German Sniper should be cheaper

Well, the title says it all. I´d like to suggest a cost decrease to the German sniper, so we could see some more usage of him. The reasons why I think a cost decrease to 300MP is justified are the following:

1) He is fragile/ one man
2) He is generally less effective than the soviet sniper team, because of 6 men squads and weapon crews/ also because of the higher average reinforcement cost of German infantry at the HQ
3) In CoH1 the sniper already costed 360MP and it was balanced. However units in CoH2 cost generally less MP than in the original CoH - except for the sniper (CoH1: Volks 280, Grens 300, Mortar 270, MG 250MP ---- CoH2 Grens 240, Mortar 240, MG 240MP)

A price decrease to about 300MP would seem appropriate.

Opinions?

sniper in coh1 costs 340mp.

the whole
weaponcrew-infantry-sniper system doesnt work well. But hey we only know that for over 6 months now, give relic another 6 months or so to think about it.

The German sniper in general is way too inferior to its counter-part. The worst part is that for some reason, it takes a TON of damage from a volley by infantry. One full volley from even a engi squad can kill it before you can even react.

The German sniper in general is way too inferior to its counter-part. The worst part is that for some reason, it takes a TON of damage from a volley by infantry. One full volley from even a engi squad can kill it before you can even react.

Yeah, I thought he was supposed to have decent armor being only one man, but a few rifle rounds at long range take off 50% of his HP.

That said, if armor works as a percentage chance for damage to be avoided entirely, it's actually not so useful for fixing the German Sniper. The problem is a lack of response time before he dies, meaning drastic health drops are bad. Ideally, he'd have more HP such that a player would have sufficient time to react when he starts taking damage. This is effectively what Soviet Snipers have due to the two man squad.

The entire counter-sniping situation is screwed at the moment because the Soviets can always retreat after one Sniper squad member dies while there's no such safety net for the Germans.

The German sniper in general is way too inferior to its counter-part. The worst part is that for some reason, it takes a TON of damage from a volley by infantry. One full volley from even a engi squad can kill it before you can even react.

If an Engi squad is getting that close, it deserves to be punished.

Don't decrease price, it would encourage spamming. I would be open to the idea of higher armour however to increase survivability.

I think it is fine as is but at the same time I wouldn't mind if it got a price reduction because atm it means sacrificing a gren, mortar, mg or time to get one all of which are generally more useful.

The German sniper has a faster fire rate than the Soviet sniper. It has an even faster fire rate with vet. It also camos much faster than the Soviet Sniper

The thing you do with a sniper (especially with the current map choices) is you keep it in the back while your Grenadiers screen for your sniper. You can keep on racking up kills that way.

Pretty much, if you don't end up losing your sniper to indirect fire or countersnipers or vehicles, you're doing it wrong.

I dont think relic intended to implement a counter snipe mechanic. I suggest to increase the effectiveness of scout cars vs snipers (and prioritize them as targets) as a proper counter instead of relying on ostheer snipers.

He has decent armor, 2 to be precisly.
But he also has 40hp only (infantry has 80hp in general).

You might be mistaken in thinking armor directly "reduces" damage. armor reduces the chance that a bullet penetrates a target and damages it. This means if a bullet is fired on a sniper it has 1/2 to do full damage or deal no damage at all.

So the sniper is pretty good at avoding small arms damage, but when hit and damaged even by a single bullet of a nosin nagant he loses 40% of his health.

And yes I also think the german sniper is way to expensive.

Regards
ace

I dont think relic intended to implement a counter snipe mechanic. I suggest to increase the effectiveness of scout cars vs snipers (and prioritize them as targets) as a proper counter instead of relying on ostheer snipers.

Well, the problem is the Soviet Sniper is a good counter to the German Sniper, but the same doesn't work in reverse.

Well, the problem is the Soviet Sniper is a good counter to the German Sniper, but the same doesn't work in reverse.

If the soviet sniper gets countersniped first, if the Soviet doesn't react, then the German will kill both men in the squad.

If the soviet sniper gets countersniped first, if the Soviet doesn't react, then the German will kill both men in the squad.

You do realize the flaw in that statement I hope?

If an Engi squad is getting that close, it deserves to be punished.

Don't decrease price, it would encourage spamming. I would be open to the idea of higher armour however to increase survivability.

What situation right now would you even envision using a German sniper in? PS I need to see high level replay proof that they are viable. They just aren't good for anything at that price (almost like the panther or tiger).

The sprint ability on the soviet is so ridiculous.. I wish the German sniper had that.

You do realize the flaw in that statement I hope?

Said it badly, but you get what I mean.

If the soviet sniper team does not retreat and the German gets the first shot, the German sniper will get the 2nd shot before the Soviet sniper gets the first shot.

only in green cover,yellow cover will allow the soviet sniper team enough time to counter snipe.

You can use the doctrinal sprint ability on German snipers to great effect, its a tad expensive but if i wanted to save a sniper but not retreat him, i'd pop it.

"tactical movement speed" or whatever its called needs to be CP 1 though. c'mon. Its rarely even used.

This remains one of the glaringly obvious imbalances of the game. Still. After all this time.

The German sniper needs a cost reduction and should 'cook' faster (spawn faster).

Better accuracy wouldn't hurt, like, 100%. Every shot should kill, even retreating units. If Soviet snipers are still allowed to clown-car around sniping with accuracy then my one single sniper should have his shots connect every single time, all the time, no matter the conditions.

Failing those things, the German Sniper really needs something else. Perhaps a rate-of-fire bonus to German snipers that are in green cover. Something. Anything to make it more viable. As it stands the game is too heavily tilted against using him. Soviet infantry run so fast, a Soviet player closes the distance to him after the first shot always forcing a retreat.

German snipers can't kite Soviet infantry like Soviet snipers can kite German infantry. Rifle grenades work only if your opponent is dumb-as-rocks enough not to move his unit two paces. Not to mention the largest Soviet advantage being its squad size, it takes far far less time for a Soviet sniper to make a german squad combat ineffective than a German sniper to do the same to a Soviet squad. No one ever talks about that. The supposed rate-of-fire increase of German over Soviet sniper does not make up for this. It needs something else.

Give him 80 health so indirect fire and near misses from a vehicle are less likely to one-shot him, reduce cost by 40-60 and see if he gets some use, I suggest. I quite like getting one or even two on Pripyat Winter, just because of the massive fire lanes around the VPs and the propensity for maxim-spamming on that map. Normally when I see a German sniper from an opponent I feel basically relieved.

The sniper is still useful, especially in team games and especially with the vet 1 ability.

I'm worried any buff to him will result in the sniper heavy games we saw at the end of the CoH meta.