Nice Balance Patxh RELIC!

Its worth pointing out that if Relic are going to be more subtle in their balance changes they could probably afford to release them more frequently to aid in 'fine-tuning'.

The JLI change for example took a long time considering what has actually been done to the unit. I would have expected this a few weeks ago so that we could have it as close to 'balanced' as possible by now.

Edit: and to the person above complaining about Sextons. Ha ha ha. No.

Remember the patch they heavily nerfed Soviet AT Overwatch?
Yeah, I wish we had that kind of hard nerf on JLI, considering how long we waited for them to be a bit more expensive.

Its worth pointing out that if Relic are going to be more subtle in their balance changes they could probably afford to release them more frequently to aid in 'fine-tuning'.

The JLI change for example took a long time considering what has actually been done to the unit. I would have expected this a few weeks ago so that we could have it as close to 'balanced' as possible by now.

If memory serves, Relic has to pay Valve every time they patch. It's why games on Steam have big patches far apart and games with their own launchers have much faster patch cycles.

I will write it here only 1 time and will also not more discuss it.

As highfiveee said: In past it was always overbuff or over nerf.
So this time we went for small steps. Don't forget the cd on 100 sec before you can call another one it.
Did you played games already on the new version? or just saw the patchnotes and complain.

OP units remain OP whatever their price is, is also a lesson learnt from the past - but hey you probably forget about that one. How 280mp / 100s cd will prevent them to be called until reaching critical mass is a mystery to me.
Remember why KT, Tiger, IS, ISU etc... are locked to 1 active per player? If players were able to get on a regular basis 2 tigers per players on the battlefield, how will it be difficult to get 3 or 4 JLIs...

But in my opinion the fact that the balance team purposely didn't touch their stats, even a little bit like for the AE shows a big positive bias over OKW.
We're talking about a unit that was fine before - not underwhelming on its own other than being in a underwhelming doctrine, where reducing their CP requirement would have been probably enough to make them more appealing (you know the same way Pathfinders are 10x more appealing today without touching their stats), getting that famous 3xbuff with crazy synergies in their new doctrine.
And you're answer is "oh we will go step by step to downgrade their performance, we don't want to overnerf them the way we overbuffed them in first hand. So let's keep them overbuffed, a bit less that before but still, next patch in in 2 months thxbye."

I too agree with some people here that the design of JLI doesn't fit into the game. Cover usage is a quintessential example of high-level play, and giving players a unit which can be massed, blobbed, and counters a core element of CoH2 doesn't seem to fit.

I feel like there surely are some fantastic alternatives. I can name a few off the top of my head:

• Limit the JLI squad to ONE to make it an elite support unit. You can leave it's potency then since at least it functions as a specialist and not a frontline infantry.
  
  
• Replace the JLI's squads guns with new guns. For example, in CoH1, both the Volksgrenadier and Grenadier used Kar98ks. The guns had identical stats except for two important variables: damage and accuracy. The Grenadier's Kar98K did 50% more damage (15 vs 10) than the Volk's, and was 10% more accurate at all ranges (.85/.65/.45 vs .75/.55/.35). My point being, JLI could still be an "elite" unit which could "replace" front line infantry through the game, much like CoH1's Grenadiers did, if you were to give them better damage and accuracy.
  
  
• My last suggestion is to replace the squad with a sniper call in. A sniper would function doing the same role as the JLI squad but fits into the games current design.
  

Hopefully, someone reads this and we can talk civilly

I like slight change better than overnerf. And I think JLI's current price is fine, since without G43, it has same combat potent as Pathfinder.

The problem lays in Overwatch Doctrine, this doctrine is too versatile comparing to other doctrines. That's why we never see JLI spam with Scavenge Doctrine.

I like slight change better than overnerf. And I think JLI's current price is fine, since without G43, it has same combat potent as Pathfinder.

The problem lays in Overwatch Doctrine, this doctrine is too versatile comparing to other doctrines. That's why we never see JLI spam with Scavenge Doctrine.

What a u talking about?

did u see King of the hill league?

all okw players choose scavenge doctrine and spam JLI

...
But in my opinion the fact that the balance team purposely didn't touch their stats, even a little bit like for the AE shows a big positive bias over OKW.
...

Yea that theory makes perfect sense especially since the latest patch
nerf 2 OKW abilities and buffed 2
Nerf 1 USF abilities and buffed 4

What a u talking about?

did u see King of the hill league?

all okw players choose scavenge doctrine and spam JLI

That's because Overwatch Doctrine is banned in this season's King of Hill. And no one build 3 or 4 squads of JLI.

So two squads of same unit is called spamming by your definition?

That's because Overwatch Doctrine is banned in this season's King of Hill. And no one build 3 or 4 squads of JLI.

So two squads of same unit is called spamming by your definition?

yep all games in okw players choose scavenge doctrine and use 1 or 2 JLI

is it not "spam"?


Just go to play brits and build bofos for counter JLI u said ^^

Alot of the so called "OP" stats ppl claim the JLI, has, they've had for the past 4 years, why wernt they OP then too?

What the mod team is doing excacly right, trying to find the sweet spot between when they were OP and never used where as thes weeboos want to triple nerf it into oblivion, ffs limited to 1? ridiculous

Actually 2 unit is not spamming 4-5+ is

It's kind of a shame that blobbing and vehicles is almost everything you can do vs JLI. I think no other unit encourages blobbing from the allies player more than JLI.

Nonetheless I appreciate this approach of balancing a unit instead of overnerfing hard

Alot of the so called "OP" stats ppl claim the JLI, has, they've had for the past 4 years, why wernt they OP then too?

What the mod team is doing excacly right, trying to find the sweet spot between when they were OP and never used where as thes weeboos want to triple nerf it into oblivion, ffs limited to 1? ridiculous

Because they were stuck in a bad doctrine and had insane reinforcement costs plus 2 CP requirement. Now they got cheaper, available more early, added first strike bonus and improved scoped g43 accuracy vs heavy cover and garrisons.

Alot of the so called "OP" stats ppl claim the JLI, has, they've had for the past 4 years, why wernt they OP then too?

Because their sniper rifle obeyed cover rules.

• Small arms have 0.5 accuracy versus cover, which means a squad in cover is about twice as durable.
  
• Green cover also halves the damage a squad takes, making a squad in green cover about four times more durable.

The last patch changed that multiplier to 0.9 for the JLI's sniper rifle. Combine that with its damage coming primarily from instakill crits, and that sniper rifle almost ignores cover entirely. This means you can't coverfight them. You'll lose. You've either got to blob up to Range 10 or retreat.

The rest of the unit's fine: powerful, but little cost tweaks can help with that. The crit rifle is the problem.

More specifically is the potential damage to 75% crit compared to 40%
it's 60 damage vs 32 potential damage

just lower the crit to 50 % and add another sniper rifle

so pathfinder have more fire rate less potential damage but more consistent

while JLI have more potential damage but less fire rate and consistency

the cover bonus would not really be a problem if the potential damage is lower

I also am not a big fan of overnerf/buff of relic.

But even within this patch, UKF was restricted to produce only one Balentine Tank
(Not saying previous light-tank spamming was OK, but THIS wit JLI mp 30+? Am I the only one thinking this doesn't make sense?)

And JLI's OPness is not only the matter of manpower. Of course, 250mp with 1cp was way too cost effective, yes.

But the real problem lies on it's insta kill + ignoring obstacles + house respawn.

But okay, let's see how the patch goes. And you said, THANK YOU for keeping this old game.