synergizes well with JP4, especially in teamgames.
Air landing office is going to be a stock unit, per the patch notes and retaining its vet 1 recon ability. Which is a better version of the USF Major's Recon as you can better direct it.
Fact of the matter is, OKW is losing the ability to counter cloaked units and gaining nothing in return. That is not fair and makes the already arduous task of countering snipers even more difficult.
Also Ober STGs and a loiter recon are not comparable. |
Are you aware of Valentine?
Are you aware it had same vision as former UHU, but with shorter range and wider cone at first?
Also, command vehicle recon:
-had increased CD
-had slapped muni cost for it
-can't be used on UC, you have to sacrifice AEC at the very least, making it that much more expensive
Lastly, constant, wide cone vision >>> narrow single pass plane on long CD.
I'm proposing the current command vehicle recon, not the old recon. 
Yes I'm aware of the old valentine (better than current IR HT), and the new valentine (better than the new IR HT). I actually play this game. |
It wasn't a good argument, when brits lost their version, its bad argument now.
Plus, each faction has light vehicle capable of scouting for snipers. Kubel is particularly good for this at vet1.
Nope, Brits still retain the recon ability from the command vehicle, and they now have a stock single pass recon from the new air landing officer.
Try harder. |
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Don't forget that with the IR HT change, OKW is losing its ability to uncloak snipers/commandos. This was especially important in 2v2 games with an OST teammate to counter snipe.
Please keep that in mind when designing the new ability as this 'detection' one will never be used. I suggest giving it a recon similar to the brit command vehicle, with same/similar cost. |
I'm happy with IR HT rework idea, but on the other hand what OKW will need to use to counter/reveal camo units? Drive with kubelwagen can work for first few minutes but what in the lategame? Vet 1 ability is quite ok, but you need to vet KW and keep it alive, what isn't that easy. Ostheer have access to stuka recon plane which can be countered with aa tool (fair enough) but with OKW you can use only doctrinal flares for recon (not revealing camo units tho) or use "smoke drop" but it's not it's primarly role to provide reconessance.
Good point, OKW is losing its ability to reveal units in camo with the IR HT redesign. Maybe another reason to give the new IR HT some sort of recon ability, either single pass or similar to the brit command vehicle? |
Reverting the mutual exclusiveness with the Tiger II is not unreasonable to me, I don't really agree with that either (wasn't on the team yet when that was done).
XP is already way lower than the only comparable unit, the AVRE, at 1400/2800/5600/etc vs 2020/4040/8080. Furthermore the Sturmtiger can have an easier time gathering veterancy by hitting vehicles or even scraping them, because it deals a lot more damage to vehicles than the AVRE does. Not sure why you think it should be even lower.
Its vet 1 ability was just changed to something much better.
I don't think bringing back world piercing is a good idea. The game needs less cheese, not more. It'd be a poor solution that only benefits the user, while making the experience for the receiver significantly worse.
A casemate tank firing a huge rocket is simply never going to be able to be competitively viable (without being overpowered). It's an illusion that it could ever be balanced. It can't. It will always be either overpowered or underpowered, just like similar units like the B4. Relic should have never put a unit like this in the game, but we're stuck with it now. The least we can do is making sure it's at least good enough to use for fun in (casual) automatches, which it is right now as long as the player knows a thing or two about how to aim it. And it'll get a bit better with the added utility and power of the revamped vet 1 ability.
I'd say if you can get the mutual exclusion with the KT removed along with the current revamped vet ability, the ST will see considerably higher use. I do think that the revamped vet ability is a lot stronger than the other ideas presented, and will help it vet faster anyways. |
Do note that the search light's range was a whopping 120. The highest sight range for any other unit is 91 for a vetted 222/251 with spotting scopes, and honestly those are borderline overpowered (and they cost significantly more and require a doctrinal upgrade on top of needing to be highly vetted). Range can go up for sure, but definitely nowhere near as high as 120.
It should be a lot closer to 120 than 70 as a starting sight range. If the team does go with the vet bonus route, you could have each vet level increase the range like DoomLord suggested. |
On the topic of the IR Halftrack, we would highly appreciate some tests or replays and proper suggestions about possible improvements. These are first iteration changes that are a proof of concept most of all. As volunteers we don't always have time to extensively test all changes ourselves and need the community to provide more data to finetune values, and this is such a case.
General ideas for IR HT improvement:
- Simply increase the vision to match the length of the visible search light that scans the map.
- Replace the 'Detection' ability (it will not see any use) with either a passive aura or AOE timed buff to friendly units near by that increases accuracy or something along those lines. Would benefit things like ISGs, TDs, LEFH, etc.
- Give the IR HT 5 vet levels and shared vet gain in a large radius, each vet level could add utility abilities (limited range recon flares or single pass plane, camouflage, long range dummy flares, ability to reinforce inf, etc.) or additional bonuses to friendly units nearby (reload, scatter, sight range, etc.).
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United States
Relic Entertainment
cblanco ★ 
보드카 중대 
VonManteuffel 
Heartless Jäger 
