King Tiger - Is it worth buying?

Thats is it. 5 isn't much, 10 will become noticeable.

That mean that one tank with micro can use it. Multible tanks will get a problem.


Over all, tanks without turret should still have the range benefit, so SU76 and SU85 should perform better than Firefly and Jackson = stay with 60 range to outrange all german tanks (only Jagdpanzer, Elefant and Jagdtiger are same or more).

Don't forget that Brits normal PaK has same DPS as PaK40 and US-PaK also perform good with heat-ability. Also all large german Cats got nerfed over the time. There is no reason for outranging that much. Also Brummbär got range and armor nerf. PaKs are now more effective.

With the nerf of 55 Jackson outranges as new Tiger by 10 range, after Tiger with Vet2 only 5. StuG and Panther will be outranged by 5.

Lmao so the more TDs you make the less effective at their job they should be? No other unit in the game works like that. The range advantage is supposed to be an advantage, which TDs need because tanks like the tiger and KT have like double the health and enough armor to bounce even some TD shots. The disadvantage of TDs is that unlike tanks, they can’t fight infantry, so you’re investing a heavy amount of resources into something that doesn’t provide any anti infantry pressure at all (not even as much as the panther). They’re also unable to bounce anything but small arms and die in 4 normal tank gun shots (3 from the KT or ele/jagdtiger).

If you can’t deal with the usf at gun with a KT I don’t know what to tell you lol. It still has a decent chance to bounce even if the atg is using the AP rounds and the KT is pretty good at killing AT guns.

Also worth noting that the jagdpanzer 4 has the same range as the allied TDs and nobody complains about that. It even has armor and decent camouflage and is cheaper than the jackson and firefly too.

Lmao so the more TDs you make the less effective at their job they should be? No other unit in the game works like that. The range advantage is supposed to be an advantage, which TDs need because tanks like the tiger and KT have like double the health and enough armor to bounce even some TD shots. The disadvantage of TDs is that unlike tanks, they can’t fight infantry, so you’re investing a heavy amount of resources into something that doesn’t provide any anti infantry pressure at all (not even as much as the panther). They’re also unable to bounce anything but small arms and die in 4 normal tank gun shots (3 from the KT or ele/jagdtiger).

If you can’t deal with the usf at gun with a KT I don’t know what to tell you lol. It still has a decent chance to bounce even if the atg is using the AP rounds and the KT is pretty good at killing AT guns.

Also worth noting that the jagdpanzer 4 has the same range as the allied TDs and nobody complains about that. It even has armor and decent camouflage and is cheaper than the jackson and firefly too.

That is exactly how the game works. If the enemy gets a Tankhunter, you build a AT-gun. You can build more Tank-Hunters, but be sure you will need more Micro than the enemy. That is why PaKs have more range als normal tanks and normally should have more range as a mobile tankhunter (as Panther is).

And if you read corret, I have no problems with King-Tiger. And I also want a nerf for all heavy tank-hunters like Ele, Jagdtiger or ISU. While Elefant is more balanced than Jagdtiger or ISU. Jagdtiger needs a massive speed nerf. ISU needs some longer reload. While for Ostheer the Scope has to be removed to put Ele in line.

That is exactly how the game works. If the enemy gets a Tankhunter, you build a AT-gun. You can build more Tank-Hunters, but be sure you will need more Micro than the enemy. That is why PaKs have more range als normal tanks and normally should have more range as a mobile tankhunter (as Panther is).

And if you read corret, I have no problems with King-Tiger. And I also want a nerf for all heavy tank-hunters like Ele, Jagdtiger or ISU. While Elefant is more balanced than Jagdtiger or ISU. Jagdtiger needs a massive speed nerf. ISU needs some longer reload. While for Ostheer the Scope has to be removed to put Ele in line.

I don’t see why you think at guns having longer range than tanks is totally fine (which I agree with), but TDs, which cost fuel and whose sole purpose is to counter tanks, should be made worse at their only job by pretty much not outranging other tanks. Vet3 paths and vet4(?) jaegers outrange other infantry but even on an infantry scale it’s so negligible that it doesn’t matter. And again, limitations of vehicle pathfinding would make utilizing such a small difference in ranges impossible even with a single tank. It already takes more micro to handle 2-3 TDs with almost no armor and normal health than it does to for 1 heavy tank with like 1000 health and good armor; I don’t see why that should be accentuated.

I don’t see why you think at guns having longer range than tanks is totally fine (which I agree with), but TDs, which cost fuel and whose sole purpose is to counter tanks, should be made worse at their only job by pretty much not outranging other tanks. Vet3 paths and vet4(?) jaegers outrange other infantry but even on an infantry scale it’s so negligible that it doesn’t matter. And again, limitations of vehicle pathfinding would make utilizing such a small difference in ranges impossible even with a single tank. It already takes more micro to handle 2-3 TDs with almost no armor and normal health than it does to for 1 heavy tank with like 1000 health and good armor; I don’t see why that should be accentuated.

Because they still out-range all the tanks they have to.

StuG G is a tankhunter, Panther is a Tankhunter. Tiger and Königtiger are Allrounder but they get their range buff with Vet. But you know what? They will still be outranged. But you know what? They will not be outranged by 1/5, only by 1/10.

And Ostheer Tiger is worse than Pershing having better AI, killing PaKs like Brummbär.


Edit: And the question is, should it be buffed? I say no. But it's main-counters have to be nerfed. Why Jackson and Firefly? Because beside of SU85 without no turret it is very diffucult to counter the other ones. On massive multiplayer impossible without Commander-Units like Elefant or Jagdtiger.

Because they still out-range all the tanks they have to.

StuG G is a tankhunter, Panther is a Tankhunter. Tiger and Königtiger are Allrounder but they get their range buff with Vet. But you know what? They will still be outranged. But you know what? They will not be outranged by 1/5, only by 1/10.

You’re still missing the point that 5 range is literally less than half of the length of a tank. It’s not enough to use effectively period. Even as it is now, you don’t have to go that far forward to be able to fire on TDs (it’s obviously enough to make it a bit difficult but still), and at the end of the day, TDs are supposed to counter heavies, not the other way around.

You’re still missing the point that 5 range is literally less than half of the length of a tank. It’s not enough to use effectively period. Even as it is now, you don’t have to go that far forward to be able to fire on TDs (it’s obviously enough to make it a bit difficult but still), and at the end of the day, TDs are supposed to counter heavies, not the other way around.

Current allii-tankhunters are countering everything. Having same range as a PaK, killing german defensive structurs and have more range.

So, Panther and StuG should get 60 range? It that what you want? The game is about balance.


And like I said. IF there is 10 or 5 range more or less can be huge.


Current allii-tankhunters have 1/3 more range than Panzer4. 1/5 more range than Panther.

With the nerf only ~1/4 more than Panzer4. 1/10 more range than Panther.

Current allii-tankhunters are countering everything.

a small point that i think is important, allies dont really have units designed to "hunt" armour per say, they are all designed to brute force through it. imo something like the puma or even panther are more "hunter" like due to their mobility, turret speed and otherwise shorter range. i know its not a defined role, but i think its important to have some sort of designation.

Current allii-tankhunters are countering everything. Having same range as a PaK, killing german defensive structurs and have more range.

So, Panther and StuG should get 60 range? It that what you want? The game is about balance.


And like I said. IF there is 10 or 5 range more or less can be huge.


Current allii-tankhunters have 1/3 more range than Panzer4. 1/5 more range than Panther.

With the nerf only ~1/4 more than Panzer4. 1/10 more range than Panther.

Oh god tank destroyers counter tanks. The horror.

Didn’t know range was literally the only stat in this game. The panther can have 60 range as soon as the Jackson has 960 hp, like 300 armor, and blitz, and the stug can have 60 range as soon as the firefly has like a 4 second reload and costs 90 fuel. The game is about balance.

With your nerf their range is impossible to take advantage of against the units they’re specifically designed to counter. I’m sounding a lot like a broken record and I’m probably going to stop replying at some point because such a nerf makes absolutely no sense.

a small point that i think is important, allies dont really have units designed to "hunt" armour per say, they are all designed to brute force through it. imo something like the puma or even panther are more "hunter" like due to their mobility, turret speed and otherwise shorter range. i know its not a defined role, but i think its important to have some sort of designation.

Agreed. IIRC Jackson sight range was nerfed specifically so it couldn’t pull the same kind of stunts that the puma can since it isn’t really meant to do so.

Meanwhile you litterally explained while this doesn't happen...contradicting yourself.

You don't "use it right", you use it and hope the enemy is unlucky and doesn't avoid it. That is a situation in which there's NO WAY to use it right.

That's the very definition of unreliable bs unit. Neither the user nor the receiving end likes this unit for this reason.

Man, just watch some 2 v 2 games, or Anniversary classics. Many games are won by stukas only. Some of them having 50+ kills. They literally drained enemy manpower wiping squads all the time.

Literally a page on NOTHING to do with the KT.

Keep it on topic.

Oh god tank destroyers counter tanks. The horror.

Didn’t know range was literally the only stat in this game. The panther can have 60 range as soon as the Jackson has 960 hp, like 300 armor, and blitz, and the stug can have 60 range as soon as the firefly has like a 4 second reload and costs 90 fuel. The game is about balance.

With your nerf their range is impossible to take advantage of against the units they’re specifically designed to counter. I’m sounding a lot like a broken record and I’m probably going to stop replying at some point because such a nerf makes absolutely no sense.

Panther doesn't have 300 armor anymore and Jackson got its HP increased massively. So, now?

And well, I don't want 60 range one them, was sarcasm. But still a range nerf for Jackson and Firefly to 55. So they become less easy to play. So also King get the chance to hit one, if enemy has bad micro.

Panther doesn't have 300 armor anymore and Jackson got its HP increased massively. So, now?

And well, I don't want 60 range one them, was sarcasm. But still a range nerf for Jackson and Firefly to 55. So they become less easy to play. So also King get the chance to hit one, if enemy has bad micro.

Going by your logic, you conveniently forgot that panthers hp was "increased massively" as well, together with RoF buff that means its that much more effective against its own counter, because it can soak more independently of RNG that wasn't in its favor.

And KT is NOT supposed to be engaging its own hardcounters, that's why all TDs in game are faster then it.

What the F is with the notion whithin all axis players that axis units should be able to fight their own hardcounters? That's not only counter intuitive to the whole balance decided, that's as moronic as it gets to the very core.

You need to counter TDs? Either flank them with armor that will always win when it gets first shot(P4 and above), spam extremely cheap and expendable alternative(stug4 in ost case) or just get a vehicle that also got 60 range and is superior in TD engagement(JP4).

KT roflstomps every singular allied tank in its range, it doesn't need to roflstomp its own hardcounters as well. Just because its expensive, does not mean it should be replacement for your whole mechanized part of the army. Given how extremely easy OKW scouting options are with IR HT, not being able to creep puppchens up to these TDs is nothing less but your very own lack of imagination and skill.

Going by your logic, you conveniently forgot that panthers hp was "increased massively" as well, together with RoF buff that means its that much more effective against its own counter, because it can soak more independently of RNG that wasn't in its favor.

And KT is NOT supposed to be engaging its own hardcounters, that's why all TDs in game are faster then it.

What the F is with the notion whithin all axis players that axis units should be able to fight their own hardcounters? That's not only counter intuitive to the whole balance decided, that's as moronic as it gets to the very core.

You need to counter TDs? Either flank them with armor that will always win when it gets first shot(P4 and above), spam extremely cheap and expendable alternative(stug4 in ost case) or just get a vehicle that also got 60 range and is superior in TD engagement(JP4).

KT roflstomps every singular allied tank in its range, it doesn't need to roflstomp its own hardcounters as well. Just because its expensive, does not mean it should be replacement for your whole mechanized part of the army. Given how extremely easy OKW scouting options are with IR HT, not being able to creep puppchens up to these TDs is nothing less but your very own lack of imagination and skill.

Panther is also more expensive, has less accuracy. That is why it is better on paper, and still has less range with a tiny nerf.

And also with a range nerf allii tankhunters outrange king and also are faster. I don't want the meat grinder back, so the range nerf is a possibility.

And you know what range nerf for Allii tankhunters mean? We can also reduce range of heavy tankhunters, we should all like.

Invised multiple posts for straying from "constructive" posts about thread topic