Counters to double Churchill(basic) as Okw?

I just cant do it. Every time I'm against a Brit player they go this strategy. Panthers don't work as the brit guy goes special weapons regiment and the risk of snare is to high. and panther AI is a joke. The Kt also fails. It's only one tank with a super slow reload time. The Churchill can pen it from the front(???) witch should not happen. The Racketem is int even an option, it dies in 2 shots. Could I know the secret to destroying churchills? I would appreciate any help.

I just cant do it. Every time I'm against a Brit player they go this strategy. Panthers don't work as the brit guy goes special weapons regiment and the risk of snare is to high. and panther AI is a joke. The Kt also fails. It's only one tank with a super slow reload time. The Churchill can pen it from the front(???) witch should not happen. The Racketem is int even an option, it dies in 2 shots. Could I know the secret to destroying churchills? I would appreciate any help.

Why does Panther not work? And what does Special Weapons Regiment have to do with it? Sure the UKF player can get a IS with snare ability but you have Volksgrenadiers with snares everywhere. So?

Raketenwerfer has high pen and can be used to ambush well. Works vs Churchill just like any other tank.

Churchill can´t pen KTs frontally on a reliable basis. The odds of the Churchill penning the KT from the front are between 28-36% depending on distance.

Panther hardcounters the Churchill, just use it at max range. Panter will pen most shots while Churchill can't return fire, no need to rush in. Especially the Command Panther is good because of its mark target ability giving more damage and accuracy I think.

Rakettens can be good too, try to use the cloak to put them in spots where they can shoot at the Churchill from the side and it will melt. Throw in a Volksgrenadier with panzerfaust and the Churchill basically becomes immobile.

KT is only good if you go elite armor doctrine and use the HEAT shells.

If it's an open map and it's a team game, consider going Jagdtiger. Completely denies Churchills.

Churchills have a ton of health but they have the Cromwell's gun. They're not taking down your heavier tanks by themselves.

It's the Firefly or 6 pounders supporting them you've got to deal with.

JP4?

Why does Panther not work? And what does Special Weapons Regiment have to do with it? Sure the UKF player can get a IS with snare ability but you have Volksgrenadiers with snares everywhere. So?

Raketenwerfer has high pen and can be used to ambush well. Works vs Churchill just like any other tank.

Churchill can´t pen KTs frontally on a reliable basis. The odds of the Churchill penning the KT from the front are between 28-36% depending on distance.

its because a panther would need more time to kill a church than the church and maybe a AT gun/ IS sqaud / firefly / other tank can kill the panther.

2 panthers cant counter a firefly behind a church with a AT IS sqaud..panters will lose.

its because a panther would need more time to kill a church than the church and maybe a AT gun/ IS sqaud / firefly / other tank can kill the panther.

2 panthers cant counter a firefly behind a church with a AT IS sqaud..panters will lose.

Thread is about double churchill.
There will be no FF anywhere around that.

And to counter them all you need is a mix of AT.
I'd go usual panther and 2-3 puppchens. Puppchens make a short work of any brit vehicle if you go for stealth creep cheeze.

Thread is about double churchill.
There will be no FF anywhere around that.

And to counter them all you need is a mix of AT.
I'd go usual panther and 2-3 puppchens. Puppchens make a short work of any brit vehicle if you go for stealth creep cheeze.

he didnt say that there is not FF. he only say that he cant counter the churchs. they will give the AT guns/ FF enough time to eat the panthers...while 2 church eat all AT guns/ infantery

he didnt say that there is not FF. he only say that he cant counter the churchs. they will give the AT guns/ FF enough time to eat the panthers...while 2 church eat all AT guns/ infantery

There won't be, unless you dont need any infantry/atgs.
Pop cap is a thing.

There won't be, unless you dont need any infantry/atgs.
Pop cap is a thing.

are u wanna tell me there is no room for a FF and 2xchurch..and dont allow the player any more? in endgame (sounds like that...because he did tell us something from KT). Are u seroius?

maybe your math is crap since last days?

are u wanna tell me there is no room for a FF and 2xchurch..and dont allow the player any more? in endgame (sounds like that...because he did tell us something from KT). Are u seroius?

maybe your math is crap since last days?

2 5 man RE
3 5 man IS
ATG or two
Possibly pit/land mattress
Likely sniper

Add that pop together.

Now check how much pop 2 MK7 are.
Now check how much pop is left and how much FF costs.

2 5 man RE
3 5 man IS
ATG or two
Possibly pit/land mattress
Likely sniper

Add that pop together.

Now check how much pop 2 MK7 are.
Now check how much pop is left and how much FF costs.

ah...i see...you now tell us some more units are uncommon for a lategame where you mostly have 1-2 IS, max 1-2 sappers and one AT gun...and the last popcap goes to the tanks. But nice try bro. its also maybe your own build...but guess what? there are some other players out there. they play different, my friend.

I'm going by simple assumption that you do not lose squads left and right.
But since its you who I discuss it with, maybe I should assume random loses left and right, where you constantly have 60 free pop to fill and magically still have resources to do so?

You know, there is a reason why you don't see churchills at high end games outside of troll builds.

I'm going by simple assumption that you do not lose squads left and right.
But since its you who I discuss it with, maybe I should assume random loses left and right, where you constantly have 60 free pop to fill and magically still have resources to do so?

You know, there is a reason why you don't see churchills at high end games outside of troll builds.

there was many games with church in the last 2v2 tourney....didn u see them? oh and wait...you wanna tell me you dont lost units? even better player than you lose EVERY god damn game units.
but...you not? you are the troll here.

GCS: Luvnest vs Talisman.

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/273912846

Around 6:20:00

Luvnest lost the moment he chose UKF. Joke. Although not so much.

I think he went with Churchills, against the worst type of opponent (patient player) for that unit. Double Churchill was one of the reasons i think Luvnest ended up losing that game. I invite you to first look at that game and think why this is the case.

Spoiler.


You can't have everything, because popcap is an issue. Repair times are an issue.

Luvnest armies: 2 IS (healing), 1 commando, 1 atgun, 1 mg, 2 engineers (1 heavy). 2x Churchill, 1 FF.
Talismans armies: 5 Volks (Stg), 1 rak, 1 mg, 1 SP. 1 Command PV, 1 PIV and a Stuka.

You have an issue by been blinded by the 2 trees, instead of looking at the forest.

If he has, AT IS, then he can't have any other thing. Either he lacks control which is given with supports weapons, he lacks indirect fire to properly soften your position and push, he doesn't have chase potential. He can't deal with your infantry squads. He can't repair his tanks in a decent time.

GCS: Luvnest vs Talisman.

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/273912846

Around 6:20:00

Luvnest lost the moment he chose UKF. Joke. Although not so much.

I think he went with Churchills, against the worst type of opponent (patient player) for that unit. Double Churchill was one of the reasons i think Luvnest ended up losing that game. I invite you to first look at that game and think why this is the case.

Spoiler.


You can't have everything, because popcap is an issue. Repair times are an issue.

Luvnest armies: 2 IS (healing), 1 commando, 1 atgun, 1 mg, 2 engineers (1 heavy). 2x Churchill, 1 FF.
Talismans armies: 5 Volks (Stg), 1 rak, 1 mg, 1 SP. 1 Command PV, 1 PIV and a Stuka.

You have an issue by been blinded by the 2 trees, instead of looking at the forest.

If he has, AT IS, then he can't have any other thing. Either he lacks control which is given with supports weapons, he lacks indirect fire to properly soften your position and push, he doesn't have chase potential. He can't deal with your infantry squads. He can't repair his tanks in a decent time.

he failed at some points:

- useless callin for high muni price..nothing rewards
> he should insteat use more tulips rockets...there was some moments panther would be easily dead if he would use it....but no
- he didnt managed ut to make a push with double churchs and firefly...everytime he split
- he picked the false commander...it was clearly one of the BIGGEST fails i see
- he didnt build caches...wtf..such a long game...big fail
- he could have 3 sappers...but no...he was long time with 82-92 pocap...he could have one more!
- he didnt managed to get on the other side from the field --OKW can defend all the time all units at one points...fail

-> conclusion: there was WAY to much fail decisions...to could win

Ullumulu, if you're that confident you know UKF better than Luvnest why not challenge Talisman to a 1v1?

he failed at some points:

- useless callin for high muni price..nothing rewards
> he should insteat use more tulips rockets...there was some moments panther would be easily dead if he would use it....but no
- he didnt managed ut to make a push with double churchs and firefly...everytime he split
- he picked the false commander...it was clearly one of the BIGGEST fails i see
- he didnt build caches...wtf..such a long game...big fail
- he could have 3 sappers...but no...he was long time with 82-92 pocap...he could have one more!
- he didnt managed to get on the other side from the field --OKW can defend all the time all units at one points...fail

-> conclusion: there was WAY to much fail decisions...to could win

You do realize you are not in position to critic players like Luvnest, because you're bad and you're going to remain bad?
You barely even played faction in question in comparison to others.
Plus that games proves everything I've told you-by top players.

And what is with bad players and fixation on caches? Can someone explain that to me?

he failed at some points:

- useless callin for high muni price..nothing rewards
> he should insteat use more tulips rockets...there was some moments panther would be easily dead if he would use it....but no
- he didnt managed ut to make a push with double churchs and firefly...everytime he split
- he picked the false commander...it was clearly one of the BIGGEST fails i see
- he didnt build caches...wtf..such a long game...big fail
- he could have 3 sappers...but no...he was long time with 82-92 pocap...he could have one more!
- he didnt managed to get on the other side from the field --OKW can defend all the time all units at one points...fail

-> conclusion: there was WAY to much fail decisions...to could win

I'll agree with only the first 2 points. Offmap was used cause he couldn't find a way to break through Talisman line, same situation in the 3rd game when he was OH. Sometimes offmaps are not used for it's kil potential rather than I REALLY want you outside of this portion of the map for a minute.

Tulips were indeed a better option, but they are no longer as powerful as before.

He wasn't able to make a full push with all his vehicles, because he was either repairing them or been forced to use the Churchills to kill Volks squad as his push and AI potential was limited.

The moment he had popcap for another RE, it was either because several of his squads were low on numbers (meaning he wouldn't be able to reinforce) or he lost some other squad.

You are looking it at the perspective of the people who have constant vision of the map and composition of the enemy army. Yes, Luvnest biggest chance was to all in at some point against the slow grinding playstyle of Talisman. But all ining is not the position you want to be put on.

UKF isn't the king of aggressive play and he wasn't able to get the "other side" cause his army was double churchill. 5 Volks, SP, 2 medium tanks can reposition faster than 2x Churchill, 2 IS, 2 RE, Commando.

You said Luv needed a 3rd RE, then that means something else has to go. Which is the whole point of this thread. You can't go double Churchill without having another aspect of your army lacking. If you get a FF you are too strain in order to be able to repair your vehicles and your infantry/support play gets a hit. If you go for AT guns to support your Churchill, you are opened up to getting them killed by indirect fire and you don't have any reasonable way to chase down vehicles which are slowly poking at your vet feeders.

he failed at some points:

- useless callin for high muni price..nothing rewards
> he should insteat use more tulips rockets...there was some moments panther would be easily dead if he would use it....but no
- he didnt managed ut to make a push with double churchs and firefly...everytime he split
- he picked the false commander...it was clearly one of the BIGGEST fails i see
- he didnt build caches...wtf..such a long game...big fail
- he could have 3 sappers...but no...he was long time with 82-92 pocap...he could have one more!
- he didnt managed to get on the other side from the field --OKW can defend all the time all units at one points...fail

-> conclusion: there was WAY to much fail decisions...to could win

will you stop commenting on stuff you never play yourself one day? A rank 1000 OKW-only player who tries to explain how top 10 1v1 brits should be played Oh wait, nearly ALL of your "expertise" tips are COMPLETE GARBAGE and ridiculous af, not a surprise tho. Thanks for the laughs as always

It's as if someone wants to tell you how easy it is to serve the army even tho he never had military service in his life. Go play some real brit games for once -and with real I mean vs top 100 opponents and not 1 game per month vs rank 5000 day one noobs- or STFU about stuff you have 0 personal experience about.

You probably still think that Brits are OP cuz you constantly lose vs them with your 5 APM potato micro.