Fallshirmjager usage

Meh, using them on mid-long range engagements makes them pretty bad compared to Volks as their DPS is not that much higher on those ranges and they lose 25% of it per dropped model as opposed to Volks who retain their highest DPS weapon untill the last two models. If you want mid range engagements you're better off with STG Volks, and for long range there's LMG Obers.

FSJ have nearly 300% the dps of volks k98s at all ranges including long range, and 40-50% more dps than volks stg44 at short and mid range(then 3x the dps at long range).

In addition, FSJ have 0.83 model size out the gate compared to volks with 1.0. This gives the FSJ squad an effective small arms durability of 385.5hp per squad vs volks with 400 (or grens with 351.6hp). point being they arent really all that squishy, only issue being the small squad size vs aoe.


They are excellent units to use in conjunction with Valiant assault as that 25% dps boost on top of their already impressive damage output means they will mow down an allied squad in seconds if the enemy isnt paying attention.



Edit: max range squad dps vet 0
FSJ-20
LMG42 Gren- 15.7
LMG34 Ober- 25.5
Stg44 Volks- 8.3
G43 Pfusilier- 11.6
Non ptrs Penal- 10.8
Double BAR rifle- 13

Note- rounded to nearest 10th

Too many people use them wrongly as mainline infantry.

FG-42 was not the main weapon of the German paratroopers, it was produced in a small amount, the main weapon was still K98K, FG-42 was used as a light support weapon as a BAR, perhaps it would be more logical to make paratroopers: 5 man squd, three K98K and two FG-42

FG-42 was not the main weapon of the German paratroopers, it was produced in a small amount, the main weapon was still K98K, FG-42 was used as a light support weapon as a BAR, perhaps it would be more logical to make paratroopers: 5 man squd, three K98K and two FG-42

Smells like a nerf to me.

I barely use them. The only effective usage I see for them is a T1 + T2 build which obviously delays your T3. But this build is hardly desirable since playing OKW without tanks is suicide. The Obersoldaten are better for about the same price. Also I'm not willing to go for a whole doctrine that offers a redundant infantry squad and a useless Flak emplacement.

In short I would not use the doctrine in competitive matchmaking. Especially since Jäger and Panzerfüsilier are way more cost efficient doctrinal infantry while offering other options in the doc (105mm, JT).

Falls have a similar problem as panzerfussiliers in that they are in a faction which already has heaps of versatile and competent non-doctrinal infantry. combine this with their late arrival and they are indeed a unit that can be difficult to fit in.

To answer OPs question: Never pick the luftwaffe doctrine before you have 3CP and plan on getting a fallschirmJäeger unit. Get the unit if you need to replace a wiped volks unit and use them somewhat like a sniper fighting from far away or behind cover, or cloak them and sneak around for some cheeky wipes of team weapons or retreating squads.

Never get more than 2 squads of them unless you are a top 100 player and really know what you are doing. I have beaten so many OKW opponents simply due to the fact that they get star struck by the falls and sink all their manpower into reinforcing them, making it impossible for them to get out their armor in time.

Falls have a similar problem as panzerfussiliers in that they are in a faction which already has heaps of versatile and competent non-doctrinal infantry. combine this with their late arrival and they are indeed a unit that can be difficult to fit in.


To answer OPs question: Never pick the luftwaffe doctrine before you have 3CP and plan on getting a fallschirmJäeger unit. Get the unit if you need to replace a wiped volks unit and use them somewhat like a sniper fighting from far away or behind cover, or cloak them and sneak around for some cheeky wipes of team weapons or retreating squads.

Never get more than 2 squads of them unless you are a top 100 player and really know what you are doing. I have beaten so many OKW opponents simply due to the fact that they get star struck by the falls and sink all their manpower into reinforcing them, making it impossible for them to get out their armor in time.

+1


I agree with your opinion

Usf airborn and falls have same problem(to late timing, manpower drain)

Airborne have bad target size and falls is so expensive to reinforce them

My opinoin :

Airborne - 3cp->2cp, target size 0.95

Falls - 3cp->2cp, reinforce cost 36->32

To answer OPs question: Never pick the luftwaffe doctrine before you have 3CP and plan on getting a fallschirmJäeger unit. Get the unit if you need to replace a wiped volks unit and use them somewhat like a sniper fighting from far away or behind cover, or cloak them and sneak around for some cheeky wipes of team weapons or retreating squads.

Just dont use them... u must use 150% of ur micro to not getting them wiped. cloaked or not theyre just not worth it, because in the lategame nearly every allied player have so much explosive Stuff that theyre die anyway.
And Luftwaffels is by far the worst OKW doctrine. Especially after the rework.
Back than in the beiningens (a few years ago) u pick the doctrine cause if the mg34 and nothing else.

But why is this so ?
1. Youre fighting healthblobbs most of the Time. Most allied use the 6 Men squats because its easier to play with in terms of wipes and not getting fuks. So your Fallis make ok dmg but not enough to realy fight vet double BAR rifles or other zergling units.

2. Theyre gardening expensive

3. Too micro intensive to get them at vet. 4 Men -> instant nade wipe. 90% of all explosives wipe u under combat circumstances. There is no Lategame for them.

4. Fighting against weapon crews? So u spawn them behind enemy Lines and u mange to wipe an mg or at gun... and than? take it ? no because u can not retreat throu the lines... so the enemy will just take ist back

5. Bundle Nade sucks! in cqc theyre wipe the weapon crew in anyway... so u dont nead it... same for buildings. In Inf fights the bundle nade take to long to explode and can be dodged easy.
6. the Luftwaffles doctrine is the worst OKW doctrine.
-recon + smoke thing is ok
-heavy scrub forty is ... not usefull
- Fallis ...
-Valiant Assault too expensive for the muni tea bagged OKW
- Stuka attack is ... not usefull

So here's my Luftwaffles rework

2CP recon + somke u can buy the first one for the normal muni price. but u can safe it. u can buy 3 charges. the second cost more and so on. If u buyed all three u can lay 3 smoke screens.

2CP heavy forti but kick the useless AA gun and add a Forward Headquarters.
Your Fallis can build a Strong point behind the Lines.

3CP 440 MP. Fallis spawn with 4 K 98
-and can get 2 FG42's for 60 Mun. One have the
same dmg Profile as the MG34.
-camo in cover
-infiltrations nade's
-smoke nade
- Booby trap
- 4 Weapons slots
-can scavenge Team weapons

- Vet1 better accuarcy in cover and while standing
- vet 2 healing
- vet 3 better recived acc
- vet 4 better protecion against explosives
- vet 5 can reinforce in cover out of combat

A real Mid too Lategame unit with a better dmg output and a unit the didint force u too buy Obers..

6CP "Naplam flight" from the OH

12CP The normal 50kg Stuka flight

you dont need to drop them to flank teamweapons. hold fire and conceal them somewhere the opponent does no find them. retreating them once they reveal can be tricky indeed, but taking risks pays off eventually

Well, can anyone explain why a super expensive 4 men unit that needs tons of micro comes 1 CP later than super strong shocks? Just asking...

Falls should be the heart and soul of the doctrine but they are not good enough / come to late...
I would say Luftwaffe ground forces is better than "firestorm" but both docs should be a lot better considering that both got a revamp. Firestorm is so weak... This years OKWs commanders are way better designed.
Imo Luftwaffe wouldn't need that much, better Falls would do wonders here, Valiant Assault, Airborne Attack and smoke are nice abilities. I would like to see falls come 1 cp earlier because they are clearly not on the same level like rangers / us paras. Make them a 5 men unit but change their weapons.
And heavy fortifications should be replaced by a supply drop (Mortar 34 / pak40). Ground forces would immediately go from mediocre to really useful.

rangers, paras, shocks all dont have Camo nor snare. i think fallschirmjägers are in a fine spot and need no change at all. dont try to use them as a better version of folks or obers because theyre not meant to.
the micro thing might be your own prob

+

feuersturm has its own place aswell. not the most competetive doctrine but definitly not useless

"his years OKWs commanders are way better designed."

The forum disagrees. (jli)

Well, can anyone explain why a super expensive 4 men unit that needs tons of micro comes 1 CP later than super strong shocks? Just asking...

Ranged DPS, abilities (smoke + bundle + pfaust, stealth), the fact that you can drop them behind enemy lines.

Dunno why you'd compare those two units since they have pretty different roles than one another.

I don't think the panzerfaust is a useful ability for fallshirmijagers, fallshirmijagers are so expensive that I never risk them to chase tanks.

6. the Luftwaffles doctrine is the worst OKW doctrine.

I don't know why what level you are or what type of games you play, but for 1v1 that's certainly not the case.

The Falls are arguably the most versatile elite unit in the game considering their weapons, cloak, grenades and DPS, which means they have a solution for everything. Combined that with the Amazing Valiant Assault ability which you will often have sufficient munitions to use several times in the late game, you are looking at a quite solid (but somewhat situational) doctrine.

I don't think the panzerfaust is a useful ability for fallshirmijagers, fallshirmijagers are so expensive that I never risk them to chase tanks.

The faust is what puts the falls a notch above other elite units, as light vehicles can't just bum rush them and force a wipe.

The faust is what puts the falls a notch above other elite units, as light vehicles can't just bum rush them and force a wipe.

+1

"Dunno why you'd compare those two units since they have pretty different roles than one another."

so we all agree?^^

rangers, paras, shocks all dont have Camo nor snare. i think fallschirmjägers are in a fine spot and need no change at all. dont try to use them as a better version of folks or obers because theyre not meant to.
the micro thing might be your own prob

+

feuersturm has its own place aswell. not the most competetive doctrine but definitly not useless

"his years OKWs commanders are way better designed."

The forum disagrees. (jli)

LOL WOW DOES it?
Last time i checked "Overwatch" had 5 abilities and not only 1 and "Elite Armor" has no JLI at all. JLI only need a higher cost - the last years nobody complained about them because nobody used them. They came way to late to have any meaningful impact. Is that proper design?

Firestorm is trash compared to other commanders; yes, there are 2-3 useful abilities but none of them is outstanding enough to even compare the doctrine to the really good ones.

I don't know why what level you are or what type of games you play, but for 1v1 that's certainly not the case.

The Falls are arguably the most versatile elite unit in the game considering their weapons, cloak, grenades and DPS, which means they have a solution for everything. Combined that with the Amazing Valiant Assault ability which you will often have sufficient munitions to use several times in the late game, you are looking at a quite solid (but somewhat situational) doctrine.

2vs2 AT only.

if u have 100 mun as a okw player there is something wrong.
mine booby traps... stg..

so the stg obers are much better at nearly all.
The camo is ok but there hit just not hard enough to thread a big unit(only cons) And when the arty phase bginn in mid game one random katy shot and u get a 440 MP fuck.

What can they do what other can not do cheaper ?
And the doctrine is garbage... with the change of the Mg34 this doctrine becomes obsolete.

Tell me when its so versatile Elite Unit... why nobody plays them at all ? (GCS)
Rework the doctrine and make them Better. I dont need the cloak if my vet Obers shredd anything at longrange...

2vs2 AT only.

if u have 100 mun as a okw player there is something wrong.
mine booby traps... stg..

so the stg obers are much better at nearly all.
The camo is ok but there hit just not hard enough to thread a big unit(only cons) And when the arty phase bginn in mid game one random katy shot and u get a 440 MP fuck.

What can they do what other can not do cheaper ?
And the doctrine is garbage... with the change of the Mg34 this doctrine becomes obsolete.

Tell me when its so versatile Elite Unit... why nobody plays them at all ? (GCS)
Rework the doctrine and make them Better. I dont need the cloak if my vet Obers shredd anything at longrange...

Lol. Luftwaffe doctrine was the second most picked doctrine for OKW in GCS2, which hardly fits with your statement that it is the worst doctrine.

And I really hate that you make me go there, but if you never play 1v1 and your name is the same in game so I can compare our ranking, I really don't think you are in a position to tell me that I'm playing OKW wrong

"LOL WOW DOES it?
Last time i checked "Overwatch" had 5 abilities"

thats exactly why. it has 5 outstanding abilities while others (axis and allies) are lacking a commander that is equali efficent atm