PAK vs Zis AT guns

Zis pros & cons

pros:
1. Handles tanks with its good range and pene (same as Pak),
2. Has anti infantry barrage,
3. 6-men squad - great sustainability (especially doubled up zis combo),
4. Has camo (doctrinal)

Cons:

1. Has occasional bugs.

PAK pros & cons

pros:
1. Handles tanks with its good range and pene (but misses alot sometimes).

cons:

1. 4-men squad, (very vulnerable against flamethrowers like Kv-8, crocodile, etc)
2. doesnt have anti - infantry,
3. doesnt have camo.


So, am I the only one who thinks PAKs need a buff in some way or what is is going on here?

The pak reloads faster and has better penetration.

Their accuracy and range is identical.

The pak reloads faster and has better penetration.

Their accuracy and range is identical.

This.

That's how the pak can counter lights and how the zis has a hard time at doing so, serving more as a deterrant.

Zis is your best bet against any armored unit above a medium if you can't use a Su85. Also, the vet on the zis covers most of its downsides.

Also consider the flamer units you name are late game heavies designed to break stalemates and dugout positions

The pak also has a snare ability. Only nobody seems to use it anymore since it isent a 100% stun anymore. Combined with better reload and pen makes it better at the at department overall.

So, am I the only one who thinks PAKs need a buff in some way or what is is going on here?

Yes.
Their primary role is killing tanks and PAK is superior choice.

If there is any AT gun that needs real changes. I think it is the Raketenwerfer since it has much more cons than what you have compared to Pak40. Raketenewerfer does not play a proper AT supportive role, that is the biggest con! It plays more of a recon role which limits OKW capabilities. Too much recon!

Pak40 is undeniably superior due to the fact it has good range, penetration. You forgot however to mention its stun ability which is in fact very useful.

Raketenwerfer in contrast. Its only major upside is its Camo. The rest is all cons.

Shit RA, range, survivability, all combo into the worst sandwich you ever tasted!

You can depend on it but it proves unreliable as it is somewhat buggy and the fact it loves to rot/die all the time makes it all the more unreliable. It happens every so know and then that the Rak just instantly dies because of how vulnerable it is. That is what needs changes.

USF AT gun for 280 manpower and with what it comes along. Makes it simply the best for its price. Raketenwerfer for 270 manpower, that is simply not worth it in comparison!

Camos real function for Rak is just a covered up/sauced "suicide button" in many case scenarios!

If there is any AT gun that needs real changes. I think it is the Raketenwerfer since it has much more cons than what you have compared to Pak40. Raketenewerfer does not play a proper AT supportive role, that is the biggest con! It plays more of a recon role which limits OKW capabilities. Too much recon!

Pak40 is undeniably superior due to the fact it has good range, penetration. You forgot however to mention its stun ability which is in fact very useful.

Raketenwerfer in contrast. Its only major upside is its Camo. The rest is all cons.

Shit RA, range, survivability, all combo into the worst sandwich you ever tasted!

You can depend on it but it proves unreliable as it is somewhat buggy and the fact it loves to rot/die all the time makes it all the more unreliable. It happens every so know and then that the Rak just instantly dies because of how vulnerable it is. That is what needs changes.

USF AT gun for 280 manpower and with what it comes along. Makes it simply the best for its price. Raketenwerfer for 270 manpower, that is simply not worth it in comparison!

Camos real function for Rak is just a covered up/sauced "suicide button" in many case scenarios!

I don´t think u really know how to use Raketenwerfers. They are not well designed and very frustrating yes. But they are not bad unless you don't know what you are doing.

I am playing soviets I would be more than happy to capture Pak vs Zis mainly due to rate of fire and that stun ability.

I don´t think u really know how to use Raketenwerfers. They are not well designed and very frustrating yes. But they are not bad unless you don't know what you are doing.

It is just simply frustrating to use. I do not like the way and how it functions although I know how it should be used. It should not be the case. It should be less frustrating as all other AT guns and should have more of a supportive impact. That is all!

Camo is just for recon purposes, not a real AT ability like what the others have. It would be if it had the same range as others. If even the camo function was nerfed in exchange for better range, than it would have a somewhat better impact but currently it does not as the others do.

OKW has already, too much recon. Should be changed.

It is just simply frustrating to use. I do not like the way and how it functions although I know how it should be used. It should not be the case. It should be less frustrating as all other AT guns and should have more of a supportive impact. That is all!

Camo is just for recon purposes, not a real AT ability like what the others have. It would be if it had the same range as others. If even the camo function was nerfed in exchange for better range, than it would have a somewhat better impact but currently it does not as the others do.

OKW has already, too much recon. Should be changed.

Camo is also very good for unsuspected rear armor shots, contesting dangerous points to force the enemy out and allows you to offensively open against Soviet and USF armor. Also with vet it gets a guaranteed pen and bonus damage when shooting out of camo.

But this post is about ZiS and PaK:
Basically there's still the old CoH2 design in there: Highly effective specialized German PaK vs a more jack-of-all-trades Soviet ZiS.