Squad-ai, Yes or No.

Yeah it'd be really nice if there was some way to toggle it like hold fire.

There might be using scar. We could bind a command to a button that changes the used squad-ai file for the squad. It was done in some missions from COH1 (namely the first one/D-Day, to disable the attack plan for the defenders). The WW1 mod for COH1 has a good example of a hold position button.

Edit: Just found it in Coh1. There's a action called (ai_plan) that lets you overwrite the squad ai. You could put that on a ability that changes it to a empty plan, and wha-la, squad-ai is disabled. Sadly, I dont think this is in coh2, as I dont remember seeing it as a available action.

There might be using scar. We could bind a command to a button that changes the used squad-ai file for the squad. It was done in some missions from COH1 (namely the first one/D-Day, to disable the attack plan for the defenders). The WW1 mod for COH1 has a good example of a hold position button.

Edit: Just found it in Coh1. There's a action called (ai_plan) that lets you overwrite the squad ai. You could put that on a ability that changes it to a empty plan, and wha-la, squad-ai is disabled. Sadly, I dont think this is in coh2, as I dont remember seeing it as a available action.

Ah that's a shame.

I have another question for everyone.

Should certain squads have their own unique AI, or should all squads behave the same?
Should conscripts try to spread out and slowly advance on the enemy, and should shock-troops try to get close to the enemy as quick as they can? Should Grenadiers be a balanced mix between the above mentioned?

If you don't think this would be good for multiplayer, how about single-player? Would you like to see this kind of behavior in the campaign/TOW scenarios?

(Not related to the question above, just a little bit of info):
Vehicle AI is something im very interested in. It seems during the early days of COH vehicles were going to be in squads as-well. A old, unused tank plan from late 2004 has a squad of 3 tanks slowly move closer to the enemy, the core tank going in a straight line and the flanks trying to get around the enemy and firing into the rear. A later plan (early 2005) has the Axis stug move closer to the enemy after each shot is fired (this could have been used for the E3 demo). Maybe early COH was more like the War-Game series?

Would be interested, but extensive testing would be needed. Is there any way we can get a mod to test focused feedback on just this?

Would be interested, but extensive testing would be needed. Is there any way we can get a mod to test focused feedback on just this?

Aye, me and Mr. Smith are trying to get relic to allow squad-ai modding. Once they do, we can test and refine it during the patch beta.

I think infantry in general should try to spread out rather than clumping up.

As long as units stay in cover when ordered to take cover.

Bad news chaps. The community patch that was in the works has been called off, and talks with relic have resulted in no new modding capabilities. Thus, squad-ai is, as of writing this post, impossible to change in COH2. We might never see the day when COH2 can have complete overhauls.

Ah that's a shame.

I just did some SCAR hunting, and I found it.
"Squad_SetAttackPlan( Squad* squad, const char* planName )' Can be bound to a toggle button and used to disable the attack plan. There are also entries for the retaliation plan, reaction plan, pinned plan, etc. This is how we would create a button that disables/changes squad-ai.

You know If the Sppresion was a little different I would say yes. Regardless I think they could spice up Unit animations 4 sure and still keep them from operating like robots. Going back to CoH1 units spread themselves out like wild fire and make it hard to coordinate. While this is realistic and expected it can make for some frustrating engagements and if translated to CoH2 (which is a whole different ballgame) it simply doesn't work.

Would I like Squad AI yes, but it would need a hell of a lot of tweaking and more changes to balance in a possible future Coh

I have another question for everyone.

Should certain squads have their own unique AI, or should all squads behave the same?
Should conscripts try to spread out and slowly advance on the enemy, and should shock-troops try to get close to the enemy as quick as they can? Should Grenadiers be a balanced mix between the above mentioned?

If you don't think this would be good for multiplayer, how about single-player? Would you like to see this kind of behavior in the campaign/TOW scenarios?

(Not related to the question above, just a little bit of info):
Vehicle AI is something im very interested in. It seems during the early days of COH vehicles were going to be in squads as-well. A old, unused tank plan from late 2004 has a squad of 3 tanks slowly move closer to the enemy, the core tank going in a straight line and the flanks trying to get around the enemy and firing into the rear. A later plan (early 2005) has the Axis stug move closer to the enemy after each shot is fired (this could have been used for the E3 demo). Maybe early COH was more like the War-Game series?

I think it'd be a bit weird and possibly bad for balance if squad ai altered squads' movement and attack patterns that drastically with no possible player input. Piggybacking off that idea though, something like squad "stances" would be another way to implement a system like that if squad ai was already in the game. I was thinking something like what exists in the original Homeworld game (also like relic) where you can set ships to "neutral" "aggressive" or "evasive", where aggressive made the ships move in such a way that they would attack more efficiently but more vulnerable since they wouldn't fly evasive maneuvers as much, and evasive being the opposite (this was possible because all weapons were projectile-based IIRC). Something like "hold position" (so they don't run out of cover or close unintentionally) and then "aggressive" (what you said about shocks), "cautious" (what you said about cons) and "neutral" (grens) is what I was thinking, with maybe a single button (or maybe two) to fit it on the UI that you can cycle through for said stances, if such a thing is even codable and fits on the UI. Just some food for thought.

I just did some SCAR hunting, and I found it.
"Squad_SetAttackPlan( Squad* squad, const char* planName )' Can be bound to a toggle button and used to disable the attack plan. There are also entries for the retaliation plan, reaction plan, pinned plan, etc. This is how we would create a button that disables squad-ai.

Even having just this would be really nice, as you could maintain positions you like better and have a bit more control when you need it. I remember in coh1 when my rangers or stormtroopers would just jump around without shooting or my commandos would always try to lie down 1m away from enemy squads lol.

Good news chaps. Squad-AI has been added to the white-list, and is now modifiable. If you want to see it, check out the next version of IAC when its released (next version will be 0.07).

Edit: It seems that, while it has been white-listed (mod-builder does build the mod when squad-ai files are present), the game does not load the files. I think they only load on startup. That means, since relic isn't patching coh2 anymore, we probably wont see a fix for this. If you use the archive viewer to look at the next version of IAC, you can find the dump of AI files I've created, and if you want, use those as examples.

The only luck I've had is with DOW2, which has very advanced and modifiable squad-ai. One big new feature is that you can specify requirements for certain phases, so if the unit has a certain weapon, he will/wont move, etc. So, technically (though its not recommended as performance might suffer a bit), you could make one perfect AI file with a crap-ton of phases and requirements, and use that for every single unit in the game. A bloody programmers wet dream.

They sacrificed Squad AI because the "pro" players complained about it. They wanted COH2 to be something that is not, an e-sports game like Starcraft. And look now, where are this "pro" players? All gone.
They messed with the game and then they left.
COH2 (and COH) is a great game, and it is a great game because is not like all the other games (BS E-Sport games or what ever).

I don't like the E-Sport thing, i am not convinced that it is good for the computer gaming scene. In the contrary, i think it is not good for it.

They sacrificed Squad AI because the "pro" players complained about it. They wanted COH2 to be something that is not, an e-sports game like Starcraft. And look now, where are this "pro" players? All gone.
They messed with the game and then they left.
COH2 (and COH) is a great game, and it is a great game because is not like all the other games (BS E-Sport games or what ever).

I don't like the E-Sport thing, i am not convinced that it is good for the computer gaming scene. In the contrary, i think it is not good for it.

I doubt it had anything to do with E-sports considering units running out of cover has been a thing since the very beginning out of CoH existence which was especially prominent when you gave units attack orders. If you're targeting a heavy MG, the last thing you want is for 2-3 members to be ducking to object C when you need to kill the gun ASAP. You also had mortar bombs landing nearby, forcing members out of cover into MGs even if it did not land directly.

The only AI I would accept is slight position shifts when the squad is moving, different, alternating stances when firing, and spreading out in the open IF no attack orders are given or there is a 5-10 second delay before it activates.

I doubt it had anything to do with E-sports considering units running out of cover has been a thing since the very beginning out of CoH existence which was especially prominent when you gave units attack orders. If you're targeting a heavy MG, the last thing you want is for 2-3 members to be ducking to object C when you need to kill the gun ASAP. You also had mortar bombs landing nearby, forcing members out of cover into MGs even if it did not land directly.

The only AI I would accept is slight position shifts when the squad is moving, different, alternating stances when firing, and spreading out in the open IF no attack orders are given or there is a 5-10 second delay before it activates.

All of this would be perfectly possible with a little bit of scar scripting (as mentioned in a previous post).

I always thought it was kinda neat, made it feel a little more real. It could be a little annoying yeah, but it never seemed game breaking to me. (In COH)

As for COH2, I never got to experience the game at launch, so I've no idea how it was.

I do miss my unkillable Airborne though. They would dive avoid just about everything they got thrown at'em.