Problems with conscripts against pios and grens

In COH I was familiar with the way to fight with Volks/Rifles etc. But I cannot for the life of me figure out how to use conscripts effectively.

It seems that no matter if they face off against Pio's or Grens, irrespective of distance or cover (or even if they enemy is in negative cover), they just simply get chewed up and spat out.

The only time I ever see to feel like it's even an even match is when it's three Conscript squads against one Pio squad. Just the other day one Pio flamer squad ate two full health conscript squads like they weren't even there.

Couple that with almost instant Osteer nades and glacial throwing times on Molotovs and I'm having a very hard time of it early doors.

Discounting my piss poor micro, what are the rules of engagement for successfully taking on Pio's and Grens with Conscripts?

In theory, Grens/Cons are evenly matched with no range differences. It's cover that really should make the difference.

I think in vCoH being in heavy cover was a disadvantage against flamers, not sure if that has carried over.

I think grenadiers and conscripts are almoust equal at all ranges.
So without considering upgrades, the outcome of a battle depends on luck, cover and health

vs pioneers without flamers, conscripst perform best at mid range to max range, since the sub-machine guns of the pios are best up close.

vs pios with flamers i guess it would be best to battle them at close distance from behind their cover. flamers do the same amount of damage at any distance while rifles are more accurate at a close distance

Thanks for the replies.
From what I can see the green cover stuff IRT flamers hasn't carried over (but I'm sure someone far more knowledgeable than me will know for sure).

There's just got to be something going on as I've just watched a replay of my last game and have seen a Gren squad (non-vetted, no upgrades, but got V1 during the battle) take on and kill two conscript squads, plus an engineer. All without losing a man, and while being constantly on the move up close. Equal cover.

The only time I've had any sort of joy has been with stationary Cons in green cover with injured Grens charging across no cover areas. But as soon as they get in close = mass die off of Cons.

Ideally I suppose one would use a Maxim to suppress Grens, but unless I'm using it incorrectly (which I probably am), it seems to take about three bursts to suppress any enemies, by which time they have charged behind it FTW.

...There's just got to be something going on as I've just watched a replay of my last game and have seen a Gren squad (non-vetted, no upgrades, but got V1 during the battle) take on and kill two conscript squads, plus an engineer...
The only time I've had any sort of joy has been with stationary Cons in green cover with injured Grens charging across no cover areas. But as soon as they get in close = mass die off of Cons.

Sure it wasn't PGrens? Or were you also getting sniped from a distance? I can't think of any situation, regardless of cover, where that should happen.

^^^
Whoops, my bad, yes they were Pgrens.

I'll get my coat...

^^^
Whoops, my bad, yes they were Pgrens.

I'll get my coat...

Yeah, PGrens will tear apart Conscripts and Engineers. Though I would expect them to lose 1 or 2 squad members in that fight, that could have just been some bad luck for you.

Conscripts are good only with Upgrades. And even then Grens rape them with the LMG, Pgrens don`t even care if you have upgrades or not.
Also 2 pios will tear apart 1 conscript squad in a matter of seconds.
As I see conscripts they are only good early game in masse. After Grens or PGrens get vet you can pretty much say goodbye to conscripts. But this is only for squad vs squad fights.
Best advice I can give you is always try to get in cover first, + better cover that the enemy, never run in red cover. If the enemy is already in cover go from around without taking damage to negate cover or just avoid the fight. All this will work against Grens, if you want to beat Pgrens with conscripts then you either should run to them with HTD and PPSH upgrade and outnumber them in squads. If you can`t calculate where the Pgrens will run don`t even bother throwing a molotov, since everyone who is using PGrens constantly move.

As it says, conscripts are the bulk of the Red Army. The main tactic with conscripts is strength in numbers, you have six rifles against them so theoretically speaking you have a higher hit chance, however this is not the case since these troops 'have little or no combat experience or training'. I agree they aren't the best but its they're flexibility that makes them good, Molotov's are good counters against infantry at the start, this will, however eat in to your munitions supply but that's what to do if your desperate.

If you do not want your conscripts to die, use cover. Cover will always make your conscripts win against one squad of Pioneers or Grenadiers providing its directional. Even if it is just light cover (yellow) it will be better than or the same as the enemies but try to get heavy cover (green). Never put your units on roads.

I always use two conscript squads together so one can flank the enemies directional cover but if this doesn't work get mortars to support you in your advance then I can guarantee a win on that front.

Pioneers are armed with the infamous MP40, this is a submachine gun and is no good at long range, use this to your advantage when against them.

Grenadiers are supposedly armed with the Kar98k bolt action rifle and has the same effectiveness as the Russian Mosain-nagant (sorry about the spelling). Due to the fact that these are both bolt action rifles they are both good at mid to long range, its just good cover you need to topple the scales. Word of warning, watch out for the German rifle mounted grenades these are quite effective at countering squads of conscripts, furthermore, when you tell your squads to get to cover, make sure they're in cover! sometimes the odd one steps out in a clearing for no reason and this loses that persons cover bonus.

Just use two conscript squads together at the start and put them in cover, you'll be fine.