Dealing with early bunkers?

Good morning everyone,

I've been having a fairly consistent issue in my games (mostly 2v2) and wanted to ask the experts out there for advice.

Typically, I either go for a quick Special Rifle Command for either Sniper or Flame Scout Car, or extra conscripts + Molotov when I open. I tend to favor infantry-related doctrines such as Conscripts Support or Anti-Infantry tactics (this might be an issue all on its own?) but anyways, I'm getting sidetracked.

Often, I'll come across Ostheer opponents who will build early Bunkers, particularly in maps where there's a lot of lanes/choke points that can easily be defended. Sometimes, I'm able to push their Pioneers off of the bunkers while under construction, but often I'm stuck with the darn thing sitting there till I can get out a t70 or ZiS/AT Gun. Are mortars a good early counter (been trying to use smoke more lately, seems to be helping with both bunkers and MGs)

My initial/gut feeling is that I'm teching too slowly? Any tips about tech timings (or links to guides) would be useful. Also, any general ideas about dealing with early bunkers would be awesome.

Thanks for your time. Obviously, I'm not a great player and I feel like this is one sign of issues in my play I need to correct before I can improve.

Try Penal's they have the satchel charge, should either kill or do heavy damage.

Guards PTRS Rifles do good damage to bunkers. An M3 with guards in would make quick work of a bunker that has been upgraded with an MG.

EDIT: Which would be a problem with Anti Infantry Tactics/Conscript Support Tactics, an alternate can be Engineer with Flamer in M3, flamethrowers are quite effective, but not as quick as PTRS Rifles.

Mortars

Guards PTRS Rifles do good damage to bunkers. An M3 with guards in would make quick work of a bunker that has been upgraded with an MG.

EDIT: Which would be a problem with Anti Infantry Tactics/Conscript Support Tactics, an alternate can be Engineer with Flamer in M3, flamethrowers are quite effective, but not as quick as PTRS Rifles.

My experience is that flamers and Molotovs don't do well against bunkers, but I'll give Guards and/or Penals a try. I don't use Penal Battalions very often, glad to see a clear use for them.

Thanks

the guards do good damage to the bunker

You should be glad if you see that your opponent has spent 150 manpower and 60 munitions to build a bunker in the first five-or-so minutes!

If you go Conscript, Conscript, Conscript, M3A1...

Try to avoid the bunker and use an M3A1 with a flamer engi to chase around and kill grenadier squads. If your opponent is going very early bunkers and upgrading them, he shouldn't be able to afford panzerfausts. That in itself doesn't get rid of the bunker, but it will take advantage of your opponent's choice to go early bunkers, and let you get far enough ahead that you can deal with the bunker with whatever tool you want.

That's my two cents. I don't know how well that would work in a 2v2 setting, since I mainly play 1v1.

EDIT: also, it would be very good if you posted a replay of a representative game.

MORTARS!
will work every time especially 120mm mortars

keep in mind that if he using bunkers he is invested allot in them!
destroy them with the mortar.

HATE Bunkers!!!

120mm mortar can do the job if you see your opponent starts with an early bunker spam I would recommend you to choose the commander with the guards and 120mm mortar units (I think he is called guards coordination tactics) instead of you regular choice. Remember that your commander's choice must always depend on your battle situation.

I've come up against this strategy a lot recently, it's as If I am playing a computer or something, because the amount of bunker spam is just confusing. Building 3-4 bunkers early is just suicide for the Heer. Anyway here is what I've used against it in case anyone else comes up against it.

Here is what I do/ my build order:

Doctrine: Anti Infantry Tactics (Very important)

Build:
Early Game
3x Conscripts
1x Engineer (Mainly for building, but can upgrade both with flamers)
1x Maxim or Mortar (For bunkers)
1x Shock troops
Mid Game
1x ZiS anti tank
2-3x T34
1x Shock troops
Late Game
KV - If appropriate, this thing wrecks!
Katuysha - If appropriate, if he is still going heavy bunkers this will take care of it
Incendiary artillery - Great for dispersing a strong point, which are likely due to bunker spam.

This has worked well for me so far, as early game the Germans don't seem to have that much manpower on the field. You can usually beat a grenadier squad with the Engineer and Conscript squad. If not, I usually just out cap him over the map. Giving you more resources to pump out your T34 quite early.

P.S Engineer demolition charges are super effective against buildings.

I like to blind them with mortar smoke ore shock smoke grenade and then rush in with whatever is able to take it out.

You can also flank them pretty easily with m3s.

They've spent resources on a stationary object. Remember RTS games are just a balance sheet. Use your mobility to attack a different location and bring your resource advantage to bear on that location. Deal with the bunker later when you have the added tools to. It will end up with them having wasted resources.

ZiS barrage kills it

Yeah, I've been starting to go t2 instead of T1 (also helpful since I'm not great with Snipers, Scout cars or Penal Battalions) and getting a fairly early ZiS. This has helped with bunkers, HMGs in buildings + early halftracks, so I'm quite happy for the moment.

Also, I'm starting to like Smoke a lot now that I'm actually using it. Good vs HMGs and enemy AT guns as well as bunkers etc.

If you would like to counter early bunkers I strongly suggest:
- An M3A1 Light Scout Car (80 MP, 20 fuel, 2 supply)
- Combat engineers (240 MP, 6 supply)With ROK's flamethrower (60M)
Embark your combat engineers into the back of the M3A1 scout car and flank the bunkers.

As stated above, it would be a godsend if the enemy has spent the bulk of their starting funds on a MG bunker. This would set them back on a lot of tech time meaning that they wont be able to use the pesky panzerfausts, this would allow your fiery scout car to be hell on wheels to enemy infantry. Not only does this counter bunkers and emplacements it is also very effective against mortars and MG42 HMG teams. You must be very careful to try and keep the scout car out of the arc of fire as much as possible due to the fact that it has a lightly armoured frame. Against the AP rounds from a veteran MG42 team its like the butter with a hot knife going through it, if this happens bail and retreat your infantry.

Not only can you burn any infantry to a crisp and destroy emplacements, you can also capture territory with the scout car loaded up with units. This would make the 'rolling front' tactic work very well and would allow you to starve the enemy of resources very early on resulting in a very infuriated opponent. Cheap, reliable and effective.

Another effective way at countering early bunkers are mortars however these require funds for the Weapon Support Kampaneya (240MP 6 supply) and 360MP (for the mortars). I would not recommend using mortars until late in the game when the enemy has tanks or scout cars equipped with auto cannons, these render the first tactic useless unless they are covered by an Divisional Field Gun or at least two squads of conscripts. I do however, agree that mortars are underused

I have not written about how to counter them with tanks because that should be pretty self explanatory and you won't be able to get them early on in a game.

Hope this helps