Elephant and Tiger are useless

For what these two tanks offer, I would argue that their cost is so far and beyond what is reasonable it's insulting.

The Tiger has less DPS than the P4. FULL STOP. I can continue point by point and say more about the Tiger but don't need to. Any conversation of the Tiger begins and ends with that statement. The Tiger does less DPS than a P4.

But let's go on... because it needs to be said. The Tiger has lots of armor; fine and well.... It's not speedy and not slow but adequate, handling 'feels right.' Turret rotation is slow, and that would be OK if the Tigers DPS was higher than a P4, but it isn't, so it's not OK. I can continue further and talk of how the Tank as it currently is has no real roll; it's not anti-tank and it's not anti-infantry and it isn't even an 'all-rounder' ....it's not really anything other than an expensive prop.

The Elephant almost never gets called-in because it's ultra expensive, for one, and two, a single T34 can zerg rush your defenses and render your nice toy wholly inoperable in an instant. The Elephant is just way too much of a liability. I don't build these and when I see teammates build them they get lost fast, and not for a lack of trying to adequately preserve it and use it correctly.

Of the Tiger and Elephant I only ever call the Tiger and that's only if I'm winning and want to win style points or have a laugh. And the Elephant I never call because it's simply too expensive for its current efficiency.

There isn't a single instance, as things are currently, that players wouldn't rather have several P4's or Panthers for the cost of a single Tiger Elephant.

For what it's worth, there are similar criticisms of the Soviet call-in's but those are different animals and should be left to their own thread. Also, none of these units (German or Russian) should be WTF PAWN machines.... but their cost should reflect what they are. And they currently don't.

The Tiger has less DPS than the P4. FULL STOP. I can continue point by point and say more about the Tiger but don't need to. Any conversation of the Tiger begins and ends with that statement. The Tiger does less DPS than a P4.

Against what? Infantry?

The T-34/85 does the same anti-infantry damage as the T-34/76. The Comet does the same anti-infantry damage as the Cromwell.

Armour? The Sherman does more DPS than the Jackson.

You can't just ignore armour and penetration. They're core mechanics of the game.

The Tiger has less DPS than the P4. FULL STOP. I can continue point by point and say more about the Tiger but don't need to.

Please don't, because there is only so much bullshit this forum can take and given how you started, I doubt anyone would manage to hear how tiger has less armor and health then P4.

Tiger has more DPS then P4 due to having
-better penetration
-better reload
-better AoE
-better scatter
-better range(more accurate at the same distance)

The only thing you can confirm is that you're completely ignorant and clueless about stats and performance of the units you attempt to discussed, but that was already established yesterday, now you're just reinforcing it.

Regarding elephant, I'll just leave this here

Against what? Infantry?

The T-34/85 does the same anti-infantry damage as the T-34/76. The Comet does the same anti-infantry damage as the Cromwell.

Armour? The Sherman does more DPS than the Jackson.

You can't just ignore armour and penetration. They're core mechanics of the game.

That's not true. T85 has muchanged better aoe than piss cannon called t76. It wipes models with every shot while t76 misses most of ther time.

Comet also has better aoe than Cromwell and the while phosphorus rounds fuck with AT guns like does big dog with small.

So far I haven't been able to do the same with Cromwell.



You're comparing apples to cinnamon.

P4 is medium generalist and Tiger is heavy generalist. It is literally supposed to be P4 on steroids (except speed).

More comparable would be Sherman to Perching.

And as we all know Pershing is miles ahead of the Sherman in every way. The same cannot be said about Tiger.

That's not true. T85 has muchanged better aoe than piss cannon called t76. It wipes models with every shot while t76 misses most of ther time.

Comet also has better aoe than Cromwell and the while phosphorus rounds fuck with AT guns like does big dog with small.

So far I haven't been able to do the same with Cromwell.

From Cruzz's stats, accurate to SBP:

• The AoE profile on the Comet is identical to the AoE profile on the Cromwell.

• The AoE profile on the T-34/76 is identical to the AoE profile on the T-34/85.

Are you just making stuff up or what?

That's not true. T85 has muchanged better aoe than piss cannon called t76. It wipes models with every shot while t76 misses most of ther time.

2.5 AoE of 85 is "muchanged better aoe" then piss poor 2.5 AoE of 76.

Comet also has better aoe than Cromwell and the while phosphorus rounds fuck with AT guns like does big dog with small.

So far I haven't been able to do the same with Cromwell.

That's surprising, because they have EXACT SAME STATS when it comes to shooting at infantry.
Same scatter, same damage, same damage dropoff, same AoE.

You're comparing apples to cinnamon.

And you're comparing what voices in your head whisper you to what you see on shrooms.

P4 is medium generalist and Tiger is heavy generalist. It is literally supposed to be P4 on steroids (except speed).

And all the stats support that.

More comparable would be Sherman to Perching.

And as we all know Pershing is miles ahead of the Sherman in every way. The same cannot be said about Tiger.

Pershing is much less durable then tiger while having the same cost, all that fuel and menpower that goes for durability on tiger goes for firepower on pershing. But you didn't knew that as well obviously.


Just so we are clear here, when he was busy flaming me on PM yesterday, I did gave him Cruzzis stat page, this thread exists out of sheer ignorance and denial

Please don't, because there is only so much bullshit this forum can take and given how you started, I doubt anyone would manage to hear how tiger has less armor and health then P4.

Tiger has more DPS then P4 due to having
-better penetration
-better reload
-better AoE
-better scatter
-better range(more accurate at the same distance)

The only thing you can confirm is that you're completely ignorant and clueless about stats and performance of the units you attempt to discussed, but that was already established yesterday, now you're just reinforcing it.

Regarding elephant, I'll just leave this here

Yet you forgot to mention that Tiger cost is roughly same as 2 P4s so it should have comparable DPS to 2 of them combined. Yet it is barely better than 1 panzer by 30% or so.


So next time do not swing around with fake statistics thanks.

Or as would churchill say...

From Cruzz's stats, accurate to SBP:

• The AoE profile on the Comet is identical to the AoE profile on the Cromwell.

• The AoE profile on the T-34/76 is identical to the AoE profile on the T-34/85.

Are you just making stuff up or what?

Cruzz stats are OUT- DA-TED

Cruzz stats are OUT-DA-TED

And not a single of the stats relevant for this discussion was altered since.
They're as up to date as they can be.

Also, thank you for putting the quote from my PM to you in your sig, you are proving me correct on that one so hard its not even funny.

And not a single of the stats relevant for this discussion was altered since.
They're as up to date as they can be.

When those 2 tanks are the same then why T85 shell has much bigger impact blast than t76 ?

Okay. Let's run a test then. You will found out yourself that generally T85 kills squad sooner than T76

Ok.

Go do the test 5 times and post a replay for review.

Burden of proof lies in the one who makes the claim.

Wehrmacht is in a bad spot right now but the Elefant is super strong in teamgames. If you can get and protect it you will win the match.
Tiger I should get buffed, yes, but you can say the same about IS2. Heavies in general need some love.

The Tiger has less DPS than the P4. FULL STOP. I can continue point by point and say more about the Tiger but don't need to. Any conversation of the Tiger begins and ends with that statement. The Tiger does less DPS than a P4.

Yet you forgot to mention that Tiger cost is roughly same as 2 P4s so it should have comparable DPS to 2 of them combined. Yet it is barely better than 1 panzer by 30% or so.

Or as would churchill say...

Quite ironic of you posting that picture..

From Cruzz's stats, accurate to SBP:

• The AoE profile on the Comet is identical to the AoE profile on the Cromwell.

• The AoE profile on the T-34/76 is identical to the AoE profile on the T-34/85.

On a side note: while the T-34-76 and T-34-85 have exactly the same AOE profile, the T-34-85 does have slightly better AI because it has less scatter (distance max is 5 vs 6.9 of 76). I think.

Quite ironic of you posting that picture..



On a side note: while the T-34-76 and T-34-85 have exactly the same AOE profile, the T-34-85 does have slightly better AI because it has less scatter (distance max is 5 vs 6.9 of 76).

I didn't know 35% scatter decrease is "slightly better" but K

Besides the fact that max distance is only one part of the scatter calculation, you literally just called the Tiger's 30% increase in DPS over the P4 "barely better".

Besides the fact that max distance is only one part of the scatter calculation, you literally just called the Tiger's 30% increase in DPS over the P4 "barely better".

Talk about mental gymnastics lol.

Once against twisting facts.

Tigwe is not even barely better, because against 2 P4 (the same fuel cost) it's outperformed by a great margin.

You are comparing apples to cinammon

Cruzz stats are OUT- DA-TED

They're accurate to the Spring Balance Patch.

I'm not aware of any alterations to the weapons of the Cromwell, Comet, T-34/76 or T-34/85 in any subsequent patches.

If you have an alternate source, quote it. Otherwise, you're literally lying through your teeth and it's readily apparent to everyone here.

If you have an alternate source, quote it. Otherwise, you're literally lying through your teeth and it's readily apparent to everyone here.

Except I am not. You cannot post a blantant lie and then call it truth unless someone disproves it.


Talking about this remind me the Russel's Teapot