How is this in any way balanced?

From Relic's September 3rd patch notes:

The ML-20 was doing too much damage per shot for the number of shells it fired. We have decided to reduce the damage. ML-20 Damage reduced from 300 to 160

WTF?!!!!! Damage per shot halved, reduced by a whopping 47% to be precise (rounded up).

And this is Relic's concept of balance 'fine tuning' more than 2 years after the game's release?

You could excuse me for thinking it must be April 1st.

Please discuss.

My view
A COH2 neophyte by self admission, but the other edge of that blade facilitates a fresh faction unbiased or pre-conditioned perspective. I came to this game only a few days prior to that weekend, but from an lengthy and extensive background of playing RTS including > 8 years of COH1.

To say I was underwhelmed by this now rendered totally ineffective doctrinal onboard arty would be understatment. A DLC spud gun for the Soviets for $3.99 would be more useful and better value. <sarcasm> As if the various Sturmovik abilities weren't superficial eye candy enough! Appears Relic is working its way through the Soviet nerf alphabet and has gotten to "S"!

Utterly abysmal when by way of contrasting extreme, OKW's über le.IG 18 consistently one shots an expensive full health Shock squad in green cover, and the Brit Bofors annihilates multiple entire infantry squads in an instant after the "T" key is pressed but before the game actions a retreat, who should they in a moment's diverted inattention to manually babysitting them from waypoint to waypoint be subject to the misfortune that the game's innane pathing blunders them into a path within the Bofors extreme range -and saving the best until last, are both OP eclipsed by Ostheer's erdrückende Übermacht generally.

You are a little late buddy they already buffed it up to 200. Go read the the changelogs for the next patch.

Props for the eloquence though.

A DLC spud gun for the Soviets

get the Advanced Warfare commander with the conscript PPSH if that's what you want

Anyway, the ML-20 damage is being increased with the balance preview. We'll see if 200 is adequate or not.
(conscript PPSH is also being buffed to not be a spudgun which ruins my joke )

Relic's way of balancing is infuriating

Nerfing damage one patch, then buffing it the next...

Changelog addendum noted. Regardless, even retro-buffed 40 points to 200 is still a radical nerf, hardly 'fine tuning'.

IMV the ML-20 needs to inflict that 300 damage if per chance it ever hits a movable target. Because unless said target is a structure or the shoot so well timed as to hit squads retreated to base during those few moments after arrival before all members have arrived that they can be recovered from retreat status and moved, by the time the projectile arrives anywhere else, anything movable has long left the scene of the crime for any player not totally devoid of SA.

Advanced Warfare commander with the conscript PPSH

AWC = Soviet "spud gun". ...good one.

conscript PPSH is also being buffed to not be a spudgun

Will go and check by how much shortly, but IMRE thus far, a serious generic PPsh buff is sorely needed with Soviets so reliant otherwise upon selecting a Shock or Guards doctrinal commander just to counter Ostheer's default configurable infantry versatility and availability. Right now PPsh pgraded Cons are just beyond sad, not worth upgrading providing zero scalability which means mandatory doctrinal inf commander on any 1v1 auto map which facilitates Ostheer stalling for armour -most of them, with limited deselection.

Changelog addendum noted. Regardless, even retro-buffed 40 points to 200 is still a radical nerf, hardly 'fine tuning'.

IMV the ML-20 needs to inflict that 300 damage if per chance it ever hits a movable target. Because unless said target is a structure or the shoot so well timed as to hit squads retreated to base during those few moments after arrival before all members have arrived that they can be recovered from retreat status and moved, by the time the projectile arrives anywhere else, anything movable has long left the scene of the crime for any player not totally devoid of SA.

That is such a great idea.Reducing damage vs structures but not vs infantry/armor so it doesn't hard counter OKW quite so much but it still retains a sort of useful role

200 still is a too radical nerf. Agreed.

FFS people this only affects tanks and okw trucks. against infantry the ml20 is still a fine weapon to use.

FFS people this only affects tanks and okw trucks. against infantry the ml20 is still a fine weapon to use.

No it doesnt. The kill radius of infantry for the ml-20 was almost halved. It was like 5.4 meters, now its 3.1 meters.


In comparison , the kill radius of the LEfh is 4 meters.


So even with 200 damage, ml-20 will still be less lethal againts infantry because of less fired sheels, less AOE, and slower rate of fire.

No it doesnt. The kill radius of infantry for the ml-20 was almost halved. It was like 5.4 meters, now its 3.1 meters.


In comparison , the kill radius of the LEfh is 4 meters.


So even with 200 damage, ml-20 will still be less lethal againts infantry because of less fired sheels, less AOE, and slower rate of fire.

WTF that too?!

No it doesnt. The kill radius of infantry for the ml-20 was almost halved. It was like 5.4 meters, now its 3.1 meters.


In comparison , the kill radius of the LEfh is 4 meters.


So even with 200 damage, ml-20 will still be less lethal againts infantry because of less fired sheels, less AOE, and slower rate of fire.

It doesn't matter it will still kill 4 man squads left and right.

It doesn't matter it will still kill 4 man squads left and right.

It doesn't. That's precisely the problem now. With no previous experience of it, given its spiel a devastating rain upon infantry was pretty much what I expected of it. What I got was a sprinkle. Now it just makes a noise and little else.

I like Woodstock's idea if it was a IMBA issue vs OKW.

It doesn't matter it will still kill 4 man squads left and right.

except it wont, because it will never get built again

I would have much prefered a shot reduction from 8 to 6; to keep the ml-20 hard-hitting but with low number of shots. Meanwhile keeping the LeFH at 10 shots for less hard-hitting damage but more area denial.

Wow okay that makes sense.

I didn't realize they halved the radius.

I had one built on the ridge on one of the new maps, and I shit you not, it was firing non stop the entire game and ended up with.... 11 kills.

I couldn't figure out wtf was going on because I knew the damaged had been nerfed but didn't realize the explosion radius was too.

Honestly it iS COMPLETELY USELESS AGAIN.

Hooray Gj Relic!

except it wont, because it will never get built again

good! the less one shot BS the better

Wow okay that makes sense.

I didn't realize they halved the radius.

I had one built on the ridge on one of the new maps, and I shit you not, it was firing non stop the entire game and ended up with.... 11 kills.

I couldn't figure out wtf was going on because I knew the damaged had been nerfed but didn't realize the explosion radius was too.

Honestly it iS COMPLETELY USELESS AGAIN.

Hooray Gj Relic!

The didnt change the aoe. the kill radius got reduced and that infantry that gets caught in the aoe are now wounded instead of killed.

I can't see how these kind of nerfs are not due to bad understanding. Which makes me suspect it will never again be a good unit. I guess it was pure luck we had a short period of the game's life when ml-20 was performing as could be expected (a bit too strong, sure, but preferable to useless). RIP soviet arty.

On top of it, like mentioned, sturmovik does nothing and Penals have a marginal role.

200 is good, I don't know why they went as low as 160 and them buffed it again (#JUSTRELIKTHINGS)

Anyway, now with this nerf they should also lower its price, and maybe popcap. Same goes for LeFH.