Lend Lease is completely broken

What about removing the conscript repair ability and replace it with "hit the dirt" or "rapid conscription"? That way you have to build more than one engineer (which removes the abundance of merge from conscripts). Russian conscripts repairing american made tanks sounds kind of um, uh... "romantic". Having three or four Sherman's out on the field without enough engineers to repair them would be a big problem that the player would have to deal with (and the opponent to seize on) during the match. I believe changing this one ability will fix the balance of this commander WITHOUT nerfing or removing its core strategy/idea. Thoughts?

Repairs are not a problem. If you saw Hector's "New Soviet Meta Analysis" players start by building 3 Combat Engineers (one to build Tier 1 to build Penals, the other two to cap and take control of vital garrisons).

If you replace this ability with Hit the Dirt, it would be even more useless. On the other hand. if you replaced this ability with Rapid Conscription, this commander would become truly overpowered. Lose Penal models during engagements for free Conscripts, which you can use to Merge, thus saving Manpower when reinforcing your units. With extra MP you can build Caches to get out even more M4Cs (and perhaps an extra few Combat Engineers).

In my opinion, this commander in the same place that Guard Motor was last meta. "Very strong". Not broken, just the new "cheese".

Personally I'd like to see a ballsy overhaul of all factions that gives each faction 6 commanders, each with 6 abilities, balanced in a way that they are all viable for 90% of the playerbase.

first things first remove insta pin

No. Please. Stop this madness.

A DshK is a 12.7 mm machine gun. It should suppress and do a ton of damage. Do not nerf it. Add a CP or something, but ffs, a vickers or an mg42 shouldn't have shit on a DshK or an M2.

Force teching for the m4c. Fix the call in meta. That's it.

Someone made a mod (probably miragefla) where units were cheaper when relevant tech buildings were built but the option to call in units without tech remained an option albeit an expensive one.

Dshk should be good, but not so good that tech can be skipped.

Personally i don't think the commander is batshit broken or even moderately op, but it is very easy to use and the fact that i see it often is becoming tedious.

I also have not played someone of my ability or better who has used this strat so my views are somewhat flawed.

m4c are have too good ai too.....

also those saying dshuka should be nerfed because of real life reasons then same could be said for axis stuff which you bunch dont seem to care about

Another useless thread, let me guess u cant counter it so u are crying here and calling this doctrine OP, although it didn't change form its realise. Tell me pls what should soviets go then which tactic, the one with being cannon fooder to OKW (Cons spam) or the maxim that cant suppres a unit in yellow cover.

Another useless thread, let me guess u cant counter it so u are crying here and calling this doctrine OP, although it didn't change form its realise. Tell me pls what should soviets go then which tactic, the one with being cannon fooder to OKW (Cons spam) or the maxim that cant suppres a unit in yellow cover.

Another useless respond

Another useless respond

Nop, its yours. I asked u a question and u didnt answer it. So next time read it wont hurt.

Another useless thread, let me guess u cant counter it so u are crying here and calling this doctrine OP, although it didn't change form its realise. Tell me pls what should soviets go then which tactic, the one with being cannon fooder to OKW (Cons spam) or the maxim that cant suppres a unit in yellow cover.

This has been the case for the last two tourneys, any popular commander and it becomes a snowball effect then it becomes nerf, such as command panther, that doc/unit virtually hasn't changed since release,

it was used to counter massive Cromwell/comet spam the tourneys, then it's suddenly OP and then a nerf was introduced. When in Jan.feb. the unit was fine..

Not to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but whatever pro is using a commander in a tourney, seems to start a snow ball effect until the commander is seen every game..

Another way of looking at it is if every time a commander is deemed useful and thus gets nerfed , slowly all the never used commanders will become equally valid and come into play!

Seriously though perhaps the reinforce cost should be changed so opponents get a little bit of reward for damaging it

This has been the case for the last two tourneys, any popular commander and it becomes a snowball effect then it becomes nerf, such as command panther, that doc/unit virtually hasn't changed since release,

it was used to counter massive Cromwell/comet spam the tourneys, then it's suddenly OP and then a nerf was introduced. When in Jan.feb. the unit was fine..

Not to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but whatever pro is using a commander in a tourney, seems to start a snow ball effect until the commander is seen every game..

"Pro" knows what OP/broken things haven't been touched/affected by the nerf bats. If my options are broken OP and just OP thing, i'll go for option 1 with option 2 as variety. If option 1 is no longer available, then option 2 proceeds to be the old option 1.

There's also the fact that if you nerf everything around a certain unit, then it doesn't matter that you didn't touch that unit. Ex: nerfing most OP allies infantry made Volks STG outperform.

I'll give you an example of things which haven't been changed and can deem OP (things that mostly go under radar):

OKW: Kubel vet 1 maphack (compared to OH/SU same ability which cost munitions). Stuka Zu fuss vet4 incendiary barrage not sharing cd with main barrage. Passive suppression on Obers. Infiltration volley grenade munition cost. IR STG ignoring cover/long range dps (if we actually make AR, such as BARS, not perform as well at long). Vet5 400dmg JPIV. ST criticals.

SU: Clowncar. Wombo demo + explosive combo. Rapid conscription (if cons are made actually good). Propaganda on paks (it's always funny to see them retreat). FHQ cheese. Radio intercept (IIRC it bugged again telling you mine location). Single strafe run (if they fixed tracking).

UK: Valentine crush, Stand fast. Hard to mention "under the radar" when most things are brought up in general. Maybe Air superiority (teamgames against OKW) / strafing support ? Precision/Concentrated barrage (the better brother of Railway/RNG Armor offmap)

OH: sniper 1000% acc shot, single AT strafe. To be fair with Rapid cons, Relief infantry. Sprint (i mean, we always complained about SU snipers having it). Command PIV for teamgames(damage increase or dmg mitigation is always gonna remain strong).

USF: vet 2 Pack Howie, Pathfinders relay antennas (also effectiveness when used with BARs), RET rifle grenade cheese (has this been fixed?), Doge woof woof Jeep

Then we have things which are gonna be eternal hit or miss, specially for teamgames: Howitzers.

Nop, its yours. I asked u a question and u didnt answer it. So next time read it wont hurt.

If you actually read my other posts in this thread you would have read my suggestions for fixing it. So next time, read it, it won´t hurt

"Pro" knows what OP/broken things haven't been touched/affected by the nerf bats. If my options are broken OP and just OP thing, i'll go for option 1 with option 2 as variety. If option 1 is no longer available, then option 2 proceeds to be the old option 1.

There's also the fact that if you nerf everything around a certain unit, then it doesn't matter that you didn't touch that unit. Ex: nerfing most OP allies infantry made Volks STG outperform.

I'll give you an example of things which haven't been changed and can deem OP (things that mostly go under radar):

OKW: Kubel vet 1 maphack (compared to OH/SU same ability which cost munitions). Stuka Zu fuss vet4 incendiary barrage not sharing cd with main barrage. Passive suppression on Obers. Infiltration volley grenade munition cost. IR STG ignoring cover/long range dps (if we actually make AR, such as BARS, not perform as well at long). Vet5 400dmg JPIV. ST criticals.

SU: Clowncar. Wombo demo + explosive combo. Rapid conscription (if cons are made actually good). Propaganda on paks (it's always funny to see them retreat). FHQ cheese. Radio intercept (IIRC it bugged again telling you mine location). Single strafe run (if they fixed tracking).

UK: Valentine crush, Stand fast. Hard to mention "under the radar" when most things are brought up in general. Maybe Air superiority (teamgames against OKW) / strafing support ? Precision/Concentrated barrage (the better brother of Railway/RNG Armor offmap)

OH: sniper 1000% acc shot, single AT strafe. To be fair with Rapid cons, Relief infantry. Sprint (i mean, we always complained about SU snipers having it). Command PIV for teamgames(damage increase or dmg mitigation is always gonna remain strong).

USF: vet 2 Pack Howie, Pathfinders relay antennas (also effectiveness when used with BARs), RET rifle grenade cheese (has this been fixed?), Doge woof woof Jeep

Then we have things which are gonna be eternal hit or miss, specially for teamgames: Howitzers.

OKW : kubel is not an easy unit to keep alive unlike oh/su counterpart,stuka zu fuss incy barrage it cost munition..?? thats why,why the heck are obers being considered op they are infact known to be up if suppression gets removed then it should replaced with faster fire rate and the damage after the third nerf return(if you don't believe just do some testing against vet 3 tommies 5 men with double bren vs vet 3 obers or vet 5 however you like same with double bar vet 3 rifles),agreed with volley grenades,stgs only ignore the recieved accuracy modifier the -50% damage is still there also stgs are worse than lmgs fyi first time seeing someone complain about stgs,jp4 crit yes because its vet 4 and it doesn't fires as fast as su-85 or firefly

SU : clowncar should just be delayed in production time thats about it,demo everyone agrees,rapid conscript is fine again very random thing to complain about,paks one agreed with,fhq need changing not nerf,radio intercept is a bug,strafe in fine.

UK : actually l agreed with all but you are bringing many other op stabilizes brits have like command vehicle unlimited spy plane,much better abilities compared to similar abilities in other faction like raid..etc,better salavage,more abilites and offmap in single doctrine compared to other factions..

oh : again nothing wrong with it sniper are already rare sight as it is now after the nerfs ,command p4 is fine nobody ever complains about it because the unit itself sucks for what you pay and its the whole purpose of aura

usf : vet 2 pack howie if you want to nerf it then you have to nerf mortars,isg..etc too,again like wtf nobody even uses pathfinder but lets nerf them mor....

the thing is you are just comparing abilities to abilities but are not taking them in consideration with the context and synergy of the faction and units

PPL still complain about soviet that have been one again nerfed? LOL

Honestly, i think that if the Soviets get nerfed without any realistic good/viable compensations, it's gonna be their death sentence this time.

PPL still complain about soviet that have been one again nerfed? LOL

Yep, but like others, I complain about the soviet core sucking too and soviets crutching on overperforming units and doctrines.

If you actually read my other posts in this thread you would have read my suggestions for fixing it. So next time, read it, it won´t hurt

Wow boy, I didnt see anything suggesting to fix this "problem". But I see that u are crying the nile river so let me suggest. Planes that drop fuel shouldn't be shot down, guards comming from M5 need to have some kind of AT since it is called Lend Lease give them 1 or 2 bazookas.DShK is an heavy MG it has 12.7 mm cartridge, its obvious that it ll suppres and kill models fast. M4C shermans prehapse need to be like T34-85. You need to build them from t4. Lets be honest soviet t4 is pretty shit, only kata is a good. Su85 is very powerfull but without a turret it kinda melts its advantage. T34 no words its good for its price but i wish it was expensive but effective. Soo here u have an suggestion. I hope this will prevent you from crying and giving answers to my question that I asked you.

I just think that people just want to finish off the Soviets, if there is anything viable - immediately kill it

you guys cry about everything, but never think things trough.

Sure dshka is very strong, but if you lose it, you are screwed. Same thing with paks, lose one or two and your late game armor is in trouble.

And sherman is not that good, if you don't make the first one do some damage you will be in trouble.

In the end it is a big gamble and easily countered by going defensive since most players won't get a katyusha to clear the defenses.

blabla

Let's see what I said hmm:

Dhsk is batshit op and you know it. Maxim sucks and I know it. The reliance of soviet players upon overperforming crutches is a known fact and shows the pathetic state of the soviet core.

Soviets need a rework badly:

Cons need to be better and worth it in the late game

Penals need to be balanced and not easy mode everything early game with high ai dps, ptrs light vehicle deterrants and sticky satchels (the most idiotic idea of the entire patch)

The maxim doesn't need te be a worse mg34

Guards shouldn't be 360 mp for their current price

The SU76 should't be as cost effective as it is now and the SU85 should be the superior vehicle

The Zis gun needs to be slightly better vs heavies

The molotov and at nade upgrades should be one upgrade

And in another post I said that all call ins need to be tied to tech, for every faction.

Yes all of it, every single one of them. All call ins for each faction tied to tech.

snip

Since a year ago, the game has started to normalise over the top abilities so those that are fair have a chance to appear.
The point is not to talk about raw performance of abilities/units ON THE CURRENT META, just that once things that are "oppressive" or underperforming atm are adjusted, some of the things i mentioned are gonna be brought up.
OKW
1-Kubel IS a easy unit to keep alive, specially once you get the maphack on toggle ability. I preferred the changes on WBP but it was "out of scope".
2-So, all the other barrages abilities which cost munitions shouldn't be tied to cooldown? Something to remember for future reference: The fact that is locked down behind too many levels of vet doesn't mean it's well designed nor not OP. Vet should be attainable (a long game) not something you see once in a lifetime.
3-Obers arrive too late. UP till vet 2, OP from vet2 onwards. Not worth the risk when you have STG Volks.
4-STG IR should be AR and have it's damage profile adjusted (that's why i also mentioned BARs at the same time). The ignore acc cover is a gimmicky. Light cover is basically negated. But that's not the problem: IMO ARs performance at long range (which is basically max range) should be toned down across the board and other aspects adjusted accordingly if necessary.
5-JPIV as pointed on point 2. For first shot fired out of camouflage +150% damage & +150% accuracy & +150% penetration, that's stupid design. Keep the acc/pen, damage modifiers are always gonna be a headache to balance.

SU
6-The clowncar part was more in light of how it was brought back to meta, while basically no changes had been done on the unit. If you delayed it, it's just gonna be useless since it's effective time is when there is no 222 or OKW has no snare. The only danger is the flamer, which means it has at most a 1 min window to operate. The clowncar concept is always gonna be BS (roos remember)
7-Rapid cons is really good value and is the perfect example of something which can be problematic if somehow cons are viable and most of the cheese in the game is adjusted.
8-FHQ is a one trick pony on specific maps and modes.
9-Single strafe is good, but as i pointed +2 years ago, has huge issues with tracking. Single strafe problems comes from been useless at targeting things on the middle of the map (specially big ones) but uncounterable on the sides of it.

UKF
10-Unlimited scout plane is bad designed but i forgot to brought it cause it renders combat useless a specific unit (you are basically forced to AEC or maybe defensive Centaur).
11-Raid would be OP if it was on another faction. I guess you consider OP that vehicles can cap, but the rate is actually inferior to other abilities. Counter attack and Breakthrough are 200% capture while raid is 100%. The OH capture vehicles abilities also give it pseudo blitz (+25% speed) and is part of the wonky wombo combo commander.
12-UKF is basically mostly offmap abilities due to initial design. Little variety of fuel/mp abilities. They have a lot of crap mixed as well on top of not been able to be used properly on teamgames due to captured/own territory mechanics.
13-PD: the salvaged was toned down IIRC.

OH:
14-I'll rather have it be a reliable stun and counter snipe SU ability than been the secured retreat squad killer.
15-Balanced on 1v1 and starts to get stupid on teamgames (unit volume).

USF:
16-The barrage is godly but it only fires 3 shells. As i said on the opening line, this is about things people might not know and should be taken into account when proper buffs are applied. The unit needs buff/tweaks.
17-Pathfinders, same as before. From what i remember, you don't have to build them (they set automatically) and provides vision and reinforce. The only things that irks me is the cooldown and automatic setup.

the thing is you are just comparing abilities to abilities but are not taking them in consideration with the context and synergy of the faction and units

On the contrary, i do take them into account. I think you should read the context on the comment i was replying to. https://www.coh2.org/topic/61376/lend-lease-is-completely-broken/page/3#post_id611149

I'm not saying to adjust/nerf the things i mentioned before, but i gave examples of things that can gain light on the broad public once other things or the units/abilities/commanders which are related to them are touched.

OP complaining about Lend Lease now just shows how much other cheese overshadowed the current one. LL saw play before and was already strong.
Another example: say, you nerf Lend Lease, SU receives buff on other aspects (say conscripts) and suddenly people are going to complain about Advance Warfare.