[Relic][3v3+] Some Love When?
Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2
I can help but notice various improvements on maps like Langraskya, Kholodny, Kharkov, Minsk and I am pretty sure I am missing more. I also cannot help but notice some serious attention to balance issues that afflict anything but 3v3+.
With ESL 1v1 tourney bestowed upon us, my question is this:
When can 3v3+ players expect some love? no map fixes, which is unbelievably easy to implement is nowhere to be seen and obviously other glaring issues.
When should I start to expect something from you Relic in regards to 3v3+?
Posts: 1166 | Subs: 1
I mainly play 3v3+ with 2v2 trailing closely behind. I don't play 1v1. I also enjoy watching casts and because most casts are 1v1, I mainly watch 1v1 casts.
I can help but notice various improvements on maps like Langraskya, Kholodny, Kharkov, Minsk and I am pretty sure I am missing more. I also cannot help but notice some serious attention to balance issues that afflict anything but 3v3+.
With ESL 1v1 tourney bestowed upon us, my question is this:
When can 3v3+ players expect some love? no map fixes, which is unbelievably easy to implement is nowhere to be seen and obviously other glaring issues.
When should I start to expect something from you Relic in regards to 3v3+?
Solutions:
Obviously, balance in 1v1 has become very good and we don't want to disturb it, so how can we tweak the balance in 3s/4s without disrupting 1v1/2v2? Scaling Income Nerfs.
Whether we incorporate 2v2 in this is another discussion but the general plan would be to have scaled income nerf for larger game sizes. Example for 3v3, OKW could receive a 10% income nerf, for 4v4 OKW could receive a 15%. These numbers are examples and testing would clearly have to be done.
MAPS: Maps that work for 4s typically don't work for 3s and vice versa. RBE is a 3v3 map - when played as 4s it becomes too crowded. City 17 works fine for 4s but when playing 3s it becomes awkward and unrewarding - it also creates unfair matchups due to random position starting positions (2v1 or 1v2 per side). Solution would be to create maps designed for 6 players, not 6-8.
Posts: 2070
Posts: 1276
Posts: 1605 | Subs: 1
Posts: 1122
how can we tweak the balance in 3s/4s without disrupting 1v1/2v2?
By buffing British, which is up in 1v1 as well back and nerfing stupidly op rocket arty, which destroys infantry play.
Scaling income is just BS.
Posts: 752
Posts: 640
4v4 and 3v3 randoms is nonsense...
but
4v4 and 3v3 AT have a lot of potential. You cant just win doing your own thing... the whole team needs to synergize well to achieve a victory. Coordination and communication is very important...
The sad thing is there arent that much good active teams playing and the matchmaking is really bad. 90% the time you will stomp enemies which are 5000 ranks below you but when you finally face a good team (there are some around) it will be a feast of teamwork - which can be very entertaining.
The problem is coh2 is supporting blobs... so blobbing is probably the most seen thing in 4v4s due to lack of coordination - "because its easier".
I would really like to see Relic putting some love in larger teamgames.
Especially 3v3s maps are the worst (some 4v4s maps could also use some love)... more cut-offs, more flanks,...
Posts: 1124
Posts: 1708 | Subs: 2
Currently each point gives the same amount of resources as 1v1 and the amount of points to cap for a team game map is the same.
With more players the map can be capped a lot faster, leading to higher income in the early game in team games than in 1v1s.
What would help if the resources gained from each point was lowered in team games but also increase the amount of capture zones.
Then they could look at map flow, i.e. how easy is it to execute flanks, too many choke points, vehicle pathing etc.
Posts: 2561
Maps, scaling, and all that other bullshit every other poster is talking about is miniscule when you consider the effects of caches.
Teamgames will never be balanced as long as players are receiving constant resource increases from a single players small investment.
Posts: 747 | Subs: 2
Caches. Main problem of all teamgames.
Maps, scaling, and all that other bullshit every other poster is talking about is miniscule when you consider the effects of caches.
Teamgames will never be balanced as long as players are receiving constant resource increases from a single players small investment.
How does increased resource income for both sides cause the "Main problem of all teamgames". What problem exactly are you refering to?
Posts: 640
How does increased resource income for both sides cause the "Main problem of all teamgames". What problem exactly are you refering to?
I think he is referring to the axis tank advantage caused by fuel caches.
Posts: 747 | Subs: 2
I think he is referring to the axis tank advantage caused by fuel caches.
The axis tank advantage has it's roots in the lack of flanking abilites and many players being jammed together/fighting over a few points. It favors frontal engagements which the axis are best in, thanks to superior long range units, MG42 and high frontal armor.
Posts: 161
The axis tank advantage has it's roots in the lack of flanking abilites and many players being jammed together/fighting over a few points. It favors frontal engagements which the axis are best in, thanks to superior long range units, MG42 and high frontal armor.
hush dont let them touch my skillwerfer as-well
Posts: 102
Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2
Posts: 879
That's why it's referred to as casual mode. Lots of fighting very quickly over very few precious resource points, which usually results in a victory for the faction with the strongest late game (hi OKW!)
I would love to see serious 4v4 with much larger maps where serious team coordination and thinking ahead about territory control is necessary. Where team macro would really shine and micro would be the icing on the cake. The problem there is that then if maps were larger, flanks would be overrewarded. Once half a team got pushed off you would have major problems with VPs ticking down before a comeback could be achieved. Still, all factions have forward reinforce abilities - it might not be THAT bad. 1000 VPs would have to be the norm, games would be much, much longer...Probably an hour to achieve a decisive victory at a minimum.
Posts: 1122
I think he is referring to the axis tank advantage caused by fuel caches.
Topic about abundant resources arises each time 3v3/4v4 discussed, and each time people rising it fatally wrong.
Fuel caches benefit allies more than axis for simple reason if allies manage to pressure and bleed their enemy caches is overall best thing to invest their mp lead into. And if caches will be nerfed, or income nerfed, it would cause exactly opposite effect those people expect it should do.
I think everybody knows that axis, notably OKW can use mp much more efficiently than any other faction, and whole "reduce income" proposal is basically "increase mp income in exchange for delaying tanks". So they want to give axis more mp, and at the same time delay allied tanks which can bleed/push axis from the map, on top of that believing those changes would somehow help allies.
Only resource income which could be reduced in 3v3/4v4 is mp income, but then it very tricky thing to do without hurting USF/UKF progression too much.
Posts: 1595 | Subs: 2
- Map design, must move away from narrow channels
- Volks with Shreks
- Superior Axis armor*
- Halo bonus units
(Wasn't this way until the 2nd round of British nerfs)
Livestreams
110 | |||||
1 | |||||
21 | |||||
8 | |||||
2 | |||||
1 |
Ladders Top 10
-
#Steam AliasWL%Streak
- 1.829222.789+35
- 2.34957.860+14
- 3.587233.716+3
- 4.1095612.641+19
- 5.466189.711+20
- 6.883398.689+5
- 7.999646.607+3
- 8.280162.633+8
- 9.379114.769+1
- 10.300113.726-1
Replay highlight
- cblanco ★
- 보드카 중대
- VonManteuffel
- Heartless Jäger
Board Info
3 posts in the last week
23 posts in the last month
Welcome our newest member, ashleeerowland
Most online: 2043 users on 29 Oct 2023, 01:04 AM