Double T34/85s and PrettyEasy Eight

~Call in meta~

If call in's were tied to teching it would be fine.

Wehr teching fix + call in's tied to teching would help fix a lot of things. But call in's being tied to teching alone would help Ostheer by making T4 more attractive and forcing Soviets and USF to tech in order to call in late game units.

lol, you put the "L2ADAPT" thing in a new level man hohohohoho, what a troll. first it was callins tied, but then, a mate in this thread shows the flaws in that sentence...then Alex adapt to it....

lol....

make a blog Alex...

Ez8 suck vs infantry man

T34/85 in my experience on countering them ,are weak against panthers but a beast against infantry. 4 men squads are easy for them to wipe.

E8 should be buffed to 800hp.

This call-in meta is partially our own doing. Back in the alpha/beta, all call-in units simply replaced existing buildable units or were added as new options. Mortar-HT was built from T2, Tiger from T4, IS-2 from T3, T-34/85 replaced T-34/76, etc.
But people wanted the doctrinal units to work like in CoH1, as call-ins, since it would allow people to go T4 and still get an IS-2. More diversity is good.
But since the call-ins still cost fuel, it is now, in most cases, better to simply wait for the call-in unlock than actually teching

This call-in meta is partially our own doing. Back in the alpha/beta, all call-in units simply replaced existing buildable units or were added as new options. Mortar-HT was built from T2, Tiger from T4, IS-2 from T3, T-34/85 replaced T-34/76, etc.
But people wanted the doctrinal units to work like in CoH1, as call-ins, since it would allow people to go T4 and still get an IS-2. More diversity is good.
But since the call-ins still cost fuel, it is now, in most cases, better to simply wait for the call-in unlock than actually teching

see, replacing stock units is a bad idea, being tied to tiers is not necessarily (i 100% trust relic to screw it up; you got this bros)

Well, players would not abuse the call in Tanks if the Allies had stock T-34/85s, IS2s or Ez8s. The simple fact is Axis has stock Panthers and King Tigers which eat up T-34s and Shermans.

T3485s are scary in combination with Mark vehicle.

The only problem is design faction difference between EFA vs WFA.

E8 should be buffed to 800hp.

Yeah just cause. They super UP.

The rifle company is the "real" only good doctrine. All other are crap, except the Priest one in 4v4 artyfest.

The rifle company is the "real" only good doctrine. All other are crap, except the Priest one in 4v4 artyfest.

lol no.

Because double M191911 para's combined with P47 skill planes is still the most unused automatch default usf doctrine as of late right?

Rifle company are for noobs who rely on early vet rifleman to win an already easy usf early game, just for them to whine when their EZ8 spam looses to a decently microed axis player.

Fix the call in meta.

Well, players would not abuse the call in Tanks if the Allies had stock T-34/85s, IS2s or Ez8s. The simple fact is Axis has stock Panthers and King Tigers which eat up T-34s and Shermans.

Stock units would be more expensive, and less used. I don't think you understand how much fuel investment there is for OKW or Ostheer to acquire said tanks such as Panthers and KT's.

It's better for Allies for the 85's, Ez8's and IS2's to be call in's, as it makes them cheaper.

A OKW Panther is worth as much as an IS2;

Unadjusted: 175 + 80 = 255

Adjusted: (175/.66)+(80/.66)= 386.

Stock units would be more expensive, and less used. I don't think you understand how much fuel investment there is for OKW or Ostheer to acquire said tanks such as Panthers and KT's.

It's better for Allies for the 85's, Ez8's and IS2's to be call in's, as it makes them cheaper.

A OKW Panther is worth as much as an IS2;

Unadjusted: 175 + 80 = 255

Adjusted: (175/.66)+(80/.66)= 386.

With proper map control okw does get panthers at the 15 minute mark if they focus on it. Real fuel price is a factor, but timing in which the the first unit comes out is also very important.

With proper map control okw does get panthers at the 15 minute mark if they focus on it. Real fuel price is a factor, but timing in which the the first unit comes out is also very important.

Ofc, but getting 1 Panther at 15 then basically no armor for a long, long time is fairly is still a fairly big handicap.

1 Panther isn't going to stop 2 85's or an IS2. With Ost your paying out of the ass for teching costs even more.

More allies nerf with such arguments more Axis buffs

Stock units would be more expensive, and less used. I don't think you understand how much fuel investment there is for OKW or Ostheer to acquire said tanks such as Panthers and KT's.

It's better for Allies for the 85's, Ez8's and IS2's to be call in's, as it makes them cheaper.

A OKW Panther is worth as much as an IS2;

Unadjusted: 175 + 80 = 255

Adjusted: (175/.66)+(80/.66)= 386.

Wrong, 80 fuel is already adjusted from 120. You gonna ask me, how do I know that, well it's the cheapest T4, with most powerful units and insane flak so high price is justified, yet it's the cheapest, why? Because it's adjusted. Just like LMG.

Ofc, but getting 1 Panther at 15 then basically no armor for a long, long time is fairly is still a fairly big handicap.

1 Panther isn't going to stop 2 85's or an IS2. With Ost your paying out of the ass for teching costs even more.

Wrong, I ve stopped 4 T34/85 (2 and 2, not 4 at once) with 1 Panther, mines and AT gun.

Wrong, 80 fuel is already adjusted from 120. You gonna ask me, how do I know that, well it's the cheapest T4, with most powerful units and insane flak so high price is justified, yet it's the cheapest, why? Because it's adjusted. Just like LMG.



Wrong, I ve stopped 4 T34/85 (2 and 2, not 4 at once) with 1 Panther, mines and AT gun.

It's not the cheapest A. because of said fuel penalty, it costs the same as Soviet T4 (meaning it can be build around the same time) B. I doubt you have ever used the Sturmtiger, and the Luchs and Panther are not unbeatable and C. The flak isn't insane at all, it got a pen nerf against mediums a while ago it just does good DPS.

Ah yes you stopped 2 T34/85's with a Panther and support, but this has little indication of the real capability of the Panther versus two T34/85's alone. I doubt the Soviet player was supporting his 85's either, shameful display.

Remember when 85s were never ever used and sucked. How things changed. Even back then Guards motor was heavily used lol!


Now its the best call in in the game.

What I notice is that in CoH1 call ins were used to supplement teching instead of replacing it. Someone mentioned earlier that the StuH and Tiger came without fuel, but they were appropriately timed to come in at times where normal tanks of equal calibre would also come. The StuH was a great mid game anti infantry tank, but did not possess squad wiping abilities and was not overly strong (allied AT guns would 3 shot it).

Even with only costing manpower, axis call-ins did not break the game. Getting a Tiger late game was very expensive on manpower and was slow (no Blitzkrieg ability on the tank, instead have to wait for 125 munitions ability which takes even longer) and was vulnerable (no smoke to protect you if you mess up your defense) to flanks from riflemen, AT guns, and M10 swarms. Furthermore, only wehrmacht possessed decent call-ins. The PE call ins (Hetzer, Wirbel) were merely support vehicles that died to AT guns and allied tanks easily. Allies also seemed to do fine without ALL HAVING SUPER TANKS. It amazes me how potent Americans could be late game against wehrmacht who had big tanks and vet, while the americans only possessed medium tanks, arty, and infantry.

What I see in CoH2 is an abundance of super expensive call-in tanks that are WAY better than any tanks you can build. Why on earth would I ever build a T34 as Soviets when it's a giant waste of fuel? Simply just wait for the better 85 variant or the super IS2. Why would I ever tech to Panther as Ostheer when it means I can never get a Tiger? I just wish that there was something that could be done that made call in tanks supplement teching to fill in gaps in unit compositions as they did in CoH1, instead of simply making teching obsolete by having call in tanks dominate the performance of buildable tanks. The exception to this is of course OKW who appart from the P4 and Jagdtiger call in have no decent call in tanks and are always forced to go Panther or KT in order to defeat the call ins from the Soviets...

Soviets can't tech because they have call ins, and OKW can't tech to anything other than the Panther/KT to counter the call ins. Those are the underlying reasons why I think the 1v1 meta is pretty boring. Granted I have seen some diversity in the doctrine choice for American and Soviets, but for Soviets it's always "which doctrine will I pick to get late game tanks so I can sit in T1 all game", and american is just "which doctrine will I pick to spend my munitions to end this game quickly before I lose to Panthers"... Granted also, Ostheer has some doctrine viability... but from what I've seen its mechanized assault (no need to tech past T2), the other tiger docs (no need to tech past T2), close air support (from what I've seen Korean Army do, you can sit T2 all game and use planes to defeat tech), and Tiger Ace doctrine (granted allows some teching since it's manpower only, but how is the Tiger Ace supposed to defeat the endless call in potential of T34/85 and IS2 when you're limited to 1 tank late game)...

Also... can someone explain to me why OKW has income reduced? In CoH1 the British who also possessed trucks actually received INCREASED income. Combined with the income decrease and large tank fuel costs playing OKW means you can get like 3 different vehicles max every game, depending on how long it goes. Wouldn't it make more sense to have then have a normal income and just adjust the cost of vechiles and upgrades?

The StuH was a great mid game anti infantry tank, but did not possess squad wiping abilities and was not overly strong (allied AT guns would 3 shot it).

Well, neither did most call-ins in CoH2 aside from a few ridiculous examples (ISU-152, please stop this, it's just silly) until about six months ago

I MISS THAT SO FUCKING MUCH