MG42 Post Patch

He's not the only one. MG42 is still better than Maxim for me. I you want to swap them around then I'm more than happy to do so. Just write a petition to Relic. I'll sign it.

I like how you think dude

He's not the only one. MG42 is still better than Maxim for me. I you want to swap them around then I'm more than happy to do so. Just write a petition to Relic. I'll sign it.

MG42 is really good for Soviets because now you have a 6-man squad, huge arc, and enemy army does not have Oorah + Molotov combo. I still grab them whenever I find them abandoned on the field.

That being said, this fact has nothing to do with whether or not the MG42 is a cost-effective and worthwhile unit in the German army.

id have to see that video youre talking about to really know how the engi beat the mg. lucky flame crits could keep killing the entity thats actually on the mg and prevent it from firing though.

Yesterday's Propagandacast. I'll upload the replay if I can figure out the system, but I think you're right that the guys shooting were the ones dying.

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  Crowdpleaser1989 alexshiro

  sztefenfu joke.jokec

  Semoskiy Winter 55

  by: alexshiro map: Semoskiy Winter

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Sry, I don't know when exactly the MG kill happens. It happened to Crowdpleaser's MG, mine got killed by a mortar like it bloody well should.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_0sqzFNSis&feature=youtu.be&t=15m30s

WTF? Did they forget to nerf stolen MG42?

He's not the only one. MG42 is still better than Maxim for me. I you want to swap them around then I'm more than happy to do so. Just write a petition to Relic. I'll sign it.

Here's the thing.

The Germans do not have a movement/suppression buff ability from minute 1, making increased suppression for the MG42 the thing that is needed.

Otherwise, how are you going to deal with a blob of conscripts Ooorahing at your MG?

Here's the thing.

The Germans do not have a movement/suppression buff ability from minute 1, making increased suppression for the MG42 the thing that is needed.

Otherwise, how are you going to deal with a blob of conscripts Ooorahing at your MG?

If there is a blob of them - some of them should get through if the distance is short enough - in the replays and games I have seen since the patch provided they start from enough distance (i.e. the mg has a decent sight range due to spotters/clear ground) the mg will suppress and kill. If conscripts are oorahing from well within maximum range then they may well overwhelm you. Rushing mg positions is a well worn military tactic though can often result in a medal for those involved

If there is a blob of them - some of them should get through if the distance is short enough - in the replays and games I have seen since the patch provided they start from enough distance (i.e. the mg has a decent sight range due to spotters/clear ground) the mg will suppress and kill. If conscripts are oorahing from well within maximum range then they may well overwhelm you. Rushing mg positions is a well worn military tactic though can often result in a medal for those involved

It is also a stupid tactic as proven countless times by the British soldiers that were ordered to charge head-on into German Maxims in WWI.

This "strategy" has no place in a game like Company of Heroes. Players should be punished for stupidly charging troops into MGs (in both factions) rather than just waltzing through the firing arc and grenading the gunner.

Here's the thing.

The Germans do not have a movement/suppression buff ability from minute 1, making increased suppression for the MG42 the thing that is needed.

Otherwise, how are you going to deal with a blob of conscripts Ooorahing at your MG?

Man I play Germans as well and I find no problems with utilizing MG42 on the battlefield. This could be to the fact that as a Soviet player I was able to use pre patch Maxim to some degree. Transition from the God like MG to the unit we have today must have been painful for majority of players.
You can even find replay I posted in other topic to support my opinion.

It is also a stupid tactic as proven countless times by the British soldiers that were ordered to charge head-on into German Maxims in WWI.

This "strategy" has no place in a game like Company of Heroes. Players should be punished for stupidly charging troops into MGs (in both factions) rather than just waltzing through the firing arc and grenading the gunner.

Well providing you pay for it in casualties on the way it is fine. better of course to spread the blob out so the mg has to switch.

COH is obviously a game and so not really meant to be totally accurate but the stupid tactic of charging head on into enemy mg's was used time and time again as pre-tank and without lucky/overwhelming pre charge artillery and mortar fire as it was the only way to do it. btw you do prepare your mg positions don't you with green cover, wire and interlocking fields of fire over open ground? This is what caused the massacre of WW1 soldiers not a lone exposed mg.

I agree with OP, mg42 can no longer reliably suppress a single unit charging at it from the front.

I would like to see an mg42 that cant just instantly suppress at its max range multiple units like pre-patch, but can instantly suppress a single squad charging right at it, oorah, shocks or not before they reach molotov range.

Therefore I think the solution is allowing the mg42 heavy suppression on the first target it shoots, but making keeping it slow to switch targets as it is now. the closer a squad is, the heavier the suppression. Who in their right mind would sprint full speed at a machine gun firing at you?

A downside to this patch is that mg42s in buildings are now awful because they take too much time to lock on a target. Expecting mg42s to hold territory as a defensive unit is no longer viable, if your grens retreat you may as well retreat the mg too before it gets lulz killed

Remove it from the game, if we have to go without a suppression unit the least they could do is clean up the UI for T1 building.

So basically germans have had their playstyle shaken up, their crutch pulled out from under them, and now they have to have skill? Tsk. Maybe support your machine guns for once instead of using them like frontline super soldiers that can lock down any area alone, which they were NOT designed to do.

They're SUPPORT units not the one stop answer for holding territory. You've just become accustomed to having an unfair advantage.

Man I play Germans as well and I find no problems with utilizing MG42 on the battlefield. This could be to the fact that as a Soviet player I was able to use pre patch Maxim to some degree. Transition from the God like MG to the unit we have today must have been painful for majority of players.
You can even find replay I posted in other topic to support my opinion.

Just so you know, I never used the Ostheer MG previously because I knew it was broken.

Usually, my build tends to be Gren Gren Sniper Gren. If they're massing Conscripts though, you do need the MG.

In that game, there was many times where Scripts were Oorahing through the cone of the MG. With PPSH, they just wiped the MG.

ie, this means the MG has to be notched up in suppression or Oorah has to be nerfed in terms of suppression resistance.

Having a "Fire-up" ability which avoids suppression on a main line infantry unit (not rangers or Airborne) is kinda bullshit to be honest.

Having a "Fire-up" ability which avoids suppression on a main line infantry unit (not rangers or Airborne) is kinda bullshit to be honest.

+1

It's not "Fire-up", more like "Sprint", I don't think it increases their suppression resistance, just makes them go through the cone completely before they get suppressed. Even so, "Sprint" took researching everything, and Oorah! is free at the start of the game...
Without suppression, Conscripts just rush right in and molotov everything, forcing germans to fight from outside cover or inside fires, and you don't win any fights from there.

No one wants instasurpression at max range back. BUT it was overnerfed. Here is what I think it SHOULD do:

Without a Spotter: pin 1 enemy before he is in molotovrange.
With a Spotter: Surpress 2 Squads who advance from the opposite direction sides of the arc.
Pin 3 Squads from the front if they are all on the same point.
Also it should give enemys who walk into it at max range the possibility to walk out of sight again if the player reacts semifast/not slow.
Also if it gets flanked from 1 Squad + 1 Squad headon it should have to ATLEAST softretreat, full retreat is OK too, if you had no clue that there was a second squad coming.

And the Surpression bulletin should be removed, and all the above things be balanced without it.


(Other Possibilitys:
Redesigning its purpose. For example: no pin at all, only a slow, but then in it's whole arc. (smaller arc.)

Or no surpression at all, but the ability to damage multiply Squads at the same time at a high rate. Maybe a burst weopen. Whatever.)


I don't think the Mg42 does what it is supposed to do now. Increased damage, more "aimtime" AND surpression in one patch was too much. Increased damage was really needed, aswell as no instapin. Solution: Buff the surpression a bit. Leave the other nerfs.

And btw guys, what do you mean by supporting? Can you explain this further and say exactly what it should do?

FYI, Maximum of MGs i used preptach was 1.

And btw, am I the only one whoes mgs set up in the false direction in a house?

Well providing you pay for it in casualties on the way it is fine. better of course to spread the blob out so the mg has to switch.

COH is obviously a game and so not really meant to be totally accurate but the stupid tactic of charging head on into enemy mg's was used time and time again as pre-tank and without lucky/overwhelming pre charge artillery and mortar fire as it was the only way to do it. btw you do prepare your mg positions don't you with green cover, wire and interlocking fields of fire over open ground? This is what caused the massacre of WW1 soldiers not a lone exposed mg.

You're telling me six guys running head-first into an MG42 while screaming Oorah at the top of their lungs in real life are going to live to see another day?

Unless that machinegunner was drunk, blind, or deaf, he will mow all six of those people down in less than ten seconds, no matter how unfortified his position is.

Granted, this is a game and the MG would obviously be OP if it instantly killed squads like that. However, it shouldn't ever allow one squad of conscripts to run up through its firing arc and kill it when it was already deployed. That's fucking retarded.

Unless that machinegunner was drunk, blind, or deaf, he will mow all six of those people down in less than ten seconds, no matter how unfortified his position is.

You mean drunk, blind and deaf.

IRL, MGs are setup, almost always, on the left flank, to interlock with the next infantry platoon in the defense line, and to provide a diagonal fied of fire to the front of the platoon that overlaps with the other troops line of fire.
MGs are used to "anchor" the defense line and categorically prevent being overrun from that flank, allowing the rest of the unit to worry about the front and right flank (which, in a company sized defense line, would have the neighbouring platoons MG covering tha approach)

Infantry doctrine dictates, as a rule of thumb, needing 4x numerical superiority minimum and as much smoke and indirect ordnance covering fire as possible, to validate an assault on a dug in MG position, during which you can expect to sustain 1/3 attrition, which is at the extreme of "acceptable losses".

For all "real" intents and purposes though, frontally assaulting an MG position is tantamount to suicide.
Thats why individual soldiers have been so decorated for managing to destroy them. However if you read the specific descriptions of how they got those medals, there has been almost always horrific losses to the unit, before that one solo guy went Rambo, and saved his remwining brothers in arms, and broke the position.

If youve ever fired an HMG with an unobstructed field of fire, youd understand that there is noway to approach it from the front without literally getting shot to shi. Its a huge force multiplier.

Just adding that for general interest.

I don't think single or even 2 squads should be running upto the mg but once you get to 3 squads plus I am happy that there is a CHANCE that one gets to within molotov range.

My personal experience of mg's post patch with a limited number of games is that it has still owned my infantry In all situations provided it is set-up with a good stretch of open ground between it and me. In any situations where I catch it out of position or not set up or placed ahead of its army with line of sight obscured, provided I Oorah immediately I am likely to run past it or at least get in throwing range compared to previous where if a single model was still in front of the mg by the time it finished set-up the whole squad would be pinned.

An exception is houses which are much easier to approach with a second squad (maybe too easy?).

There some valid points on here where people are claiming that single squads have walked up to them but I haven't seen this- is this maybe the rng and did the squad enter the mg arc at maximum range?

The doctrine issue is also a relevant point. Overall it is my opinion that if it is not right it is very nearly so.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_0sqzFNSis&feature=youtu.be&t=15m30s

WTF? Did they forget to nerf stolen MG42?

This is something new,so now the MG is nerfed only when Germans are using it )...
@JohanSchwarz Yes some battles were won like that,here is proof:
The Russian army is not a conventional army in that it is used to fight wars, but is rather a way for the government to dispose of the massive amounts of disgruntled workers, laborers and drunks that make up the Proletariat. Russia has their own version of conscription, "Compulsory National Suicide", in which the Red Army launch wave after wave of attacks without weapons until the enemy run out of ammo and are butchered by the "real" army. In theory. Russia is the complete opposite of France in that Russians never retreat and have a tendency to die to the last man, which Josef Stalin will have one way or another. A Russian soldier is easy to identify. He is dead, buried under thousands of his equally decreased brethren.
Russian battlecry: "Ugh", "AHHH MOTHERLA-", "God help me!", "URAA- ow, my spleen!", "Arrrrrrrrgh" "*Gurgle gurgle gurgle...*"