OKW vs Conscript+PPSH or Shock troops

Have been playing a while now(600+ hours) but in 2vs2 with a mate I'm having trouble with those damn communists using the OORAH! and PPSH upgrade for their conscripts. A similiar problem occurs with the shock troops which win easily vs my Volkgrenadiers+STG44.

When I make 2 ISG's they just rush up or flank me, and an MG34 HMG doesn't seem to supress them quick enough before they throw a frag or molotov. Making me bleed ManPower at the max and eventually losing the game.

What is -possibly- the best counter vs these units?

Try getting AA HT that supports with your mg, or go Tech and luch, play cat and mouse with conscript, if they orrah towards your luch just back off. Have Volks support your luch as well.

And always keep in mind if you're in a situation where you have 1 or 2 squad of Volks facing blob of Cons ppsh, flame grenade is your friend and just constantly play range against them, back off if they come close. Or otherwise just retreat and mass your own blob like up to 3 to 4 volksgren to face against those blob, remember to get raketen in between bringing volks to fight off against T70 or SU76

Try getting AA HT that supports with your mg, or go Tech and luch, play cat and mouse with conscript, if they orrah towards your luch just back off. Have Volks support your luch as well.

And always keep in mind if you're in a situation where you have 1 or 2 squad of Volks facing blob of Cons ppsh, flame grenade is your friend and just constantly play range against them, back off if they come close. Or otherwise just retreat and mass your own blob like up to 3 to 4 volksgren to face against those blob, remember to get raketen in between bringing volks to fight off against T70 or SU76

So, the best strategy is to just stay the hell out of their way and try to snipe them off from a distance. Will use the tip tonight, thought the STG44's would out-gun them.

When facing conscripts my tactic would be 2x Sturmpioneers, 3/4 Volks, 1 luchs, 1/2 raketten werfer, 1 Stuka Sufuss and then on into panthers.

When facing team weapons my tactic would be 2x Sturmpioneers, 3/4 Volks, 1/2 ISG, 1/2 raketten, 1 stuka and then on into panthers.

Maybe op out of stuka to free some MP for replacement/reinforcement lost during inbetween engagement lost. Which gives you more opening for P4 against infantry blob and at least some tank engagement like t34 or Su85 for some matter.

STG would win against ppsh on mid range but never on close range as it would be the PPsh's role to kill you off on close range. Mines are also a way to keep them from moving towards you.

Have been playing a while now(600+ hours) but in 2vs2 with a mate I'm having trouble with those damn communists using the OORAH! and PPSH upgrade for their conscripts. A similiar problem occurs with the shock troops which win easily vs my Volkgrenadiers+STG44.

When I make 2 ISG's they just rush up or flank me, and an MG34 HMG doesn't seem to supress them quick enough before they throw a frag or molotov. Making me bleed ManPower at the max and eventually losing the game.

What is -possibly- the best counter vs these units?

Hard mobile infantry counters for OKW: Obers, P4, MG34 (not particularly effective), Falls

PPSH does nothing on range so try to only engage them from as far away as possible. If they go Shocks they dont have Guards and struggle to get MP for a Zis3. So you can also go Luchs or Flak HT in early game to bleed MP and lock down areas of the map. ISG are good vs support weapons, they are not worth it against mobile infantry. Spending MP on them will hurt you against Con Spam and Shocks.

Also getting two SPs is not generally not worth it either. They are too expensive and take too long to build, plus they are hard to keep alive in mid-to lategame and don´t scale well. Also hard to get vet on them. Better to get another Volks instead or spend the MP on an MG34.

Generally OKW doesn´t struggle against Conscript spam or Shocks, you can get double Obers out which just melt any soviet infantry once they are vet 2. Volks are also generally better than Conscripts so you should be at a advantage anyways.

Generally OKW doesn´t struggle against Conscript spam or Shocks, you can get double Obers out which just melt any soviet infantry once they are vet 2. Volks are also generally better than Conscripts so you should be at a advantage anyways.

Seems i'm not such a big pro as Relic's matchmaking system think I am, haha, anyway gonna use these tips for my next games .

Also, mostly dislike the use of Obers because they lack the panzerfaust, but will try them when I encounter another Communist shock army.

Thanks for the advice anyways.

Also, mostly dislike the use of Obers because they lack the panzerfaust,

They are an elite AI unit. They don´t need panzerfausts. Other than Falls no "elite" infantry unit has snares so what´s the problem.

Obers are your greatest Unit on dealing Elite Infantry with no commander requirement, except for STG+Scope weapon. And with 340mp requirement is damn cheap to push out and start chasing away any ally infantry thats coming towards you.

But do keep in mind of the Ally's counter ober units like Scott, Sherman, Katyusha, t34, Cromewell or even Centuar as they are specialize AI units. Get some Raketen or Puma or P4/P5 to back those unit up. Again is how you play those strategy to make it workable on the field of what your opponent is bringing out.

Is how you play those strategy to make it workable on the field of what your opponent is bringing out.

A lot of the strategies are depending on what your opponent gets on the field

I guess leaving out Obersoldaten was my biggest mistake so far, haha.

But do keep in mind of the Ally's counter ober units like Scott, Sherman, Katyusha, t34, Cromewell or even Centuar as they are specialize AI units. Get some Raketen or Puma or P4/P5 to back those unit up.

This worked rather well last night.

2 obers + 2 raketen werfers and later in the game had the command Panther back them up. They wipe most other units, only US rangers + thompsons were dangerous.

to contain thos type of blob (smg one) i'll be with 4 volks all pf them stgg 44 and 1/2 mg. Then i'll make sandbags and i'll wait them to push because the ppsh dps at med/long range are inexistent till the Stgg volks can rip them off, maybe 1/2 ig's or i'll ask the wher to make mortars.

Obers and an hmg34 are probably your best bets. Flaktrack is a bit tricky to micro and cons are best suited to at nade it to death out of all allied infantry because they’re six men and have oorah.

Having to play against VonIvan's ppsh cons forced me to come up with a counter real fast.

MP40 volks actually do great against cons; STG volks get overrun too easily, and the frag grenade of mp40 volks really does a lot more in these close counters engagements where cover is nullified by cons sprinting into point blank, not to mention it punishes their hit the dirt much harder than incendiaries do. To sum up the dynamic, whoever has to run up to the other usually loses.

IR STG obers are another option, but I find obers usually come too late. That said, they'll just straight up outfight ppsh cons, so they work really well. I don't recommend mg34 obers (against ppsh cons, that is) if stg obers are available, as obers will never be able to take max range fights against ppsh cons anyway.

The reason why I don't particularly like using HMG34s against ppsh cons is that cons have too much wipe potential on the HMG34. Between a sprint, suppression immunity (which does root them), and really good close range damage, cons dont give the HMG34s enough room to operate. Whenever I used HMG34s, I actually had them wiped and given over quite frequently. You do NOT want to deal with 6 man HMG34s...

The counter to shocks definitely is light vehicles; but others already detailed all of that. In the absence of light vehicles, just make sure you're taking your retreats early. If shocks are running up on your stg volks from max range, drop one or two (...usually just one) of their shock models as they close in, and just retreat the moment they reach 10 range (usually simplest to just retreat when they touch the same piece of cover your squad is hiding behind). Shocks are fairly bleed heavy, so this is a bigger win than you would think. In addition, shocks usually come after an opponent has built up their core infantry line, meaning their upkeep costs are likely going to be high as is - bleeding them manpower can mean that their army upkeep is so high that they can't afford vehicles. Finally, while you could argue that inflicting bleed/playing for bleed isn't enough of a win to make up for the fact that you lost your ground, keep in mind that shocks excel at taking ground, not holding it. Once they gain control of your defensive position, you can just come back and fire on the shocks from max range and theyll still have to come to you no matter what cover they're behind.

not sure why no one's mentioned it, but sandbag your MG and place mines in all the spots the enemy might use to flank it/ rush it. Just like in real war.

I usually go Special Operations and rush at least 2 Obers with IR STG 44 and then watch PPSH Cons melt like butter. They have no trouble dealing with Shocks either. Or any infantry really. Just need to back them up with AT for when the inevitable tank shows up. If you manage to get them beyond vet 3 they become terminators. They put Fallschirmjäger to shame.

Another option is 2x Sturmpioneer build with Feuersturm flamethrowers, who can also deal with any CQC infantry because the flamer deals massive damage alongside the 3x STG 44. I only use those on garrison heavy maps though.