Katushya

Anybody else think the range on this thing is ridiculous?

Let's break it down here;

It's in T4(So in almost every game Soviets have a chance to build at least 1)

Its range allows you to hit the enemy HQ from literally just outside your base on some maps.

It's untouchable if you have an SU-85 on the field

PzWerfers get absolutely shit on by it and are not a usable counter due to having no range whatsoever

It throws tonnes of high damage rockets which due huge damage in a large AOE to both infantry and vehicles

What do people think of the unit as a whole? Other than the range being too high I think it's fine. Being able to hit an enemy base is fine, but there should be an element of risk involved. It's not like an off-map ability where you need LoS, you can fire blind and if you time against a retreat effectively you're almost sure to get a squad, not to mention you can just whittle away at the base in general.

I think the unit is fine. The devastating thing about it is the sheer amount of area it can saturate. The damage output is relatively spaced out in time though, so you do have the time for a quick retreat if you sense your in the center of it. Alternatively you do have the chance sometimes to quickly run perpendicular to the direction of the rockets and be safe.

One quick and smart flanking tactic can often spell the end for a katushya. 1 shreck volley, tank or AC raid spells the end for it often. Try pick an unexpected route and force a distraction somewhere if possible. Keep note if a player consistantly keeps them in the same position as this lets you plan for the offensive on it. Recon run and you will do this extremely easily.

As for hitting the base, I can't think of any 1v1 maps where Katushya can just sit in the base and fire volley at the enemy base from your own. You still have to bring it up to the center a bit. It does give you a chance to hit them if they try do this, but best thing is try avoid mass retreat.

The Calliope was more devasting and harder to kill in CoH1. More accurate (used aggressively), faster and more health. Yeah I know its doctrinal. Just try find them holes!

Both Katusha and panzerwerfer are much easier to counter than vCoH artillery units, they not even close Hummel or Priest and properly used calliope was devastating and hard to kill.

The new units are paper thin and can be easily killed By AC or lucky counter battery barrage :-).

New rocket artillery tactics are close to CoH hotchkiss tanks but with worse accuracy.

Katyusha fires 16 rockets for 80 damage a rocket, 1280 damage.

Panzerwerfer fires 10 rockets for 128 damage a rocket, 1280 damage.

Katyusha wins by 30 range (120 vs 150).

Both have 50 penetration, 25 distance and 10 angle scatter.

Personally the panzerwerfer is more effective for the alpha strike potential, which makes up for 30 range for me. Precision strike is definitely better than counter battery however.

There's also the points of katyusha being easier to kill, one burst from a 20mn scout car pops one while a t70 is a bigger investment and takes 3 shots to kill.

They are both pretty awful firing at max range into fog of war.

Personally the panzerwerfer is more effective for the alpha strike potential, which makes up for 30 range for me. Precision strike is definitely better than counter battery however.

dont forget that the panzerwerfer fires its rockets at a much higher angle though. that means even at close range the rockets fly very high and take a while before they hit their target. the katyushas rocket angle depends on the distance youre firing them. short range katyusha rockets fly low and hit the target very quickly, making them harder to dodge. at long range the rocket flight is a lot more even though, so the panzerwerfer firing all its rockets at once probably does have the advantage there.

Then swap the katuyusha stats and the panzerwerfer stats

dont forget that the panzerwerfer fires its rockets at a much higher angle though. that means even at close range the rockets fly very high and take a while before they hit their target. the katyushas rocket angle depends on the distance youre firing them. short range katyusha rockets fly low and hit the target very quickly, making them harder to dodge. at long range the rocket flight is a lot more even though, so the panzerwerfer firing all its rockets at once probably does have the advantage there.

don't forget they won't get blocked by buildings and such though, don't forget Panzerwerfer 132damage=instant kill to infantry models, don't forget Panzerwerfer has greater durability (armor) than the katyusha, don't forget Panzerwerfer area density and scatter is much better than the katyusha, don't forget panzerwerfer has a cool down only 40S while katyusha has 80S cool down, don't forget you can get Panther which is the most cost effetive and most durable non-doctrinal AT tank, don't forget you can get Brummbär as well.

I do think swap katyusha and Panzerwerfer stats for a week, then you'll continue the whine about how the new kayusha can instant kill infantry, AT, support weapon but your new panzerwerfer can't

dont forget ugbear is going to be a troll. i didnt whine, i pointed out some differences between the 2. i never said anything about the panzerwerfer being bad or the katyusha "instant killing infantry", but way to bring in complaints about panther and brummbar. who is the whiner here? shouldnt you be complaining about the is2 somewhere?

don't forget they won't get blocked by buildings and such though, don't forget Panzerwerfer 132damage=instant kill to infantry models, don't forget Panzerwerfer has greater durability (armor) than the katyusha, don't forget Panzerwerfer area density and scatter is much better than the katyusha, don't forget panzerwerfer has a cool down only 40S while katyusha has 80S cool down, don't forget you can get Panther which is the most cost effetive and most durable non-doctrinal AT tank, don't forget you can get Brummbär as well.

I do think swap katyusha and Panzerwerfer stats for a week, then you'll continue the whine about how the new kayusha can instant kill infantry, AT, support weapon but your new panzerwerfer can't

Seriously dude? And if you're going to spout stats ,please make them accurate at least. 60s on Katyusha, 48s on panzerwerfer. Scatter values on both are the same.

katiusza would be better if all rockets would be fired at he same time, not 3 or 4 volleys with 4 rockets each

Seriously dude? And if you're going to spout stats ,please make them accurate at least. 60s on Katyusha, 48s on panzerwerfer. Scatter values on both are the same.

cool down between fires, not the total cool down, not sure about kayusha but it's 80S most of the time, but panzerwerfer is near 40S cool down bettween volley for sure

cool down between fires, not the total cool down, not sure about kayusha but it's 80S most of the time, but panzerwerfer is near 40S cool down bettween volley for sure

What are you talking about?

kayusha have a ability land a correct concreted fire, too many time when i use panzerwerfer it miss the center of fire zone i put and all those soviet soliders who stayed at center of rocket fire zone stays untouched, one time my teammate even joke about it

That happens all the time for the BM too. It's random.

These weapons should have low accuracy and I think the concentrated barrage option should be removed.

That happens all the time for the BM too. It's random.

These weapons should have low accuracy and I think the concentrated barrage option should be removed.

And replaced with?
You can't just have a unit without a vet ability, and the soviet artillery usually has the trend of (is inaccurate until it gets vet) sorta thing going for them.