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FBP V1.1 UPDATE

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1 Aug 2017, 06:17 AM
#161
avatar of buttcheeksontoast

Posts: 59





If you want to play with cons in current patch, try Soviet reserve army doctrine.

In early game go the usual penal (+1 sniper) build and rush t70. You don't have to worry about early luchs/222 because of the dank hunters :megusta:

Later on you will use massed conscription ability to get 2 or 4 free cons (MP wise) upgrade them with ppsh and start rolling. They vet surprisingly fast if you engage and harm few vet 3 (5) squads in the late game.

Instead of sherman spam you have much sooner and much cheaper t34 spam.

Definitely this doctrine is worth to give it a shot.

Also ml20 can break digged OKW players defences like flakHQ


What exactly is the usual penal build right now? I've been doing engineer goes to cap while second engineer in queue, second engie builds t1 and you have 300mp right as t1 finishes so you build penal, then another penal, then medic. Then t3->Suchka if you are behind on fuel and expecting medium armor. Where does sniper fit in?

Also does a t1 build differ for teamgames?
9 Aug 2017, 09:04 AM
#162
avatar of Kurfürst

Posts: 144



Forget about all other changes, and all other arguments and reasons made, this has been the goal from the start. All those replays, all that feedback, all those discussions aren't going to change this. There is absolutely nothing that is going to change this opinion/reality/choice/wtf.

I'm willing to bet at this point that if Elefants and JTs damage isn't dropped to 280 from 320, the answer will to give Jacksons 660 health. Probably in spite of any debate, input, or questions.

Everything you describe as to what a Jackson 'needs' to be can be accomplished through increasing its close range penetration so that it can reliably penetrate heavy tanks and giving it the 560 health shared by the M10. It can then close, it can deal damage.

Reducing its max range accuracy could be an option too, but not its penetration necessarily.

Increasing the Jackson's health to 560, not 600, means that the vehicle has durability from everything that isn't an Elefant. It's probably not going to get through, but I'd hope you can understand that the StuG and especially Elefant are effective crutches for Ostheer at this point. Try to think of them not as 'killing Jacksons in 2 shots' as they are 'reducing the amount of shots to kill enemy tanks by one'. Have you ever considered that Elefants being so common is a symptom of a greater issue with Ostheer? (That perhaps any amount of changes to the Jackson won't solve?)

In team games, there are rarely more than one or two panthers fielded at any given time. Anything more or less is cost-prohibitive and inefficient. There are, however, often two to three Jacksons per USF player in my experiences. And I'm not even mentioning pop cap.

But the most important question to me is: "Where is the Sherman's role supposed to fit into this equation with this idea of the Jackson?"


+1 to this. Its a perfect summary.

IF (and that is a big if) the Jackson wants to keep its buff to 600+ HP, it has to give in something in return.

All the other TDs that have 640 are seriously vulnerable in one or multiple ways, i.e. being able to be flanked, too slow, too low in range, too little armor.

The Jackson currently is on the only one with 60 range, 200/200+ damage, high moving accuracy, being turreted and fairly immunune to flanking, is fine in live as it is as a glass cannon.

If you want to give it survivability i.e. more hitpoints, something gotta give. Its either range and mobility or more hp and retaining mobility.
9 Aug 2017, 09:21 AM
#163
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066

Yeah the Jackson completely bullies the Stug. The stug is Ostheer´s crutch in every single game.

As to ZombiFrancis +1
9 Aug 2017, 09:43 AM
#165
avatar of JohnSmith

Posts: 1273

There's a newer version of this thread
https://www.coh2.org/topic/62683/fbp-update-v1-2

I reported the post to get a moderator's attention to help : It's weird to have two FBP threads.
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