Predicting/Discussing the Veterancy Fix

I'm ready for it.

I'm ready for it.

Haha, waiting for the Joker hit too.

I run tests with basic infantry units and the winner wwas the same , with or without vet. Only thinks that make it ridiculos with vet vere lmgs because of acc bonus. Otherwise I think it will be fine

The only faction I'm worried about is OKW. The other faction's infantry hasn't really changed much since the bug started, but the bug happened when the OKW overhaul was taking place.
They recieved a lot of buffs that might not seem as powerful because of the missing vet. Especially since they lost the most because of their 5 vet levels and most their infantry doesn't rely on AI upgrades. I wouldn't be surprised if they are a lot stronger then they currently are.

+1

"This was a very important piece of information as it meant the Vet/Reinforce Bug has actually been in the game since CoH2's launch"

Nope it is CoH2's launch

edited: Since I sounded like a (bigger) grade A twat

The flaw in the game engine has been hidden since launch. The veterancy not working has been since at least 4/5 months ago. There's a difference. We had other veterancy/ability related bugs, specially with support weapons, but "basic" vet worked.

I don't understand all the hate for okw vet 5. Their vet 3 buffs are lower than other factions and so it's not like it sounds at vet 5. Plus because there are 5 levels instead of 3, it's harder to get to max vet for most of the squads. Then I also can't understand people negging on the obers or panzerfusiliers for some special abilities they get with high vet, like sprint and suppression. It's ok for shocks to have special characteristics from vet 0 (only squad with armor) and all sov infantry to have sprint from vet 0 (granted as a paid ability), or even rear echelons at 200mp are allowed suppression at vet 0 no questions asked, but if okw have unique features at vet 4/5 it's all op?

+1



The flaw in the game engine has been hidden since launch. The veterancy not working has been since at least 4/5 months ago. There's a difference. We had other veterancy/ability related bugs, specially with support weapons, but "basic" vet worked.

Wot? The flaw IS the veterancy bug right? So if it's been in the game since launch, how has veterancy only broken 5 months ago?

The only faction I'm worried about is OKW. The other faction's infantry hasn't really changed much since the bug started, but the bug happened when the OKW overhaul was taking place.
They recieved a lot of buffs that might not seem as powerful because of the missing vet. Especially since they lost the most because of their 5 vet levels and most their infantry doesn't rely on AI upgrades. I wouldn't be surprised if they are a lot stronger then they currently are.

Yea, depending on how powerful the OKW's veterancy actually is, I would either leave it (If it's just fine), or give them back a resource penalty (If too powerful), which would reduce the amount of max vet squads by a fair amount, without limiting their unit's amazing late-game capabilities.

Wot? The flaw IS the veterancy bug right? So if it's been in the game since launch, how has veterancy only broken 5 months ago?

What Elchino7 probably means that before the veterancy bug, we've had stacking-related bugs (merge, vehicle crews etc). Those bugs probably didn't matter much until WFA with its fancy features were released.

Then, people started noticing the Captain-on-me bugs and other nice abusable things. Relic had to react and I guess they accidentally broke offensive veterancy when fixing stacking bugs (according to Cruzz).

I'm guessing that now that they've had the time to properly inspect their code, they figured that it is impossible to fix veterancy issues (with a mod-based fix) without affecting stacking issues and vice versa. Hopefully, now that they've had their time, they can thoroughly address both issues at once.

Thus, the game was always bugged in one way or the other (either stacking issues or veterancy). This doesn't mean that Veterancy was always broken. However, Veterancy has definitely been broken for 4 months now.

Wot? The flaw IS the veterancy bug right? So if it's been in the game since launch, how has veterancy only broken 5 months ago?

If I remember correctly, before veterancy buffs used to apply to the weapon or to the whole squad. After Brits released they changed it so that it only applies to the model in order to fix the stacking bug getting duplicated when the buff is applied to the weapon. This is also why only offensive bonuses were broken, because received accuracy and new abilities were applied to the whole squad, not the models. The bug is that when it is applied to the model they lose it when they die, and that has been in the game since release, but nothing ever used it before. So the vet bug has been in since release, but nothing ever used it until now.

If I remember correctly, before veterancy buffs used to apply to the weapon or to the whole squad. After Brits released they changed it so that it only applies to the model in order to fix the stacking bug getting duplicated when the buff is applied to the weapon. This is also why only offensive bonuses were broken, because received accuracy and new abilities were applied to the whole squad, not the models. The bug is that when it is applied to the model they lose it when they die, and that has been in the game since release, but nothing ever used it before. So the vet bug has been in since release, but nothing ever used it until now.

Oooooh. That made perfect sense. Thanks mate.

What Elchino7 probably means that before the veterancy bug, we've had stacking-related bugs (merge, vehicle crews etc). Those bugs probably didn't matter much until WFA with its fancy features were released.

Then, people started noticing the Captain-on-me bugs and other nice abusable things. Relic had to react and I guess they accidentally broke offensive veterancy when fixing stacking bugs (according to Cruzz).

I'm guessing that now that they've had the time to properly inspect their code, they figured that it is impossible to fix veterancy issues (with a mod-based fix) without affecting stacking issues and vice versa. Hopefully, now that they've had their time, they can thoroughly address both issues at once.

Thus, the game was always bugged in one way or the other (either stacking issues or veterancy). This doesn't mean that Veterancy was always broken. However, Veterancy has definitely been broken for 4 months now.

Exactly. Prior to WFA, we had support weapons themselves inherits the veterancy buffs and not the crew itself. This lead to decrew weapon inheriting the buffs from veterancy/abilities. This was brought to "light" when people started to abuse FHQ damage aura buff to insta kill tanks with AT guns.

I don't understand all the hate for okw vet 5. Their vet 3 buffs are lower than other factions and so it's not like it sounds at vet 5. Plus because there are 5 levels instead of 3, it's harder to get to max vet for most of the squads. Then I also can't understand people negging on the obers or panzerfusiliers for some special abilities they get with high vet, like sprint and suppression. It's ok for shocks to have special characteristics from vet 0 (only squad with armor) and all sov infantry to have sprint from vet 0 (granted as a paid ability), or even rear echelons at 200mp are allowed suppression at vet 0 no questions asked, but if okw have unique features at vet 4/5 it's all op?

If you are gonna present some facts to help prove your point, try a bit more next time.

Shocktroops retain their armor, cause they had armor IRL. Armor or size functions equally, in fact, size is actually better as weapons with penetration negates armor.

Sprint is only on vet0 for Cons. I'm sure people would gladly trade hoorah for weapons or free upgrades with teching or bunkers. Penals get it with vet and they are still unseen, sprint for maxims are useful but i'll gladly have incendiary rounds and teleporting weapon to the rest of the crew on retreat.

RE volley fire is bad since the nerf after release of WFA. The recent ninja nerf (cost) made it worst than before.

Regarding OKW, the issues are that the changes made to remove income penalties were half baked and the results were analyzed having broken offensive vet.
-Ober passive suppression. Just make it a timed ability. Sprint out of combat is fine for Ober, PF. It was a problem before, it will be a problem now. It's equally stupid as defensive stance.
-Volks. They were buff without taking into account vet (mostly all other infantry matchs remain the same) as they can reliably hit vet5 by upgrading to schrecks. People will complain about sniping schrecks again.

The other problem i'm foreseeing is Royal Engineers and probably the anvil upgrade.

Facts;


- Vet 3 tommies beat Vet5 volks and vet3 grens. with upgrades they wreck anything that isn't krupp stahl.


- Vet 3 USF RM are extremely hard to bleed and can bleed their opponent quite well. With m1919 they wreck anything that isn't krupp stahl.


- Volks, vet0 or vet5 will remain a stylish looking version of ostruppen with shrecks.

Volks, vet0 or vet5 will remain a stylish looking version of ostruppen with shrecks.

The moment you realize Ostruppen are better than grens. So not sure if you are saying they are good or bad

The moment you realize Ostruppen are better than grens. So not sure if you are saying they are good or bad

Nice one