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russian armor

150 fuel panzer 4 increase it's penetration.

12 Dec 2015, 01:36 AM
#101
avatar of Firesparks

Posts: 1930



How about pricing units according to their performance?


there's more to balance then just pricing units according to their performance. I don't think the okw need an amazing pz4 given his other option.

Do the okw really need a medium tank that's on par with the advanced medium tank of the sov and USF? How about just giving them an "average" medium tank with an "average" price?
12 Dec 2015, 01:40 AM
#102
avatar of RedT3rror

Posts: 747 | Subs: 2



How about pricing units according to their performance? This thread is not about making it the best medium tank, its just about increasing its pen so it won't bounce shots against units that are cheaper hence having a chance to win against unit that have the same role, but destroy the p4 in a 1vs1.


How about we remember everything about and around the unit and not just it's "performance" as a some mere weapon stats. What about the Alllied AT? What about the OKW as whole and the synergy with other units? What about doctrinal choices? How does the unit scale at it's appearance and over time with veterancy? How does this unit compare to similiar units (on all the levels which I just named ofc).

It's not just stats.
12 Dec 2015, 08:03 AM
#103
avatar of Iron Emperor

Posts: 1653



How about pricing units according to their performance? This thread is not about making it the best medium tank, its just about increasing its pen so it won't bounce shots against units that are cheaper hence having a chance to win against unit that have the same role, but destroy the p4 in a 1vs1.


Exactly the thought when I made this threat
12 Dec 2015, 08:19 AM
#104
avatar of Nilon

Posts: 68



How about pricing units according to their performance? This thread is not about making it the best medium tank, its just about increasing its pen so it won't bounce shots against units that are cheaper hence having a chance to win against unit that have the same role, but destroy the p4 in a 1vs1.


Wow, there are so many units not priced simulare. Its not only the perfomance in the vacuum. If you think units should be priced according to their performance why i saw you never say ZIS should be cheaper or Pak should cost more, just to mention one example.
12 Dec 2015, 08:23 AM
#105
avatar of pigsoup
Patrion 14

Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2

its called "no-mo-entire-faction-resource-starving-but-only-on-some-units".

get used to it. new p4 might be up or op but this general idea will stay i bet.
12 Dec 2015, 08:48 AM
#106
avatar of AchtAchter

Posts: 1604 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Dec 2015, 08:19 AMNilon


Wow, there are so many units not priced simulare. Its not only the perfomance in the vacuum. If you think units should be priced according to their performance why i saw you never say ZIS should be cheaper or Pak should cost more, just to mention one example.


Make a thread then, if you think this is an issue. I discuss the topic here, if you think other units are UP or OP then please go ahead and the discuss the issue. However it's not an argument to say; "hey, this unit might be too bad for this price, but so is another" - Two wrongs don't make one wright.
12 Dec 2015, 09:08 AM
#107
avatar of Maschinengewehr

Posts: 334



Make a thread then, if you think this is an issue. I discuss the topic here, if you think other units are UP or OP then please go ahead and the discuss the issue. However it's not an argument to say; "hey, this unit might be too bad for this price, but so is another" - Two wrongs don't make one wright.


Generalise all you want, belittle and be an elitist prick all you want, it's irrelevant.

If anything I'd compare the cost of fielding a Wehr P4 compared to the OKW one. If OKW's is more expensive to field (I doubt it) then reduce the cost accordingly. However doing so would mean making it the same as the Wehr P4. After all, is the vet 2 armour as default and better vet bonuses justifed "coz OKW" now? Nope.
12 Dec 2015, 09:10 AM
#108
avatar of Nilon

Posts: 68



Make a thread then, if you think this is an issue. I discuss the topic here, if you think other units are UP or OP then please go ahead and the discuss the issue. However it's not an argument to say; "hey, this unit might be too bad for this price, but so is another" - Two wrongs don't make one wright.


Your claim was, that units have to be balanced around their performance and not the mix of units. I disprove your claim on an example. Why should i make a balance thread for that?
12 Dec 2015, 10:10 AM
#109
avatar of AchtAchter

Posts: 1604 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Dec 2015, 09:10 AMNilon


Your claim was, that units have to be balanced around their performance and not the mix of units. I disprove your claim on an example. Why should i make a balance thread for that?


What did you disprove? Zis gun is too expensive for its perfomance - I agree, it's raketenwerfer & 57mm Tier. What has that to do with OKW P4?

You sound like: "Yes, the OKW P4 is too expensive for what it does, but so is the ZIS - case closed" - I don't see how that justifies anything.



Generalise all you want, belittle and be an elitist prick all you want, it's irrelevant.

If anything I'd compare the cost of fielding a Wehr P4 compared to the OKW one. If OKW's is more expensive to field (I doubt it) then reduce the cost accordingly. However doing so would mean making it the same as the Wehr P4. After all, is the vet 2 armour as default and better vet bonuses justifed "coz OKW" now? Nope.


I'm not here to prove your arguments. Especially when you insult me in your first sentence.
12 Dec 2015, 10:30 AM
#110
avatar of Maschinengewehr

Posts: 334

I'm not here to prove your arguments. Especially when you insult me in your first sentence.


You belittle me in the last few posts. Sorry to disappoint.

I'm here to argue my opinions, not prove them to you.
12 Dec 2015, 10:40 AM
#111
avatar of Iron Emperor

Posts: 1653

Guys keep things nice please.
12 Dec 2015, 11:18 AM
#112
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8



Since when 240 armour (churchill) is better than 234 (okw p4)?

You might want to reword that.


Also kv1 has more armour, more hp and a better gun and still costs less than the p4. At least this thread showed who doesn't care for objective stats.


And that :sibPheasant:

KV-1 pen is 80/100/120.
P4 pen is 100/110/120.

12 Dec 2015, 11:36 AM
#113
avatar of Australian Magic

Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2

Guys keep things nice please.


Emperor for a mod!
12 Dec 2015, 12:07 PM
#114
avatar of Iron Emperor

Posts: 1653



Emperor for a mod!


Kappa
12 Dec 2015, 12:10 PM
#115
avatar of AchtAchter

Posts: 1604 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Dec 2015, 11:18 AMKatitof

You might want to reword that.




And that :sibPheasant:

KV-1 pen is 80/100/120.
P4 pen is 100/110/120.

I stand corrected then. Just did a test between those two tanks on max range, it's ludicrous to observe all the bounced shots. These tanks are so bad for their price tag :snfPeter: but I already made a KV 1 is up thread in October.
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