Enough is enough, fix the volks

You know that I veto crossing & trois as OKW? Small map, no flanking possibilities means you will constantly run into HMGS and artillery will cause wipes. I face maxim spam 4/5 times as okw (2vs2+) against sov, simply because most okw players blob schrecks and its extremly effective to spam maxim in order to stop OKW blobs. I don't blob so, I don't have problems with maxim spam, but its effective against blobs, especially combined with Kattyushas.

Believe me when I say you can smoke a schreck blob with a Sherman and just drive in and crush the blob or force it to retreat.


I honestly think that balance problems only occure when you reach a certain skill level and before reaching that certain skill level, better tactics, micro, strategies and coordination will always prevail over balance issues. Brad does a much better job at balancing than relic did in the past. Just look what we get now compared to the past:

-Preview mods
-Response in the forums
-USF became actually viable in every game mode
-Soviet teching fixed
-OKW became competitive
-Brits actually stoppable in late game

Thats why I find your words pretty insulting and completely misplaced.

You are complaining here about small details, missing the whole picture. Schreck blobs were a problem when Volks got insane rec accuracy bonuses in the past. Now they are not a problem any longer, they are just ugly to watch, hence I also support to remove them, but if you lose because of them, its absolutely your fault.

Yea I know it's my fault and anyone else who complains about it. Sometimes I can beat volk blobs and sometimes I can't. No matter the outcome of the match win or lose it always makes me want to play less when I face volk blobs, and that's the problem. They are so anti-fun it sucks the enjoyment of the game right out of people.

Nobody wants to play against that hot garbage, nobody in their right mind says "Nah man this is fun" when they face volk-schreck blobs.

So get Relic to find a good fix that pulls the guts out of the volk-schreck blob issue while still maintaining good competitive play for the OKW faction and it's just fine with me, you won't hear another word about it. But it's not ok to act like the blobs are fine, that they belong, that they should stay.

Fast crushing tanks Fast crushies tanks from merica ?

M10 says hello

Yea I know it's my fault and anyone else who complains about it. Sometimes I can beat volk blobs and sometimes I can't. No matter the outcome of the match win or lose it always makes me want to play less when I face volk blobs, and that's the problem. They are so anti-fun it sucks the enjoyment of the game right out of people.

Nobody wants to play against that hot garbage, nobody in their right mind says "Nah man this is fun" when they face volk-schreck blobs.

So get Relic to find a good fix that pulls the guts out of the volk-schreck blob issue while still maintaining good competitive play for the OKW faction and it's just fine with me, you won't hear another word about it. But it's not ok to act like the blobs are fine, that they belong, that they should stay.

I feel the same way about Riflemen blobs, but are they going ot go away? No. Neither will Volk blobs, that is just the faction design. I find using Volk shrek blobs boring, but it is the most effective strat to use with OKW, just as Rfilemen blobs are most effective strat to use with USF. I know two blobs don't make a right, but both of these faction were built with blobbing in mind.

Buff Volk AI? Check
Resources at 100%? Check
Panzershrek stays the same? Check

It must just be a l2p issue.

MingLee

They made nearly everything cost more.. 120 fuel flak hq....200 fuel panther.. and nerfed starting resources and also made you buy a truck every time you tier up. L2P EleGiggle

Increase popcap to 8 per squad?

reduce schreck/bazookas effective range. watch blobs get wrecked by light vehicles and tanks when schreck hordes try to A move vehicles.

combined arms, smart mine placement and support teams will be the new meta.

What was that about a global upgrade that Brad said?

reduce schreck/bazookas effective range. watch blobs get wrecked by light vehicles and tanks when schreck hordes try to A move vehicles.

combined arms, smart mine placement and support teams will be the new meta.

You are saying that vg's with shreks who are by definition an AT unit cannot do any AT? great going their next time we suggest we cut the dps of the rifles should be reduced in half for similar reasons.

How about using infantry against volks?

-Preview mods
-Response in the forums
USF became actually viable in every game mode
-Soviet teching fixed
-OKW became competitive
-Brits actually stoppable in late game

First soviet teching has become worse,the best part is we killed 2 units(t34-76/su-85) to make viable 1 unit(su-76),we still have too many commanders and many of them are completely unviable,untill those commanders are addressed and those 2 units become viable you cant say its fixed.

Second the british late game was already stoppable,the only man who could not stop it is the same man who relied on the Tiger callin,also you happen not to mention the awful state of the faction(relaying on snipers,emplacements unviable,base artillery garbage,centaur overnerfed,tech churchill overnerfed).

EDIT: lets also not forget werhmachts problem with their commanders

You are saying that vg's with shreks who are by definition an AT unit cannot do any AT? great going their next time we suggest we cut the dps of the rifles should be reduced in half for similar reasons.

How about using infantry against volks?

You do realize they buffed Volk AI right? They will focus fire each of your units down in a matter of seconds if you try to use infantry against them. Volks actually have amazing long range firepower.

You are saying that vg's with shreks who are by definition an AT unit cannot do any AT? great going their next time we suggest we cut the dps of the rifles should be reduced in half for similar reasons.

How about using infantry against volks?

and by ur definition of an AT unit is a unit has anti infantry capabilities, on a durable platform and able to clear garrisons and setup teams efficiently?

vcoh laser guided schrecks and grenadiers anyone? same thing, just different games.

I don't get how people still have problems to deal with schreck blobs. You have enough tools to deal with okw blobbing, demos; mines, HMGs, Calliopes, Kattyusha, Crocs, Priests, better blobs with allied vetted infantry, fast crushing tanks... Really what is the problem? Don't forget that people sacrifice map control with blobbing, another advantage you can exploit.

I'd personally like to see that Schrecks are moved to a new dedicated tank hunter unit in t2 or t3, volks get an AI upgrade instead. But that's just me & that has nothing to do with the fact that its easy to deal with volks blobs.

It's rather the retardedness of volks + endless shrecks (no brainer), THEN supported by 4 LeiGs + Stuka, 2 Flak HQ lockdowns.

Then just spam the best elite infantry in the game until command panther + JT.

How fucking easy is that?

Every army has its cheap strategies that work great. It's a problem that happens in every RTS game. Every time I face soviets, it's Always MG spam or conscript spam with ppsg. Americans, sooner or later, will blob rifles with LT or captain, and you can bet that the pack howie will show up. Ostheer I haven't faced in ages, but it sure will go tiger or CAS.

But, going away from this game, any other RTS is the same thing. It's a problem of the game genre, naturally the players will find out what is abusable, and will abuse it. It's the designer's duty to provide good enough counters to the abuse, that, maybe not so easy to implement, but devastating when it works. The demo charge is maybe one of the best examples.

and by ur definition of an AT unit is a unit has anti infantry capabilities, on a durable platform and able to clear garrisons and setup teams efficiently?

vcoh laser guided schrecks and grenadiers anyone? same thing, just different games.

Yea currently Volks are pound for pound the best all-around infantry in the game.

Great Anti-Vehicle
Great Anti-Infantry
Can clear buildings
Are sturdy and relatively cheap

If they are dedicated Anti-Tank they should only be good at anti-tank with a side bonus of maybe clearing builds or being tough, not all of it at one time.

I don't get how people still have problems to deal with schreck blobs. You have enough tools to deal with okw blobbing, demos; mines, HMGs, Calliopes, Kattyusha, Crocs, Priests, better blobs with allied vetted infantry, fast crushing tanks... Really what is the problem? Don't forget that people sacrifice map control with blobbing, another advantage you can exploit.

How about we just don't want to see a blob steamrolling everything in its path?

as counterable the strategy is, it's still a viable strategy. It was basically THE strategy for okw for the past year and it's still valid strategy in the game currently. If I tried the same strategy with a PIAT blob or Bazooka blob an axis player would just laugh.

The next thing I fear is that a bazooka blob will become a thing if Relic buff it any further. I already saw that one clip of SPrice's bazooka blob wiping a tiger ace.

stop posting and train your gameplay

this is a l2p issue

Yea currently Volks are pound for pound the best all-around infantry in the game.

Great Anti-Vehicle
Great Anti-Infantry
Can clear buildings
Are sturdy and relatively cheap

If they are dedicated Anti-Tank they should only be good at anti-tank with a side bonus of maybe clearing builds or being tough, not all of it at one time.

Great Anti-Vehice: A single Volksschreck squad can be pushed around in order to avoid him shooting the panzerschreck. No at snare means there is nothing to stop your from pushing/crushing. 1 to 1, the schreck is better than the zook, because better penetration & damage. Yet riflemen with a single zook have a better chance soloing early game vehicles because they can snare them and keep shooting their zook. Massed zooks are also dealing decently against tanks, especially when you snare and go for the rear armour.

Great Anti-Infantry: If volks anti infantry capabilities are great, then Riflemen must be super galactic in comparison. No AI upgrade, not even doctrinal. The Kar buffed only changed the fact that allied mainline infantry won't just walk over them with minimal mp bleed.

Can clear buildings: This was added because OKW was not able to clear buildings in the past. No stock flame unit ISG garrison modifiers was only buffed on 3rd December. Molotovs do the same and yet I don't see you praising cons.

Are sturdy and relatively cheap: So they have the worst rec. acc. modiifers on max vet, yet they are sturdy in your opinion. Volks in late game bleed you harder than vetted Obers, Jägers or Sturms; simply because even when vetted they drop often models, while the elite infantry, thanks to rec. acc modifiers has less model drops and hence less reinforcement costs (if you retreat in time).
Now reinforcement costs: Volks 25 mp vs Riflemen/Sections 28 mp vs Grens 30mp vs Cons 20 mp vs Osttruppen 17 mp. I'd call Ostruppen and Cons cheap, not Volks.

Also, no games played as OKW rather make you seem unreasonable and less credible. The grass is always greener on the other side, so I recommend you jump over the fence and try to roll over every opponent with OKW.

First soviet teching has become worse,the best part is we killed 2 units(t34-76/su-85) to make viable 1 unit(su-76),we still have too many commanders and many of them are completely unviable,untill those commanders are addressed and those 2 units become viable you cant say its fixed.

Second the british late game was already stoppable,the only man who could not stop it is the same man who relied on the Tiger callin,also you happen not to mention the awful state of the faction(relaying on snipers,emplacements unviable,base artillery garbage,centaur overnerfed,tech churchill overnerfed).

EDIT: lets also not forget werhmachts problem with their commanders

Brits definitely need some love. I think reducing MP costs for Vickers and tech upgrades would help a lot. I normally always find myself in MP starved situations, where I have a lot of fuel, but not enough MP to buy tanks. Some MP costs are absurd, like the one for the AVRE - 700 mp is definitely too much for 140 fuel unit. Now that sections are dropping models more often you will face more mp bleed, which just worsen the situation. The MP you need to field an AEC is also in no way fair and needs to be decreased dramatically.

However soviet teching is objectively better. You can now access every single unit in a game and not only 1/2 of your unit roster. The only thing I'd change at this point is to make the t34/85 non doctrinal and change the t34/76 to a dual call in in the respective doctrines.

Vanilla Commanders need some love in general.

What I want to emphasize, the game has gotten better since the road map was showed and it will get better.

Great Anti-Vehice: A single Volksschreck squad can be pushed around in order to avoid him shooting the panzerschreck. No at snare means there is nothing to stop your from pushing/crushing. 1 to 1, the schreck is better than the zook, because better penetration & damage. Yet riflemen with a single zook have a better chance soloing early game vehicles because they can snare them and keep shooting their zook. Massed zooks are also dealing decently against tanks, especially when you snare and go for the rear armour.

Great Anti-Infantry: If volks anti infantry capabilities are great, then Riflemen must be super galactic in comparison. No AI upgrade, not even doctrinal. The Kar buffed only changed the fact that allied mainline infantry won't just walk over them with minimal mp bleed.

Can clear buildings: This was added because OKW was not able to clear buildings in the past. No stock flame unit ISG garrison modifiers was only buffed on 3rd December. Molotovs do the same and yet I don't see you praising cons.

Are sturdy and relatively cheap: So they have the worst rec. acc. modiifers on max vet, yet they are sturdy in your opinion. Volks in late game bleed you harder than vetted Obers, Jägers or Sturms; simply because even when vetted they drop often models, while the elite infantry, thanks to rec. acc modifiers has less model drops and hence less reinforcement costs (if you retreat in time).
Now reinforcement costs: Volks 25 mp vs Riflemen/Sections 28 mp vs Grens 30mp vs Cons 20 mp vs Osttruppen 17 mp. I'd call Ostruppen and Cons cheap, not Volks.

Also, no games played as OKW rather make you seem unreasonable and less credible. The grass is always greener on the other side, so I recommend you jump over the fence and try to roll over every opponent with OKW.

please understand the concept of critical mass. nothing is solo about volks. they will be massed. in that mass they have enough dps to engage and match allied infantry in a grinding firefight.