A bit disappointed about penals

I watched one of the SNF videos and heard the appraisal of the penal battalions. Apparantly they have better defense and can stomach a fight better.

This could just be me ofc, but I have tried it out now and I can't seem to notice any particular advantage of this unit.

Sure you can add a flamethrower and throw satchels. Those special abilities have their special uses. In one match for example, I put the flamer upgraded penal in an M3 and chased MGs and mortars behind the line.

But in standard shoot-outs w/o flames I can't say that I notice any difference. They seem to die just as easily against grens and get suppressed just as easily. I'd even say they seem to take much more casualties from grenades than conscripts (at one occasion 5 men i one go. That never happened to any of my conscripts).

In all, I find that the cost of the penal - regardless of their reinforcement cost which can be negated - is too high unless there's a special task that requires satchel or flaming. It's also inconvenient to have to go T2 for them.

But is there any special trick as how to use them as regular combat troops? Or are they just call-ins for special tasks only?

They don't have better defence, they have the same armour as conscripts: 1

Yeah currently they are too expensive for what they bring. But satchel is very fun to use

its better offence. and better flamertrower.

Useless for price.

I just won two subsequent games with penal flanks. (decisive battles, anyway). They are charging units, but their abilities are too valuable to risk a frontal assault. Weapons teams easily distracted by rushing scripts into fire and holding position under suppression. This will typically give the penals enough time to close and fire off a satchel. Flamethrowers help to keep supporting units at bay - though there is the risk of a crit against the flamer. Instant retreat. Sometimes they can get a satchel off against a tank - but the 3-second timer is usually long enough for an attentive player to dodge.

They vet up quickly, because a successful bombing will often net them a ton of XP, increasing durability. They work well in combination with snipers, who will make short work of supporting infantry. Both units are well-served by the M3. T2 is a glass cannon.

Ah, OK thanks. Seems that I got defense and attack switched. Might explain it and I will try again.

What is defense?

I never liked them. They are still too expensive for what you get. I actually hoped they'd get some love with the last patch...

they do got some buff last patch, faster flamethrower fire speed and little DPS buff on their rifles. but i guess it is not enough

Wow, what is this post about? Penal battalions are awesome. My main use for them is to counter panzer grenadier spam. They do it quite well with the flamethrower. Other uses include general anti-infantry and as a side capping unit that can 1v1 any squad.

Going penal battalion spam is a mistake. They are too expensive and too role specific for that. They are a combined arms unit that should be used with conscripts, snipers, weapon teams etc. They don't take damage well and are better used cleaning up in large fights.

Penal battalions don't replace conscripts, rather they do what conscripts suck at... killing infantry in straight fights.

I've been trying a penal open for a bunch of games now to mixed results. They can definitely tangle with grenadiers in the opening phases of the game. I've caught many players with their pants down and killed a squad while they microing something else.

Satchel charges are pretty lulzy. It's pretty random the amount of damage they can do. Killed my own squad plenty of times.

Standing in satchel range, issue a move order away from the target, and THEN throw the charge. Only the one model throwing the charge will be within blast radius.

they should get reduced suppression to reflect their "suicidal assault" vocation

they should get reduced suppression to reflect their "suicidal assault" vocation

Why do they have a suicidal assault vocation?

i read extensively about WW2 and penal Squads were more likely to be doing burial detail than fighting on the front line. When they did fight they were given dangerous assignments as are all penal battalions from all nations including Germany, Britain, France and the USA.

Pay in blood meant if you were wounded you would be freed not that you had to die.

Its a bit like the one man with a rifle and one with ammo at Stalingrad or blocking detachment shooting retreating troops, none of this stuff ever happened outside Hollywood.

Blocking detachments were invented by the Brits, Russians just copied it.

I know its a game ...i just love WW2 stuff.

Ignore the wiki on this. read books instead, all nations had penal units

P.S

3 months was the longest anyone served in a Russian Penal Unit and they were always assigned to a Rifle company, they didn't just run off and fight the War alone.

It was horrible and dangerous but then on the Russian front everything was horrible and dangerous.

I've been doing Penal strategy a lot in 1on1 and I think I can make it work.

Early build order:

Conscript>Conscript>Second Engineer>Tier1>Penal>Penal...

In case of light vehicles get third conscript with at nades or wait for guards incase you don't have good mines planted, otherwise get third Penal.

Notes for early game:

-Stall for your first Penal squad, use conscripts for harassment and constantly merge them with Penals
-Don't spend your munitions on Penal flamethrowers, spend munitions for mines because light vehicles are the biggest weakness of this strat. Penals work very well without flamers if you use them correctly.
-Upgrade your engineers with flamethrowers, they are the building clearing units for you
-Keep Penals at distance. Assault grenadiers rape Penals close range even if they are equipped with flamethrowers. I've had much better luck against them without flamers.

Mid-late game:

-Tech to tier4 and get unit of your choice. SU-76 against blobs, mgs and light vehicles, SU-85 for anything heavier. Usually I end up getting one SU-76 and 85 after that.

PS. I'm not playing 1on1 that much, around 50 games in the bag atm so if anyone decent wants to test this against me send me a pm.