OKW COMMANDER REVAMP DISCUSSION

Jump back to quoted post20 Aug 2018, 22:27 PMKasarov

What's wrong with some synergy? Soviets have howitzers + recon, or mark target + ISU. Wehrmact has spotting scopes + Elefant(!). These commanders are hardly meta, either. The only thing that makes Special Ops meta is the Command Panther anyway.



That's a pretty good point. What about this revision?

[7CP] HEAT Shells
[7CP] NahVw
PzIV, Panther (not Command Panther), KT, and JgPzIV can launch either smoke (Psuedo USF-Style) or small frag grenades for self defense. Shared cooldowns.

Keep in mind I suggested also nerfing the Command Panther's RoF to make it less independent of a vehicle as it is currently.

Jump back to quoted post18 Aug 2018, 17:02 PMTiger Baron

Your idea of a Panzer Elite commander is very good, but it gives me another idea on how the PE could really be brought back into a single commander, at least sort of. Of course this is just entirely my opinion.

223 Command Car - From SnakeEye's "All Units" mod, capable of capturing and locking down territory in order to increase resource production. The PE as well as the OKW are not able to build Observation points or resource caches respectively so this would be a nice addition to the OKW, of course you would be securing territory but for a cost of manpower, fuel and population cap space.

251 Halftrack Mechanized Group - The 250 is open topped, comes armed with double MG42s, perfect for supporting your Panzergrenadiers, can also drop med packs since the PGs won't have med packs like the Sturmpioneers in order to heal on the move, similar to the USF Mechanized Company M3 Combat Group Call in. The Panzergrenadiers inside would be an expensive alternative to both the Sturmpioneers and Volksgrenadiers. 4 or 5 man squad armed with Kar98ks initially, could be upgraded with StGs or Panzerschrecks similar to the Stormtroopers and they can also only repair vehicles.

Jagdpanzer 38(t) "Hetzer" - firing the normal Panzergranate, cheaper non-tech alternative to the Jagdpanzer IV.

Repair and Recovery 251 Halftrack - also like the 223 being able to lock down is present in SnakeEye's "All Units" mod, can recover German vehicle wrecks in order to get them fully operational again, impedes an economic debuff according to the vehicle in order to be balanced, that meaning that recovering a Panzer IV would be a lot cheaper than a King Tiger for example.

Tiger I - Same as your idea, reason for it is the same as the AT Hetzer above.

This is inspired by the Ostheer Mechanized Assault doctrine together with the Panzer Elite's concept and of course what's possible from the All Units mod in order to cram the PE into a single commander, more or less.

I think that the light vehicles would be the most interesting things here since they would be able to cover some of the OKW's draw backs, especially the 223 with it's locking down of sectors and the 250 Ambulance being able to reinforce on the move, or at least being a bit more mobile.

Alternatively the Repair and Recovery 251 can be replaced by some sort of Artillery strike, similar to the Ostheer Mechanized Assault doctrine.

Like I said this is just my opinion, cheers.

Jump back to quoted post21 Aug 2018, 06:13 AMadamírcz

Damn, this would have been awesome

Jump back to quoted post18 Aug 2018, 17:02 PMTiger Baron

Your idea of a Panzer Elite commander is very good, but it gives me another idea on how the PE could really be brought back into a single commander, at least sort of. Of course this is just entirely my opinion.

223 Command Car - From SnakeEye's "All Units" mod, capable of capturing and locking down territory in order to increase resource production. The PE as well as the OKW are not able to build Observation points or resource caches respectively so this would be a nice addition to the OKW, of course you would be securing territory but for a cost of manpower, fuel and population cap space.

251 Halftrack Mechanized Group - The 250 is open topped, comes armed with double MG42s, perfect for supporting your Panzergrenadiers, can also drop med packs since the PGs won't have med packs like the Sturmpioneers in order to heal on the move, similar to the USF Mechanized Company M3 Combat Group Call in. The Panzergrenadiers inside would be an expensive alternative to both the Sturmpioneers and Volksgrenadiers. 4 or 5 man squad armed with Kar98ks initially, could be upgraded with StGs or Panzerschrecks similar to the Stormtroopers and they can also only repair vehicles.

Jagdpanzer 38(t) "Hetzer" - firing the normal Panzergranate, cheaper non-tech alternative to the Jagdpanzer IV.

Repair and Recovery 251 Halftrack - also like the 223 being able to lock down is present in SnakeEye's "All Units" mod, can recover German vehicle wrecks in order to get them fully operational again, impedes an economic debuff according to the vehicle in order to be balanced, that meaning that recovering a Panzer IV would be a lot cheaper than a King Tiger for example.

Tiger I - Same as your idea, reason for it is the same as the AT Hetzer above.

This is inspired by the Ostheer Mechanized Assault doctrine together with the Panzer Elite's concept and of course what's possible from the All Units mod in order to cram the PE into a single commander, more or less.

I think that the light vehicles would be the most interesting things here since they would be able to cover some of the OKW's draw backs, especially the 223 with it's locking down of sectors and the 250 Ambulance being able to reinforce on the move, or at least being a bit more mobile.

Alternatively the Repair and Recovery 251 can be replaced by some sort of Artillery strike, similar to the Ostheer Mechanized Assault doctrine.

Like I said this is just my opinion, cheers.

Jump back to quoted post21 Aug 2018, 12:02 PMStark

I suggest to add:
1. some ammo ability - strafe, barrage, smoke or samething like that. Commander is too MP intensive currently.
2. What about upgrade for 251 HT which would make it a ostheer mortar HT? Commander ability stays as it is but add a upgrade that HT can be changed in mortar ht (for X ammo) but looses their core abilities to reinforce and heal. Mobile indirect fire would make this unit better more desirable. Again it would be inspired by PanzerElite concept.

But generally imo it's really good commander design. GJ

Jump back to quoted post21 Aug 2018, 13:35 PMSander93

I'd put the Hetzer AT into T1 as an Su-76-like stopgap light tank destroyer as an alternative to Rakettens and to open up T1 strategies as an alternative to a Puma to counter enemy light vehicles.

But this topic isn't for discussing new commanders. Unless you guys are talking about the Elite Armor doctrine in which case I don't think it needs such drastic changes to become viable.

Jump back to quoted post20 Jul 2018, 18:40 PMSander93

I think Elite Armor doctrine and Overwatch Doctrine were voted for most. I don't have much experience with Overwatch so I won't mention that one.

As for Elite Armor: the doctrine overal isn't that bad but needs a few tweaks to make it more viable compared to other doctrines.


2CP) Signal Relay

• This ability isn't bad but it generally isn't particularily useful either (at least not in team games) and when ammunition is scarce it's definitely not a priority to spend munis on.

• Could use some minor tweaks like lower cost and longer duration.

• Could also be made into passive vehicle tank awareness, which spots enemy vehicles in FOW on the minimap and tactical map within XX meter radius of friendly vehicles.

4CP) Emergency Repairs

• This ability isn't practical at all. It takes too long to repair critical damage (I think it takes 15 seconds) which means it can only be used in safe positions, making it extremely situational.

• Either reduce critical damage repair time drastically

• Or turn ability into a passive self-repair like the similar Soviet ability. This would make the doctrine more attractive for heavy vehicle based builds because it frees up Sturmpioneers for tasks other than repairing.

7CP) HEAT Shells

• This ability is fine. Greatly increases damage output of tanks for a cost-effective amount of munis.

• Perhaps customize the ability duration time to match vehicle ROF. I think this would be OP as a passive ability.

8CP) Panzer Commander

• This ability needs to be overhauled in order to be worth it over the pintle mounted MG. Needs to give more vision and perhaps an accuracy bonus. Or maybe give it a significant bonus to veterancy gain (like 20-30% faster veterancy).

• The artillery call-in takes way too long to land making it nearly useless. It either needs more range or it needs to activate quicker. If so, maybe change it to a light artillery barrage.

11CP) Sturmtiger

• IMO this vehicle is fine the way it is right now, difficult to use but can be very effective.

• Veterancy requirements need to be looked at though. Unless it's constantly hitting vehicles it just doesn't vet up at all really.

• Maybe switch Sturmtiger with Special Operations Doctrine's Command Panther. This would make more sense to both doctrines. Command Panther might be OP with HEAT shells and mark target ability combined, though.

Jump back to quoted post21 Aug 2018, 12:02 PMStark

I suggest to add:
1. some ammo ability - strafe, barrage, smoke or samething like that. Commander is too MP intensive currently.
2. What about upgrade for 251 HT which would make it a ostheer mortar HT? Commander ability stays as it is but add a upgrade that HT can be changed in mortar ht (for X ammo) but looses their core abilities to reinforce and heal. Mobile indirect fire would make this unit better more desirable. Again it would be inspired by PanzerElite concept.

But generally imo it's really good commander design. GJ

Jump back to quoted post21 Aug 2018, 13:18 PMSmartie

You have a good point in saying that American Soldiers ideas should complemented with ammo based abilities. I also think that the Radio Car does fit a lot better to the Overwatch doctrin.

So i would suggest:
1. Panzer Tactitian (imo a must for this doctrine
2. 250 Halftrack Mechanized Group with Obersoldaten (Im sticking here to my idea)
3. Breakthrough / improved Panzer Commander
4. Jagdpanzer 38(t) "Hetzer"
5. Tiger I

Now you have 2 ammo based and 3 fuel based abilities.

Jump back to quoted post21 Aug 2018, 15:47 PMTiger Baron

Just for the record the doctrine is called "Elite Armor" and not "Panzer Elite".


You're 100% right, i confused Panzer Elite with Elite Armor, my bad. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Jump back to quoted post24 Aug 2018, 07:11 AMblancat

Overwatch doctrine

Foward receivers+early warnig = foward overwatch(1cp)


SdKfz 251/20 Half-track w/ Infrared Serchlight(3cp)

251/20 is very OP unit as default unit of OKW

OKW can overwatch cheap and easily all over the map

so this unit need to be only commander unit

Jump back to quoted post24 Aug 2018, 09:38 AMStark

If anything is going to be removed something should be added instead

Jump back to quoted post24 Aug 2018, 11:02 AMTiger Baron

223 Command Car, can capture territory and setup to lock it down, same as the PE from CoH.

Keeps the OKW unique while allowing them to get more resources without relying on the Wehrmacht to do it all of the time but of course, for a price.

Jump back to quoted post27 Aug 2018, 20:15 PMStark

sold