Increase light jaegars price

my main suggestion is simple.. nerf to 40% crit for the G43 no other nerfs... fixes the problem neat and quickly and puts them in line with I&R pathfinders

my main suggestion is simple.. nerf to 40% acc for the G43 no other nerfs... fixes the problem neat and quickly and puts them in line with I&R pathfinders

Making them a pathfinder clone with two extra Vet? Would also be a solutuion, but a boring one. lol

Edit: And the G43? So they beform with upgrade like pathfinder?

it stays... paths only have artillery barrage and beacon as their utility... JLI get medics boobytrap salvage infiltration and sprint...

Yea… they are a strange unit. Like I said, in my opinion they have to be removed or stay as expert but ONLY with unit-limitation.

making them a modified pathfinder clone is better for balance doe...

So, we have a solutuion. Balance-Team, make a test-mod.

Why making such long discussions? I don't know if there is an english saying, but as german for me it is 'talk around the porridge'.

40% crit suggestion is stupid. No one would want a Gren squad that crits at 40% when you have STG Volks and Obersoldaten. It works for Pathfinders because they can equip BARs and because they generally fight smaller squads. JLI need a high crit chance or nobody will use them.

40% crit chance suggestion is stupid. No one would want a Gren squad that crits at 40% when you have STG Volks and Obersoldaten. It works for Pathfinders because they can equip BARs and because they generally fight smaller squads. JLI need a high crit chance or nobody will use them.

it takes double bars to achieve parity with jagers which highlights how ridiculously strong jagers are... paths also still retain the 0.9 bonus vs cover which gives them increased performance vs units in cover something neither obers nor volks can do... they still remain valuable as long range firesupport

they dont need a high crit chance outside of your biased opinion

it takes double bars to achieve parity with jagers which highlights how ridiculously strong jagers are... paths also still retain the 0.9 bonus vs cover which gives them increased performance vs units in cover something neither obers nor volks can do... they still remain valuable as long range firesupport

they dont need a high crit chance outside of your biased opinion

Do you actually have any data that indicate how many kill can be attributed to critical from Pathfinders and how many from JLI?

Because for me it looks as if you just throwing number around with any data to support your suggestions.

no data on kills for crits... but jagers do have a 0.9 bonus vs cover

-CP requirement from 2 to 1.
-Must buy their sniper rifle for 45 munitions. Requires 1 truck to be deployed.
-Squad cost from 300 to 250.
-Reinforce from 37 to 31
-Reinforce time from 7.5 to 6
-Salvage ability now available; replaced by Thorough Salvage in Scavenge Doctrine.
-Veterancy requirements from 660/1320/2240/3520/4400 to 520/1040/2080/3120/3970
-Camouflage is now available at Veterancy 0
-Now has First-Strike Bonuses; increases accuracy by 50% for 5 seconds.
-JLI G43 Sniper Rifle light and heavy cover accuracy modifiers from 0.5 to 0.9.
-JLI G43 Sniper Rifle garrison accuracy modifiers from 0.5 to 0.9
-Booby traps standardized to the Soviet version; see Soviet Booby Trap above.

this means that JLI can be long range dedicated anti garrison even with 40% crit well worth 250mp but not OP

no data on kills for crits... but jagers do have a 0.9 bonus vs cover

-CP requirement from 2 to 1.
-Must buy their sniper rifle for 45 munitions. Requires 1 truck to be deployed.
-Squad cost from 300 to 250.
-Reinforce from 37 to 31
-Reinforce time from 7.5 to 6
-Salvage ability now available; replaced by Thorough Salvage in Scavenge Doctrine.
-Veterancy requirements from 660/1320/2240/3520/4400 to 520/1040/2080/3120/3970
-Camouflage is now available at Veterancy 0
-Now has First-Strike Bonuses; increases accuracy by 50% for 5 seconds.
-JLI G43 Sniper Rifle light and heavy cover accuracy modifiers from 0.5 to 0.9.
-JLI G43 Sniper Rifle garrison accuracy modifiers from 0.5 to 0.9
-Booby traps standardized to the Soviet version; see Soviet Booby Trap above.

If you do not have any data pls stop spamming as if you actually have the right numbers

And read the notes again, it is not the JLI only the sniper rifle has better chance vs cover.

it takes double bars to achieve parity with jagers which highlights how ridiculously strong jagers are... paths also still retain the 0.9 bonus vs cover which gives them increased performance vs units in cover something neither obers nor volks can do... they still remain valuable as long range firesupport

Only the sniper has 0,9 accuracy modifier, the other rifles do not. And one BAR already gives Pathfinders nearly the same performance vs heavy cover as JLI.

If you do not have any data pls stop spamming as if you actually have the right numbers

are you dumb? i still have empirical evidence they slaughter penals at range 10...

And read the notes again, it is not the JLI only the sniper rifle has better chance vs cover.

yes but JLI get 0.9 bonus as opposed to 0.5 for everyone else... OKW still gets a strong anti garrison unit soo dont act like OKW doesnt get it...

also since when does OKW get a sniper rifle outside of JLI? panzerfusiliers excluded they dont get such sniper rifles... mind you panzerfusiliers are LONG RANGE line infantry aswell... and JLI slaughter them completely...

Only the sniper has 0,9 accuracy modifier, the other rifles do not. And one BAR already gives Pathfinders nearly the same performance vs heavy cover as JLI.

pathfinders dont even GET a 0.5 acc modifier vs covered targets... even with a 40% crit id still take the JLI out for anti garrison

are you dumb? i still have empirical evidence they slaughter penals at range 10...

Pls stop personal comments.

Is there any relationship between "slaughter penals at range 10" and critical kills from the scoped g43?

Because according to the to the weapon curve of the G43 it perform better at range 27 than it does at range 10.

Now unless you have any data about the performance of scoped g43 PLS stop dropping arbitrary numbers about what the threshold should be.

yes but JLI get 0.9 bonus as opposed to 0.5 for everyone else... OKW still gets a strong anti garrison unit soo dont act like OKW doesnt get it...

also since when does OKW get a sniper rifle outside of JLI? panzerfusiliers excluded they dont get such sniper rifles... mind you panzerfusiliers are LONG RANGE line infantry aswell... and JLI slaughter them completely...

I am not acting anything, I am simply correcting your statement that JLI get better modifier vs cover. They do not. Only the upgrade scoped G43 does.

Now if you want to collect data about the affect this has place a enemy squad in a building and test 10 fights vs Jagers with and without the scoped G43.

Or if you want I can make you mod where the G43 has normal modifier vs cover so you can test.

You are actually wrong about PF, their best at mid range and not long range.


PLS until you actually thoroughly test these things in meaningful way don't spam posts.

Happy holidays.

Pls stop personal comments.

Is there any relationship between "slaughter penals at range 10" and critical kills from the scoped g43?

Because according to the to the weapon curve of the G43 it perform better at range 27 than it does at range 10.

Now unless you have any data about the performance of scoped g43 PLS stop dropping arbitrary numbers about what the threshold should be.

The .9 cover accuracy on the g43 makes them beat penals in cover regardless of range, though it's somewhat close at range 10. You can literally move the penals up one meter to range 9 and annihilate the jaegers because they aren't in cover, but he wants to ignore that. That's reasonable performance for a 280mp squad with 45 muni upgrade.

I see a lot of, "why can't my penal spam beat combined arms?" in this thread. Try out new unit combos in the new meta. JLI are literally designed to counter penals and guards. Flamer CE, conscripts with molotovs, and shocks are all good versus JLI.

JLI are obviously going to be nerfed in the next patch, they aren't a 250 mp squad. Comparing them to pathfinders doesn't work because pathfinders are pretty shit, only good because they come at cp0 now. Would like to see them buffed too.

Pls stop personal comments.

Is there any relationship between "slaughter penals at range 10" and critical kills from the scoped g43?

Because according to the to the weapon curve of the G43 it perform better at range 27 than it does at range 10.

Now unless you have any data about the performance of scoped g43 PLS stop dropping arbitrary numbers about what the threshold should be.

we dont have empirical data but we do have logic... a comparison between I&R pathfinders in a similar situation shows that that the G-43 performance must be responsible for the majority of the kills as the only real difference in combat ability between I&R paths and JLI as of the moment remains the superior performance of the G-43...

this shows at the very least something is responsible in the G-43 that causes the vast gap in performance and the only differences i see are

evidence 1: looking thru the data
A. 0.9 acc vs cover

B. 70% health crit

it is therefore logical to assume one of these 2 must be the culprit for the insane performance

evidence 2: paths get slaughtered by JLI with the sniper rifle... but is completely reversed without the G-43

evidence 3: i have tested JLI without the sniper vs the targets ive previously stated (penals obers shocks etc)... their performance is almost identical to grenadiers... which further leads me to conclude that the G-43 is the problem

evidence but not empirical testing data: i see in my tests a model snipe vs a lightly damaged model from the sniper is usually what kills the enemy models not the fire from the grenadier KARs... this is data from observation and in no way actual numbers though....

i therefore made a theory

theory: models brought to 70% HP are being critted and sniped by the G43... a fix to pathfinder standards may fix this

appropriate testing method: balance mod

I am not acting anything, I am simply correcting your statement that JLI get better modifier vs cover. They do not. Only the upgrade scoped G43 does.

yes but thats the whole point... even with 40% crit JLI still have a role as anti garisson with G-43 and do not become redundant as you and sanders claim...

standard JLI have the role of being infiltrating stealthy grenadier squads with long recon range is a good role for 250mp...

Now if you want to collect data about the affect this has place a enemy squad in a building and test 10 fights vs Jagers with and without the scoped G43.

Or if you want I can make you mod where the G43 has normal modifier vs cover so you can test.

the grenadier rifles shouldnt get 0.9% vs cover... the main purpose of JLI is as infiltrating units.... to do damage behind the lines.. recon enemy positions... boobytrap points and get the hell out of bad situations... well worth 250mp...

only with the G-43 should they also serve as long range anti garrison

You are actually wrong about PF, their best at mid range and not long range.

their DPM is highest at midrange yes... but you have to contrast this with the DPM of the targets that are shooting at you

PLS until you actually thoroughly test these things in meaningful way don't spam posts.

Happy holidays.

i do have a hypothesis and a test in mind... i just dont know how to make a balance mod as of the moment... i could search up the modding tools and make it myself but i dont have the time to do such a thing as of the moment

likewise my test vs pathfinders and penals remain sound...

we dont have empirical data but we do have logic...

No you do not, if you had used logic correctly you wouldn't originally suggested that JLI should cost 340 and come at CP 6.

You would be aware that that suggestions is simply ridiculous.

...a comparison between I&R pathfinders in a similar situation shows that that the G-43 performance must be responsible for the majority of the kills as the only real difference in combat ability between I&R paths and JLI as of the moment remains the superior performance of the G-43.......

You are absolutely wrong, the 2 units use 2 rifles each with completely different characteristics while having different durability and while firing at different targets.

i do have a hypothesis and a test in mind... i just dont know how to make a balance mod as of the moment... i could search up the modding tools and make it myself but i dont have the time to do such a thing as of the moment

likewise my test vs pathfinders and penals remain sound...

If you want to test me or someone else can create a mod for you.

You can contact me via PM but pls until then stop spamming post in this thread.

The .9 cover accuracy on the g43 makes them beat penals in cover regardless of range, though it's somewhat close at range 10. You can literally move the penals up one meter to range 9 and annihilate the jaegers because they aren't in cover, but he wants to ignore that. That's reasonable performance for a 280mp squad with 45 muni upgrade.

thats not how this works.. going out of cover at 10 meters is still going to kill you more than going into cover at 10 meters... what the 0.9 accuracy multiplier means is that in cover a shot is only 90% accurate as opposed to 100% accurate outside of cover... likewise a standard grenadier shot or a penal shot gets a 0.5 accuracy multiplier in cover... which means a penal round or a gren round is only 50% effective in cover...

no the only way penals are beating JLI is if they close to point blank range 5m or below (tested already) and closing in from max range to point blank vs a lone JLI squad already ensures death for the penal squad... (also tested)... in fact due to sprint penals are extra dead vs JLI...

I see a lot of, "why can't my penal spam beat combined arms?" in this thread. Try out new unit combos in the new meta. JLI are literally designed to counter penals and guards. Flamer CE, conscripts with molotovs, and shocks are all good versus JLI.

conscripts and T2 builds are absolutely shit to the point that they arent even used outside of PPSH doctrines... and even then only used vs ost because volks stomp them outright... conscripts need a serious buff long discussed in my can we buff sov t2 now? thread

CEs are a good way of wasting manpower as they are too expensive for 170mp units... and even with the flamer are generally vulnerable to the volk stg anyways... note that 2 CEs cost more than 1 sturmpio... which annihilates 2 CEs gladly at almost any range mind you...

shocks yes... shocks are a solution to JLI... but substituting all your infantry with shocks just to counter combined arms shows how stupidly powerful the combination is...

JLI are obviously going to be nerfed in the next patch, they aren't a 250 mp squad. Comparing them to pathfinders doesn't work because pathfinders are pretty shit, only good because they come at cp0 now. Would like to see them buffed too.

i dont see paths as shit even without bars... i generally dont even give them bars... i let US infantry duke it out and use the paths to snipe low HP models along with general recon purposes which USF doesnt get... really good vs mg play..