Snipers, to make them more supportive

Thx for fixing the Title ShadowLinkX37

So, snipers. It is a unit which we can all say that has an impact on the field but it is not seen as much as it should since it is often risky and sometimes it does not really pay off.

We know that at the moment, using Allied snipers and I am not trying to be biased or anything but often it pays off more since since they usually have to pick off a squad with most often (consists of) 4 units and sometimes of 5.

Currently the Wehr Sniper, there is really no point in using it when it takes longer to counter most units that consists between mostly 5 and up to 6 units.


So, my suggestion to make Wehr Sniper and other snipers to be more attractive and more viable is by starting to make their ability costs cheaper and to arrive in effectively earlier.

Probably add an additional ability to make them more attractive to those who only have 1 ability.

I mean it is already a huge gamble purchasing a sniper especially when it is the most vulnerable unit and costy unit game.


Here is how the price of the abilities costs:

Wehr Sniper "Fire Incendiary Explosive Round" should be available Vet 0 and costs 45 ammo.

But once it achieves Vet 1, the price of the "Fire Incendiary Explosive Round" should cost 30 ammo (45 to be honest is too much compared to British Sniper "Critical Shot" which costs 30 ammo).

So that it has more usage and usefulness. It is too much at the moment and I think it should get that price decrease once it achieves Vet 1.

Maybe, to even make it pay even more off, it should have in addition when it acquires Vet 1, "Tripwire Flares". Costs 10 ammo. Same ability as Conscripts "Tripwire Flares".

WEHR Sniper becomes a more viable supportive unit that is able to pick off units better due to its current difficulties.


SU sniper has "Flare" should be also available Vet 0 and costs 40 ammo as it currently does.

Once it acquires Vet 1, it should cost 25 ammo.

Add ability to put "Flares on Cap points" which is for "free" and it should be available already Vet 0. It has a cooldown of 90 seconds but it is easy to place by only 3-5 seconds. The ability should be like what OKW has with the flare on cap points.

SU sniper becomes their best and supportive recon unit (recon which they dont have really).



UKF sniper. It is hard to say what it should get because I believe it is the most useful sniper considering how extremely effective it can be and its abilities, both infantry and vehicles.

So, the Critical shot can be acquired Vet 0 but the cost is 45 ammo but once it acquries Vet 1 it costs 30 ammo.

In that way, it is useful against vehicles in the beginning making it another viable AT option for Brits.

Coordinated fire price stays the same as it is useful already enough. Especially when you can catch the enemy by surprise. No need for price decrease.

Add ability also to British Sniper, to put "Flares on Cap points" which is for "free" and it should be available already Vet 0. It has a cooldown of 90 seconds but it is easy to place by only 3-5 seconds. The ability should be like what OKW has with the flare on cap points.

EDIT

Changes to make Snipers in general a more supportive unit rather than a cheesy assassin! Nerfs and changes.

Nerf their kills per min is a must since it is OP.

I think they should nerf the Snipers potential to one shot everyone including those behind cover (expect against snipers, sniper sniping each other should still be one shot even behind cover).

I think the cover feature should take in more effect for squads against snipers, more protection against snipers.


So an enemy squad (not sniper) in green cover should apply 0.5 Recieved accuracy and 0.5 received damage

And yellow cover should be different for snipers, Recieved accuracy instead is 1 but the damage is 0.5 received damage. (Yellow cover is usually 0.5 Recieved accuracy and 1 recieved damage). Tell me what you think about this?

It is to increase resistance against snipers.


They should play a more supportive role than a role that can pick off easily anybody from anywhere behind something.

It should be more of a supportive kind of unit.

Manpower price decrease from 360 to 330. I think that would compensate for starters.


At the moment, I think SU and WEHR sniper abilities are too expensive. They should be more cheaper.

Abilities should play more a crucial role as a sniper instead of kills which it is I admit, too good at the moment.


In summary:

Nerfs completely their firepower, chances of getting kills with units behind cover is significantly reduced. Damages units behind cover (both covers only applying half damage) rather than killing. Good nerf and adjustment imo.

Plays more a support role rather than a sole cheesy assassin.

Abilities have more signifcant use and impact(as a means to play more supportive) use when the price of their abilities is decreased as well as added (for SU and WEHR, to fulfill more of a support role especially UKF).

How about no

Why not?

It is only about abilities, nothing more.

EDIT - Nerfs their potential to kill everyone from anywhere. Cover will play more a crucial role rather than something that is currently ignored by the Sniper.

It will be more a supportive unit instead!

There is so much wrong about that post...

Snipers dont often pay off? Most vulnerable unit? WHAT? They are OP as hell and easily survive even two full bursts from LVs

The Allied sniper shoots at smaller squads has been outdated since WFA came out (2014 iirc)

Soviet gettin the flare from the get go would be way too good even for quite a bit of ammo

I kinda like some of those ideas, but the snipers would first need a hell of a nerf on their kills per minute first

This is a joke, right?

Snipers are the last unit that needs buffing. They're so powerful that building them usually makes the match about whether or not the opponent can kill the sniper.

And given how random sniper-killing is, those matches are usually shit.

There is so much wrong about that post...

Snipers dont often pay off? Most vulnerable unit? WHAT? They are OP as hell and easily survive even two full bursts from LVs

The Allied sniper shoots at smaller squads has been outdated since WFA came out (2014 iirc)

Soviet gettin the flare from the get go would be way too good even for quite a bit of ammo

I kinda like some of those ideas, but the snipers would first need a hell of a nerf on their kills per minute first

Actually, you get the point there about the need to nerf their kills per min.

Changes to make Snipers in general a more supportive unit rather than a cheesy assassin! Nerfs and changes.

I think they should nerf the potential to one shot everyone including those behind cover.

I think the cover feature should take in more effect.


So green cover should apply 0.5 Recieved accuracy and 0.5 received damage

And yellow cover should be different for snipers, Recieved accuracy instead is 1 but the damage is 0.5 received damage. (Yellow cover is usually 0.5 Recieved accuracy and 1 recieved damage). Tell me what you think about this?


They should play a more supportive role than a role that can pick off easily anybody from anywhere behind something.

It should be more of a supportive kind of unit.

Manpower price decrease from 360 to 330. I think that would compensate for starters.


At the moment, I think SU and WEHR sniper abilities are too expensive. They should be more cheaper.

Abilities should play more a crucial role as a sniper instead of kills which it is I admit, too good at the moment.


In summary:

Nerfs completely their firepower, chances of getting kills with units behind cover is significantly reduced. Damages units behind cover (both covers only applying half damage) rather than killing. Good nerf and adjustment imo.

Plays more a support role rather than a sole cheesy assassin.

Abilities have more signifcant use and impact(as a means to play more supportive) use when the price of their abilities is decreased as well as added (for SU and WEHR, to fulfill more of a support role especially UKF).

Taking into account responses from all sides up to this post, I therefore proclaim this whole threat as a one massive joke.
Ironically, the most sane response is from perma ban.

since the new buffs to UKF sniper...its the best sniper out there..(like many other units they have: the best version from older factions)

since the new buffs to UKF sniper...its the best sniper out there..(like many other units they have: the best version from older factions)

You might want to read the patch notes.

You might want to read the patch notes.

it is only a lil bit slower now..but that they removed his critical shot vs armor..i didn't see or find this...where can i see this?

it is only a lil bit slower now..but that they removed his critical shot vs armor..i didn't see or find this...where can i see this?

Ah, sorry, I dodn't understood your problem of losing vehicles to a sniper.
Now, that should be more helpful here.

Open this thread when CoH3 is announce. Maybe we end up with snipers again, maybe we end up with Pathfinders and JLI next time.

Open this thread when CoH3 is announce. Maybe we end up with snipers again, maybe we end up with Pathfinders and JLI next time.

Inb4 they combine them and make 4 men sniper teams

I do like the general direction of making them more supportive rather than bleed machines though. Sniper play can be interesting, but it can also be terribly unfun to play against. Feeling you need a sniper to keep up with other infantry is also not cool, as has been the case at various states of the game.

Open this thread when CoH3 is announce. Maybe we end up with snipers again, maybe we end up with Pathfinders and JLI next time.

What is wrong with the classes?

snip

Sniper play is the least fun part of COH2. If I wanted to play a sneaky MOBA-style game, I'd play a MOBA, not COH2.

Also,

If someone brings one out, it forces you to make a counter or have a lot of MP bleed. If anything, they're too effective.

As for them being fragile, the Wehr sniper shrugs off 50cal bullets as flesh wounds, both from a 50 cal mg and from a M20. The Soviet sniper isn't as durable but it still seems to take upgraded Grens, PF's, or something like a 222 to get them. Increasing their durability is a terrible idea.

Sniper play is the least fun part of COH2. If I wanted to play a sneaky MOBA-style game, I'd play a MOBA, not COH2.

Also,

If someone brings one out, it forces you to make a counter or have a lot of MP bleed. If anything, they're too effective.

As for them being fragile, the Wehr sniper shrugs off 50cal bullets as flesh wounds, both from a 50 cal mg and from a M20. The Soviet sniper isn't as durable but it still seems to take upgraded Grens, PF's, or something like a 222 to get them. Increasing their durability is a terrible idea.

Where do you find "durability" mentioned in that post?

What is wrong with the classes?

I'm not gonna be giving an opinion in the subject rather than explaining why they have a polarising opinion on them.

This goes beyond this game and the genre. This can apply to MOBAS, FPS, fighting games, etc. A unit/ability which requires perfect input to do well, high risk/high reward, a really specific style of playing to counter, feels UNINTERACTIVE.
The one on the receiving end feels "cheated", while the one who's using it argues that his effort should be rewarded if not it's pointless to even try to use it. Then the game revolves around been able to counter the unit before it deals to enough damage.

If it's only from a watcher's perspective, this kind of things tends to be "exciting" as the results and influence of the units/abilities tend to be clear in what they achieve.

How this correlates to CoH?

In vCoH it was all about the sniper duels. Snipers who could cloak whenever they want and most of the time, the best counter to them is another sniper.
vCoH2 had snipers with less powerful cloak and they went with the assymetric route (at first) to remove the whole sniper vs sniper duels. The 2 new factions introduced some year later didn't receive any sniper at all and instead they got units which could crit (1 shot kill) if the model they were hitting were low enough in HP. People who hate snipers prefer this type of marksman squad.

Where do you find "durability" mentioned in that post?

Here

I think the cover feature should take in more effect.


So green cover should apply 0.5 Recieved accuracy and 0.5 received damage

And yellow cover should be different for snipers, Recieved accuracy instead is 1 but the damage is 0.5 received damage. (Yellow cover is usually 0.5 Recieved accuracy and 1 recieved damage). Tell me what you think about this?

Bad suggestion. Snipers are already much too durable. I've had snipers stand in open ground at long range against my unupgraded Grens and never really be at risk of losing the sniper. I had an OST sniper take a direct hit by a pack howie and walk away from it.

I don't mind the overall suggestion of changing them to be more of a support unit.

Here



Bad suggestion. Snipers are already much too durable. I've had snipers stand in open ground at long range against my unupgraded Grens and never really be at risk of losing the sniper. I had an OST sniper take a direct hit by a pack howie and walk away from it.

I don't mind the overall suggestion of changing them to be more of a support unit.

I probably did not make myself clear enough.

What I meant to say was when Snipers go against units in cover.

It should be more difficult for Snipers instead. (Wont be able to kill units in cover anymore).


They play more supportive and damage units.

Unless they are exposed, the are vulnerable to being 1 shot.

Snipers in coh3 imo should only deal half a model’s health (but 3/4 a siper’s health) but snipers take a HUGE amount of time to heal (like 45 seconds)

Less reward, but less risk. I think that’s fair